Congress says some UFOs have a non-human origin.

[techrat]

Exactly... When they say "non human" that could be anything.
That could mean Dolphins.
Dolphins have spacecraft capable of making right angle turns at high speeds, right?
I mean, that's as plausible as space aliens. Maybe even *more* plausible, because we know that Dolphins exist, whereas we have nothing that proves that space aliens do.

 

[smstachwick]

For anyone curious, the picture is from the Doctor Who revival.

 

[Zbench]

Exactly... When they say "non human" that could be anything.
That could mean Dolphins.
Dolphins have spacecraft capable of making right angle turns at high speeds, right?
I mean, that's as plausible as space aliens. Maybe even *more* plausible, because we know that Dolphins exist, whereas we have nothing that proves that space aliens do.

I don’t understand your point. Are you saying that all the things that have been captured over the years on video and camera are all not real because we don’t know what they are? Having been a military officer I can tell you first hand that an officer’s integrity is the most important thing in the world. Seems to me we had two guys that were willing to take the stand and testify about what they saw under penalty of perjury in front of the entire world. Are they making it up? If not, then what is it? Seems to me a black cube inside a clear envelope is not some unexplained atmospheric phenomenon. Nor in the estimation of the intelligence community is it a threat actor. So what’s left?

I can’t wrap my mind around the notion that because I don’t know what it is, it’s not real. Did ancient man who didn’t understand lightning run around outside in a thunderstorm ignoring the lightning because it wasn’t real? I can’t reconcile your logic.

 

[prfesser]

I don’t understand your point. Are you saying that all the things that have been captured over the years on video and camera are all not real because we don’t know what they are? Having been a military officer I can tell you first hand that an officer’s integrity is the most important thing in the world. Seems to me we had two guys that were willing to take the stand and testify about what they saw under penalty of perjury in front of the entire world. Are they making it up? If not, then what is it? Seems to me a black cube inside a clear envelope is not some unexplained atmospheric phenomenon. Nor in the estimation of the intelligence community is it a threat actor. So what’s left?

I can’t wrap my mind around the notion that because I don’t know what it is, it’s not real. Did ancient man who didn’t understand lightning run around outside in a thunderstorm ignoring the lightning because it wasn’t real? I can’t reconcile your logic.

What's left is "We don't know (yet)." That is a perfectly acceptable answer in science.

But just because we don't know, does not mean "Aliens!" or "Gods!" or "Bigfoot!" or anything similar. Those are beliefs, not conclusions. "We don't know" means exactly that. "You don't know, so my belief must be correct" is not valid.

 

[jderimig]

How can we be sure that these observations are not of future time traveler tourists? If I was living in the future this would be a good time to travel back to and see what is was like around the time we blew up the world.

 

[Zbench]

What's left is "We don't know (yet)." That is a perfectly acceptable answer in science.

But just because we don't know, does not mean "Aliens!" or "Gods!" or "Bigfoot!" or anything similar. Those are beliefs, not conclusions. "We don't know" means exactly that. "You don't know, so my belief must be correct" is not valid.

Don’t disagree a bit. But you can look at the facts and make some informed theories about what it could be. Instead of just saying don’t know, maybe someday we will.

 

[techrat]

I can’t wrap my mind around the notion that because I don’t know what it is, it’s not real.

I can't understand that either because that's NOT what I said. But that's your interpretation of what I said (apparently).
We have no proof positive of alien beings. What the folks under oath said was "non-human biologics", which can mean ANYTHING. It's so non-specific that your imagination is filling in the blanks. If I make an internet post that claims that "World Changing Event Happens!" do you know specifically what I'm talking about?

Non Human Biologics can mean Dolphins. That's what I said. And Dolphins are more plausible operating the craft we've "seen" on blurry, non-specific, undetailed, images. Maybe what they've captured on radar there is a Sharknado, which can make 90 turns without banking. That's plausible too and also has a non-human origin. Because Sharks.

 

[Marc_G]

What I haven't seen a good analysis of yet, and would enjoy reading up on, is:

Obeying laws of physics as we have understood them, and operating at the limit of our technological capability, while not being constrained by economic realities, what's the best we could do in terms of interstellar travel, for each decade starting 1960.

Ok, 1960 we had the tech capabilities to get to orbit and that's about it.

By 1970 we had the ability to get to the moon, probes to other planets if one wasn't finance limited. By 1980 we had the tech to get probes to most planets and just barely to send a probe that would eventually leave the solar system, at a very slow speed.

And so on. If not finance limited, by today I imagine we have the tech knowhow (but, clearly not the experience) to craft a robot probe that could accelerate out of the solar system at a good clip, maybe a percent of light speed, get to someplace in a few hundred years, and decelerate sufficiently to deploy a probe that would be capable of landing on a planet while sending back telemetry to the mothership. To residents of that planet, such a probe would probably appear to crash land.

Anyway, we are not at the point to send little pink/brown/yellow etc. men/women to visit other worlds, but we have the basic tech understanding to send something somewhere, if we prioritized such a venture.

I find it not unreasonable that we could have been visited in such a manner. Still, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. Until it lands, is verified, and is out in the Smithsonian, I'm sittin' back skeptically.

 

[Art Upton]

How can we be sure that these observations are not of future time traveler tourists? If I was living in the future this would be a good time to travel back to and see what is was like around the time we blew up the world.

But they could cause "Time Quakes" and spread the ripple thru the time line?

 

[Art Upton]

I can't understand that either because that's NOT what I said. But that's your interpretation of what I said (apparently).
We have no proof positive of alien beings. What the folks under oath said was "non-human biologics", which can mean ANYTHING. It's so non-specific that your imagination is filling in the blanks. If I make an internet post that claims that "World Changing Event Happens!" do you know specifically what I'm talking about?

Non Human Biologics can mean Dolphins. That's what I said. And Dolphins are more plausible operating the craft we've "seen" on blurry, non-specific, undetailed, images. Maybe what they've captured on radar there is a Sharknado, which can make 90 turns without banking. That's plausible too and also has a non-human origin. Because Sharks.

They are now into Cocaine Sharks causing Sharknados, Discovery on Wednesday night next week.

 

[Marc_G]

But they could cause "Time Quacks" and spread the ripple thru the time line?

Time quacks!

What was that book/movie? MILLENNIUM? Something like that? Visitors from. The future rescuing people about to die in plane crashes, to repopulate us down the time line, while avoiding time quakes?

 

[Art Upton]

Exactly... When they say "non human" that could be anything.

Beamed up stolen COWS while the craft was driven by AI?

 

[Dotini]

Beamed up stolen COWS while the craft was driven by AI?

I agree "non-human" can and does mean many things other than biological aliens from another planet. It may be the alien myth is a justified limited hangout. Maybe the reality is too "complicated" for the average human to get a grip on and still continue to function productively.

 

[Zbench]

Non Human Biologics can mean Dolphins. That's what I said. And Dolphins are more plausible operating the craft we've "seen" on blurry, non-specific, undetailed, images. Maybe what they've captured on radar there is a Sharknado, which can make 90 turns without banking. That's plausible too and also has a non-human origin. Because Sharks.

You’re being ridiculous and it’s hard to have a real conversation with this sort of thing.

Some facts. As far back as 1961 Betty and Barney hill reported being abducted by what we now call Gray Aliens. Literally millions of other people report similar experiences. Of those millions some report creatures that look like reptiles (reptilians), humans that look like Nordics, Praying Mantid type creatures (Insectilins) and even taller versions of the ubiquitous Gray Aliens among others.

None have reported being abducted by Dolphins or seeing anything that looks like a Dolphin flying or being observed in or around a UAP.

Further, there are no reports of dolphins creating and using technology.

Finally, dolphins, while quite smart, do not possess opposable thumbs or even hands which most anthropologists point to as the main reason for the rise of Homo sapiens and our ability to create and evolve technology.

So no, it couldn’t be Dolphins. It could however be any of the things I mentioned above, along with other things that have not yet been seen to include perhaps things which have no form. But it’s definitely not Dolphins.

 

[jderimig]

It could be future evolutionary descendants of Dolphins time traveling back to now. The total weight of current documented evidence (none) makes that possibility as likely as any other hypothesis.

 

[kuririn]

I like the dinosaur theory.
Bipedal, grasping hands.

 

[rcktnut]

I got a kick out of that one guy explaining that they have some biologics. When asked if he seen them, he said no someone told him about them. All a bunch of BS until they are shown and confirmed.

 

[techrat]

Obeying laws of physics as we have understood them, and operating at the limit of our technological capability, while not being constrained by economic realities, what's the best we could do in terms of interstellar travel, for each decade starting 1960.

In the late 60's early 70's the US Air Force proposed a space battleship that would be propelled by nuclear bombs and was theoretically capable of taking us to Saturn. That's if money was no object because this thing would have cost a trillion bucks. Look up Project Orion.

 

[techrat]

I got a kick out of that one guy explaining that they have some biologics. When asked if he seen them, he said no someone told him about them.

So, an implausible story with absolutely no proof.

For those of you who have never seen the movie CONTACT, the film explores the crossroads between science and religion, where a young atsrophysisct makes contact with potential alien life, they create a machine to travel to the aliens, and when the trip is over the lone astronaut who travlled to meet the aliens has no proof whatsoever that she met them, and the whole thing is called a big hoax because from the viewpoint of NASA and everyone else, she simply fell through the machine and didn't enter a wormhole as she had experienced.

In essense, the main character, who dismissed religion as scientifically implausable, has herself a religious experience, and like proving the existence of god, has nothing to back up her claims.

But I stand by my claim that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
If you're going to say that UAPs are alien spaceships, then we need to see one. And like, right in the middle of Central Park NYC. A blurry radar image of what might be ball lighting or some other plasma isn't proof of anything other than our imaging systems are ****.

 

[jderimig]

If you're going to say that UAPs are alien spaceships, then we need to see one. And like, right in the middle of Central Park NYC. A blurry radar image of what might be ball lighting or some other plasma isn't proof of anything other than our imaging systems are ****.

Aliens have technology that makes our crude image capture devices only render blurry images. Same tech that Bigfoot has.

 

[kuririn]

It could however be any of the things I mentioned above, along with other things that have not yet been seen to include perhaps things which have no form.

Could even be something as simple as a Chinese spy balloon.

 

[Zbench]

It could be future evolutionary descendants of Dolphins time traveling back to now. The total weight of current documented evidence (none) makes that possibility as likely as any other hypothesis.

I must have missed the sworn testimony yesterday about the alien dolphins. I’ll have to rewatch.

So, an implausible story with absolutely no proof.

For those of you who have never seen the movie CONTACT, the film explores the crossroads between science and religion, where a young atsrophysisct makes contact with potential alien life, they create a machine to travel to the aliens, and when the trip is over the lone astronaut who travlled to meet the aliens has no proof whatsoever that she met them, and the whole thing is called a big hoax because from the viewpoint of NASA and everyone else, she simply fell through the machine and didn't enter a wormhole as she had experienced.

In essense, the main character, who dismissed religion as scientifically implausable, has herself a religious experience, and like proving the existence of god, has nothing to back up her claims.

But I stand by my claim that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
If you're going to say that UAPs are alien spaceships, then we need to see one. And like, right in the middle of Central Park NYC. A blurry radar image of what might be ball lighting or some other plasma isn't proof of anything other than our imaging systems are ****.

Stay tuned Cochise. Took 80 years to create this tangled web. It’s not going to come crashing down after one Congressional hearing.

The most interesting thing to me is that Grusch wanted to go into a SCIF so he could discuss classified information, and the intelligence community and Congressional Leadership refused to let that happen. So if it’s one man’s pipe dream, why not let him continue to confabulate? Unless of course they don’t want the material to come out of course.

 

[jderimig]

I must have missed the sworn testimony yesterday about the alien dolphins. I’ll have to rewatch.

Yes! Watch the part where Grush swore someone told him stuff.

 

[rocket_troy]

Aliens have technology that makes our crude image capture devices only render blurry images. Same tech that Bigfoot has.

Apparently, Disney have developed tech to sharpen such imagery.

TP

 

[Zbench]

Yes! Watch the part where Grush swore someone told him stuff.

Which he wanted to expand on, but couldn't because he was denied the secure facility to do it. Further, that doesn't have anything to do with Dophins.

 

[Dotini]

In essense, the main character, who dismissed religion as scientifically implausable, has herself a religious experience, and like proving the existence of god, has nothing to back up her claims.

It's been said by philosophers that the purpose and meaning of life is to have experiences.

 

[jderimig]

Which he wanted to expand on, but couldn't because he was denied the secure facility to do it. Further, that doesn't have anything to do with Dophins.

Americans can be so gullible.
Why would the US military give Grusch and the "whistleblowers" the greenlight to leak this stuff? You think this is for American consumption? Really? Think about it.

 

[Art Upton]

I like the dinosaur theory.
Bipedal, grasping hands.

Scientists now say Dinos were Birds not reptiles

 

[Zbench]

Americans can be so gullible.
Why would the US military give Grusch and the "whistleblowers" the greenlight to leak this stuff? You think this is for American consumption? Really? Think about it.

He’s not leaking it. He has claimed violations of the whistleblower statue claiming threats, intimidation and worse. Just like in a court case where there is legal discovery, the government is obligated by statue to allow him to tell his tale. Part of that tale is the material which substantiates the claims of intimidation and reprisal. I have thought about it. Have you?

 

[rcktnut]

Aliens have technology that makes our crude image capture devices only render blurry images. Same tech that Bigfoot has.

..................and the Loch Ness Monster.