AeroTech Open Thread

[ATGM]

Yup- that was me... I can't wait for the motor to come out for sale!

More importantly, I was impressed with how fast AT reacted with the DMS motor cato issue at MWP. As someone who works (tangentially) on quality processes in my day job, this was a very quick analysis and response.

Thanks! I hate it when stuff like that happens to a flyer so I like to get it addressed as soon as possible.

 

[ATGM]

I am thinking that Aerotech may be trying to "nudge" people back to single-use DMS motors, now that BATFE no longer regulates APCP.

Nope. DMS (we build it) require more labor and are therefore less profitable than RMS (you build it). It makes zero sense to do that from our standpoint.

What you do see is a lot of newer flyers pick them up especially for cert purposes. Colleges and groups who need to certify 15 or 30 at a time choose DMS. There will be both new RMS and DMS super white lightning motors in 2019. But there is no conspiracy, as exciting as that would be.

 

[ATGM]

Certification expired (the CE mark) and nobody wants to foot the bill for re-certification. So new motors cannot be sold 'legally', only old ones pre 2017 that still have the old certification mark.
cheers
RG

Correct, we are in the process of getting the CE mark granted again. Until that time, only pre-2017 is acceptable.

 

[BradMilkomeda]

Did reload prices just go up again?

 

[Eric]

Yes, seems like 15%-20%. I think it happened in October.

 

[BradMilkomeda]

Is there a link to an updated Motor Data Sheet with the new prices?

 

[tim cubbedge]

Is there a link to an updated Motor Data Sheet with the new prices?

Dated 10/31/2018
I think AT went up 10% & CTI went up ~18%
https://www.aerotech-rocketry.com/u...be0-d5427ef0e1c2_Model_and_hp_of_10_29_18.pdf

 

[dshmel]

Yes, seems like 15%-20%. I think it happened in October.

RMS 29/240 went up 23%. Most other sizes went up much less percentage-wise. 38mm and 54mm reloads went up 5-13%, depending on size and propellant type. A few flavors actually went down. For instance, 75/2560 reloads went from $159 to $149 for a 5.7% decrease. 75/3840 went up 8%.

 

[Ez2cDave]

Did reload prices just go up again?

Of course, they did . . .

 

[BayouRat]

Yes, and just wait till you try to buy HARDWARE! OMG!

 

[blackjack2564]

But there is no conspiracy, as exciting as that would be.

Come on Charlie.... you are the man behind the curtain...we all know that!

 

[crossfire]

AT needs money to replace all they spent on getting the low power motors to market. Looks like the HP flyers will need help foot the bill for it. The hardware now that I still can't understand. There are other motor makers out there and I hope a new one on its way soon.

 

[Maxitout]

Yeah, I just looked at the new price list, too. There is a pretty big jump in the smaller motors, I also noticed that that are NO KBA motors offered.
I can still use my AMW 76/7600 case with a hubcap for the CTI reloads, but after I burn the 2 KBA 54-2550 loads that I have, what do I do with the case? Sigh.....

Phil L.

 

[Steve Shannon]

Yeah, I just looked at the new price list, too. There is a pretty big jump in the smaller motors, I also noticed that that are NO KBA motors offered.
I can still use my AMW 76/7600 case with a hubcap for the CTI reloads, but after I burn the 2 KBA 54-2550 loads that I have, what do I do with the case? Sigh.....

Phil L.

Sell it. That’s a nice size for research.

 

[Donaldsrockets]

$19.99 for a 29/40-120 G53, G64, G76, ouch!!!

I remember back when G64's were about 10 bucks a shot.

 

[3stoogesrocketry]

I can still use my AMW 76/7600 case with a hubcap for the CTI reloads, but after I burn the 2 KBA 54-2550 loads that I have, what do I do with the case? Sigh.....

Phil L.

Burn a few Brand L motors in the 2550. The L1400 is my personal favorite for that case.

 

[blackjack2564]

I remember gas when it was 35 cents [1968]...lol

 

[rcktnut]

AT needs money to replace all they spent on getting the low power motors to market. Looks like the HP flyers will need help foot the bill for it. The hardware now that I still can't understand. There are other motor makers out there and I hope a new one on its way soon.

No way. For almost /maybe all, the smaller motors cost more per Ns than the bigger ones of the same propellant. That is reloads and single use. The winners for the most expensive cost per Ns are the Econo jets. $0.37 per Ns. They have to rename those. Like wise a K535 DMS goes for $0.15 per Ns. G64's go for $0.16 a Ns a K550 $0.08 per Ns. M1297 $0.05 per Ns I used to fly a lot of Econojets no more though. Don't understand why they are so high priced now: 2 F20's for $44.99, they can keep them.

 

[Normzilla]

Screw that, I'm a huge fan of those f67's.

Expensive? Maybe, but I wont stop flying what makes me smile.

 

[Andrew_ASC]

I just bought a used full set of 38-720 hardware. Sorry Aerotech if you want people to buy new hardware then please please keep up production levels. Oh I’m waiting on a replacement 38-240 casing complete set also to replace the new one I lost in Tampa this year.

You’ve got to go to
Three or four vendors to scrounge pieces for hardware to get a complete set right now from pieces. None of the vendors seem to have a complete set in stock.

 

[gldknght]

I just bought a used full set of 38-720 hardware. Sorry Aerotech if you want people to buy new hardware then please please keep up production levels. Oh I’m waiting on a replacement 38-240 casing complete set also to replace the new one I lost in Tampa this year.

You’ve got to go to
Three or four vendors to scrounge pieces for hardware to get a complete set right now from pieces. None of the vendors seem to have a complete set in stock.

Yep! This is why I bought hardware from that other manufacturer during Wildman's annual sale this year. I got tired of the lack of availability of Aerotech hardware.

 

[gjrockets]

$19.99 for a 29/40-120 G53, G64, G76, ouch!!!

I remember back when G64's were about 10 bucks a shot.

So do I. But that's only because I've been in HPR for 25 years! You don't buy them for awhile and when you buy them again you ask yourself "What happened here?!"

 

[WILDMANRS]

Guys we have almost everything in stock now.
29 ras is the last one that we have on back order I believe

 

[tim cubbedge]

Guys we have almost everything in stock now.
29 ras is the last one that we have on back order I believe

Hardware included?

 

[solid_fuel]

So do I. But that's only because I've been in HPR for 25 years! You don't buy them for awhile and when you buy them again you ask yourself "What happened here?!"

If I recall correctly 29/40-120 G reloads are $12 and change for Wildman club members.

 

[DAllen]

Lending more evidence to me that the big vendors are getting the red carpet treatment and the little guys are getting kicked to the curb.

Talked to Jay at Impulse Buys a week and a half ago and he still has AT stuff back-ordered months and months out. That's especially frustrating for me because he is now the only vendor thats going to show up to Three Oaks every month and I will not be able to do any sort of special order with him because he doesn't know if he'll ever get it in stock. I'm stuck with whatever he has already in inventory or buy from someone else and pay hazmat to have it shipped. I'd really like to support Jay because he's taking the time to come out to our launches but AT ain't making it easy. Oh well, guess that's how business is run. I could yell and holler about it but I doubt anyone will listen unless I spend thousands and thousands a year...

 

[DeltaVee]

Lending more evidence to me that the big vendors are getting the red carpet treatment and the little guys are getting kicked to the curb.


Talked to Jay at Impulse Buys a week and a half ago and he still has AT stuff back-ordered months and months out. That's especially frustrating for me because he is now the only vendor thats going to show up to Three Oaks every month and I will not be able to do any sort of special order with him because he doesn't know if he'll ever get it in stock. I'm stuck with whatever he has already in inventory or buy from someone else and pay hazmat to have it shipped. I'd really like to support Jay because he's taking the time to come out to our launches but AT ain't making it easy. Oh well, guess that's how business is run. I could yell and holler about it but I doubt anyone will listen unless I spend thousands and thousands a year...

I think I have to agree here. I know this is whining, as I'll do whatever it takes to keep my bad habits! This is a tough (and I'm sure low margin) business and it can get pretty difficult for a vendor during bad economic times. You can't tell me sales were not down in 2008-2009... if this hobby is your primary way of earning income, then you definitely have my understanding.

I'm willing to pay list plus local sales tax since I'd *prefer* to purchase motors as I need them. But to pay shipping and hazmat? That's just not worth it if all I want are two or three motors. Bulk orders are fine but odds are I'll not use up the motors I have on hand right now in the coming year, and coordinating other club members for a big purchase can be as much fun as herding... well.... cats!

 

[Initiator001]

Lending more evidence to me that the big vendors are getting the red carpet treatment and the little guys are getting kicked to the curb.

Talked to Jay at Impulse Buys a week and a half ago and he still has AT stuff back-ordered months and months out. That's especially frustrating for me because he is now the only vendor thats going to show up to Three Oaks every month and I will not be able to do any sort of special order with him because he doesn't know if he'll ever get it in stock. I'm stuck with whatever he has already in inventory or buy from someone else and pay hazmat to have it shipped. I'd really like to support Jay because he's taking the time to come out to our launches but AT ain't making it easy. Oh well, guess that's how business is run. I could yell and holler about it but I doubt anyone will listen unless I spend thousands and thousands a year...

Or, maybe, Wildman placed their order before other vendors so they got their order first.

 

[shreadvector]

Or, maybe, Wildman placed their order before other vendors so they got their order first.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

 

[DeltaVee]

Or, maybe, Wildman placed their order before other vendors so they got their order first.

It's conceivable for sure... however I've spoken with vendors who've been waiting an awfully long time for their orders to get filled... Not to mention someone in our club did talk to AT about 6-8 months ago, and he claimed that the AT rep practically admitted it... I know, I know... heresay.... Unfortunately frin Occam's razor point of view, both explanations are pretty simple ;-)

Lets face it, a nefarious conspiracy theory is far more fun... either way it's not going to change my pov on the fact that I *prefer* AT to the competition. Like any good cheapskate... we want their stuff for the least amount of cash we can get it for, while they want to sell it for as much as they can get before people say "no way". That's the way it goes... human nature...