WILDMAN BLACK SATURDAY SALE

[scoop55]

March already...........

 

[GRIFFIN]

March already...........

I know Wildman is STILL waiting on nosecones. I am still waiting on one myself. I think the amount of kits sold was WAY more than ever expected. I'm sure if you are waiting on a kit, and you don't mind getting the cone later, he can send out the kit "coneless" and he can send you the cone at a later date.

 

[chadrog]

Crazy isn't it? I sort of regret not marking them christmas presents. Live and learn!

Oh well...eventually they will show up. Hopefully in time for me to get a couple of them built before the next HPR launch.

When everyone has their kits labeled "Christmas Gift", You're going to be in the same situation anyway. Only difference is that those that actually are won't be there in time, making for some very sad big kids...

 

[troj]

When I've discussed this with Tim (several times, actually), the delay has always been getting parts, primarily for kits. It just takes time for suppliers to produce the amount that was sold.

-Kevin

 

[bandman444]

I just got my Wild Thang today. It got delivered to the one getting me the present not to me. Oh well. I'm happy. I am going to build it minimum diameter though.

Hopefully Tim will post once it's all completely over. I'm afraid of making any big purchases with him while others are still waiting.

Troj, has he talked anything about this years sale yet!....

 

[Tronman]

I've been ordering stuff other than rocket kits and parts, and it's been arriving very quickly. As long as the item is in stock, I see no problem receiving it in a timely manner.

 

[troj]

Hopefully Tim will post once it's all completely over. I'm afraid of making any big purchases with him while others are still waiting.

Worry not about that -- if you order something someone is waiting on, he'll fill the order of the folks waiting before he fills yours.

Troj, has he talked anything about this years sale yet!....

I can neither confirm nor deny anything related to that -- until such time as I'm explicitly told I can say anything, stuff I know is kept to myself. Otherwise, he'll keep it quiet by not telling me anything.

-Kevin

 

[MarkH]

Hey mine WAS my christmas present from my wife but I said that it was no big deal to wait as i imagined it would show in January sometime and I knew that I didn't have time to work on them before then.

Furthermore, do you really think that everyone was 100% honest about it? Yeah, neither do I.

That said, I did "the right thing" and I'll continue to wait patiently. Doesn't mean I can't be somewhat frustrated by it.

Shoot him an email, and ask for a status. Tim should give you an update, but it might take a few days. I waited about a month for a recent order and it was a FG coupler for the kit I ordered that was out of stock.

 

[chadrog]

Hey mine WAS my christmas present from my wife but I said that it was no big deal to wait as i imagined it would show in January sometime and I knew that I didn't have time to work on them before then.

Furthermore, do you really think that everyone was 100% honest about it? Yeah, neither do I.

That said, I did "the right thing" and I'll continue to wait patiently. Doesn't mean I can't be somewhat frustrated by it.

Whoa, easy now. I meant no offence to you personally, was just a logical observation of the situation. You have every right to be frustrated, and I bet the frustration at the Wildman camp is exponentially worse with orders still to fill. I agree that 100% of people were probably not honest about their orders, but I'd bet 99% were.

 

[ndzied1]

At my job, we are often in the position of not being able to deliver to our customers in the time frame that they want due to not being able to get parts from our suppliers.

Trust me, there is no one that wants to fill those orders more than we do and I'm sure it is the same with Tim and Jackie.

 

[chadrog]

To be clear...I am not upset with Tim at all either. It doesn't change that I am a little frustrated with the situation as it stands but I know there is little I can do to correct it. I just needed to vent to help regain my patience for a while longer and am beginning to regret my decision to do it here.

I agree that I don't want to stick him with the extra shipping cost - i asked to have him ship out what he's got and send me the rest when it comes in and bill me for the extra shipping charge. He assured me that it would all go out "next week" last week so I'll hang tight a little longer.

....on the other hand he has my money and I don't have anything for it. I trust him implicitly but if for some reason he closes up shop tomorrow I'm way past being able to take issue with my purchase. I know that this is extremely unlikely, but hey it is 2012. Stranger things have happened so far this year to me.

In the end my only concern here is that I had expected it sooner than this based on what Tim said and what we were hearing here on the forum. I felt like we were hearing that end of January/early Feb was when most of these were going to be filled. A lesson from my life in retail is "the only reason anyone ever gets upset is because their expectations were not met." So I'll gladly reset those expectations once again.
I'll be quiet now.

I don't blame you for being frustrated, I'd be peeved too. When Tim came to our launch last month, I had to move about fifty boxes out of the way in his trailer to get to what I was looking for, all of those orders were just for people local to me. When he started telling me about the volume of the rest of it, I couldn't help but feel bad that he came to our event in horrible weather when he had bigger fish to fry. I trust he'll make good on all orders, he's always done right by me. And don't worry - if he dog's ya', I know where he lives...:dark:

 

[WILDMANRS]

Guys I am very sorry about this delay it was longer than I thought.
We sent out a bunch more stuff last week about 50 large boxes.
I believe I have almost missing 38,54 and 6 inch cones and I believe those are coming this week.
Cti has run out of 38 hardware. and finally have 98 material in house and are making those cases now.
If anyone wants us to ship the orders partial please call us so we can work something out.
Thank you
Tim

 

[Adrian A]

I participated in the sale both as a vendor and as a customer. The sale, like a fire, has gotten big enough to create its own weather. Having some rocketeers buy their motors and kits for an entire year at the Wildman sale isn't just a theoretical possibility, that's a reality for some people. After talking with another dealer, believe me they feel the loss of those sales. If Tim only sold at the sale what he had in stock, I'd be all for this. Higher volumes at lower prices is a legitimate way to win in retail. But if kits and motors that are bought months in advance continues to become a bigger part of the whole rocketry market, that could threaten to put dealers that keep everything in stock out of business. I don't know about you guys, but usually I like to be able to follow up on an idea when I have it and get some parts a few days later. Right now, when I need a part, maybe only 1 or 2 out of 10 dealers I usually buy from carry what I'm looking for in stock. I would really hate to see that go down to zero. So I have mixed feelings about the Black Saturday sale. If Tim were to change the policy so that he only sold what he had pre-stocked, it would be great. But as it has been run the last 2 years though, I'm not sure this sale is a good thing for the hobby in the long run.

 

[jms]

At my job, we are often in the position of not being able to deliver to our customers in the time frame that they want due to not being able to get parts from our suppliers.

Trust me, there is no one that wants to fill those orders more than we do and I'm sure it is the same with Tim and Jackie.

Amen to that. Or the supplier goes under, or they stop selling a particular component that you've already sold product that uses it, etc ad nauseum.

This is where I am going to giggle and say I ordered everything BEFORE the sale. Why? Because it's a great product, backed by excellent service and I'm willing to pay the premium for that.

I'm also with Adrian, when I get ideas at 2AM, I start ordering parts and for the most part I am vendor agnostic as long as they have stock.

 

[stealth6]

I participated in the sale both as a vendor and as a customer. The sale, like a fire, has gotten big enough to create its own weather. Having some rocketeers buy their motors and kits for an entire year at the Wildman sale isn't just a theoretical possibility, that's a reality for some people. After talking with another dealer, believe me they feel the loss of those sales. If Tim only sold at the sale what he had in stock, I'd be all for this. Higher volumes at lower prices is a legitimate way to win in retail. But if kits and motors that are bought months in advance continues to become a bigger part of the whole rocketry market, that could threaten to put dealers that keep everything in stock out of business. I don't know about you guys, but usually I like to be able to follow up on an idea when I have it and get some parts a few days later. Right now, when I need a part, maybe only 1 or 2 out of 10 dealers I usually buy from carry what I'm looking for in stock. I would really hate to see that go down to zero. So I have mixed feelings about the Black Saturday sale. If Tim were to change the policy so that he only sold what he had pre-stocked, it would be great. But as it has been run the last 2 years though, I'm not sure this sale is a good thing for the hobby in the long run.

Full disclosure first - I myself bought nothing from the WMBF Sale. I wanted to, and would have, but circumstances on my end prevented it.

That said, I've been watching the whole show from the bleachers and it's been interesting. Of course there were LOTS of happy folks, and tons of people got great deals. It would seem that Tim/Wildman benefited greatly as well. Many wonderful rockets will be built and enjoyed, and lots of AP will be burned for even more fun and enjoyment.
However, Adrian's post really illustrates a lot of the unease that I've felt too. Mixed feelings indeed. Hopefully those that are beginning to feel frustrated and/or have regrets will see their stuff soon, and in the end all will be well. I really hope that minor frustrations don't have the chance to grow into something worse.

I do wonder, given the size the event apparently grew into, about the longer term effects on the rocket business community. We are small, and it doesn't take much to rock the boat. Of course, as Adrian alluded to, there might be a negative effect on other companies (who may have everything in stock) - but I also wonder about negative effects on Tim/Wildman as well. Since it's obvious that many folks bought their year's supply of kits & motors during the sale, those are folks that theoretically WON'T be ordering anything - at full retail and regular profit margin - for a whole year. I would imagine that profit margins are thin in this industry, and selling a large percentage of your year's transactions at significantly less than retail has got to hurt. If those are all ADDED sales than great, but if those are all/mostly sales that WOULD HAVE been at normal retail than "ouch". If, in addition to that, Tim starts to see more grumbling due to orders not being filled in a timely manner, his situation starts to get a little stressful.

There are other downsides for Tim as well. It's obvious that a lot of folks wait until Black Friday to order, rather than pay regular prices. And also, as has been noted in earlier posts, I would imagine that quite a few people don't order anything for a while after the sale - due to fear that stock will be low, or the fact that they themselves just stocked up. So, while Tim got overwhelmed during the sale itself (all selling at big discounts), I would think that his orders for two or three months before and after the sale (which would be at regular rates) would be really low.

But Tim's a big boy, and a smart business guy (who also happens to make/sell a GREAT product). This is all just speculation on my part, and Tim knows this business better than I do (or even that I imagine I do). I hope this all works out fantastic - for him and all of us - in the end. I hope everyone gets what they wanted, WHEN they want, and has a great time building and flying. And I hope in the long run Tim thinks, "I can't wait to do another big sale like this".

I know I'm saving my pennies to be able to participate for Black Friday 2012.

Clear and windless skies to all the wildpersons out there, s6

 

[KenRico]

I participated in the sale both as a vendor and as a customer. The sale, like a fire, has gotten big enough to create its own weather. Having some rocketeers buy their motors and kits for an entire year at the Wildman sale isn't just a theoretical possibility, that's a reality for some people. After talking with another dealer, believe me they feel the loss of those sales. If Tim only sold at the sale what he had in stock, I'd be all for this. Higher volumes at lower prices is a legitimate way to win in retail. But if kits and motors that are bought months in advance continues to become a bigger part of the whole rocketry market, that could threaten to put dealers that keep everything in stock out of business. I don't know about you guys, but usually I like to be able to follow up on an idea when I have it and get some parts a few days later. Right now, when I need a part, maybe only 1 or 2 out of 10 dealers I usually buy from carry what I'm looking for in stock. I would really hate to see that go down to zero. So I have mixed feelings about the Black Saturday sale. If Tim were to change the policy so that he only sold what he had pre-stocked, it would be great. But as it has been run the last 2 years though, I'm not sure this sale is a good thing for the hobby in the long run.

Very harsh words bandied very politely, sir.

Alot of my local dealers inventory is higher than MSRP .

Perhaps we should boycott WM and RW because they offer the Vindicator and the X-Celerator at over $100 less than the Frenzy XL .

Hobbylinc consistently shows a heavy discount on items they haven't restocked on like the AeroTech HobbyLine pack . They seem fairly organized so I can only speculate they do so to 'spoil the milk' or 'poison the well' when you shop their competitors.

I have only seen one guy promote his rockets as much as the Wildman and that was Polecat Andy. In my opinion that product line is vanquishing now that he isn't actively promoting it. In the pic attached I suspect the flier did not get the vinyl from Stickershock , but she really loved her Polecat Nike and wants to get something 'bigger' next time.

Imitation is the best form of flattery and there were a number of BF sales this year after the 'fuse was lit' , some just to dump inventory because some revised products were being announced.

Tim did not give a discount on an item and call it a sale. He released a whole line new line of kits and started a 38000 view forum advert to promote and sear the brand on them. Also available at an aggressive price were building supplies, motors, and accessories to get them in the air - including a negotiated discount on vinyl so the buyer retained the choice of color or if wanted at all. I hope that all the heat and excitement he generated was worth the head ache of fulfillment and accounting.

My local retailers often have sales and BF sales to boot - all with a very long legalese attached to make sure I know that only some will get it (while supplies last or two) at the price . For me this sale was a 'Oprah' experience , you get it ! and you get it ! and you get it ! and some exceptions were made even at the buzzer .

Too bad the details were held to the morning of the sale because I may have tried to forecast my entire year. Wonder if other fliers hold any of their purchases til they get there big chain, big discount coupons that seem to come at the end of the quarter or near fiscal year end.

The financial reality of HAZMAT seems to color and weather this fulfillment process more than a 1/2 day promotion. Even has Estes webstore over compensating, a 28ns motor cannot escape the cloud. The only F I buy now is the F35, landed it is less expensive to just skip up to 120ns

Have already flown a few of the motors I bought and going to buy some more to replace them. Because of the sale I even bought ahead on a few motors JUST TO TRY them, H170Metalstorm, Pro24 DualThrust, Pro29 VMax Skidmark & LongBurn. Sometimes the local vendor pulls out early or doesn't show up - so bought a couple of those basic L1 motors to pidgeon hole, also.

Already trying some new vendors like StickerShock and Excelsior to fly some of my WM sale products and will start shopping electronics soon. Anybody know where I can get a good altimeter ?

Salute!

Kenny

 

[Adrian A]

Very harsh words bandied very politely, sir.

It was a mistake for me to offer my opinions about the sale; it's not my business.

 

[stealth6]

Hobbylinc consistently shows a heavy discount on items they haven't restocked on like the AeroTech HobbyLine pack . They seem fairly organized so I can only speculate they do so to 'spoil the milk' or 'poison the well' when you shop their competitors.

Just so happens that I placed a 40 motor/ 15 SKU order with Hobbylinc last week - pretty much all Hobbyline. All but two showed up, and those two are on the way. All at a rather huge discount compared to everyone else. No poisoned wells here - just great service, prices, AND availability.

Have already flown a few of the motors I bought and going to buy some more to replace them. Because of the sale I even bought ahead on a few motors JUST TO TRY them, H170Metalstorm, Pro24 DualThrust, Pro29 VMax Skidmark & LongBurn.

This is excellent. Pursuant to my post above, I hope that this is what happened with a lot of the sales made during Wildman's BF Sale - good for you, good for Tim, good for the sport/community as a whole.

Anybody know where I can get a good altimeter ?

I expect you made this comment as a bit of a dig, but you'd do yourself a huge disservice if you didn't seriously consider Adrian/Featherweight for this (heck, you could even purchase through Tim if you wanted).

Peace and clear skies, s6

 

[troj]

It was a mistake for me to offer my opinions about the sale; it's not my business.

Nothing at all wrong with what you posted, Adrian.

-Kevin

 

[Viperfixr]

It was a mistake for me to offer my opinions about the sale; it's not my business.

Respectfully, I disagree. I honestly hadn't thought about it until I read your posting above, but found myself agreeing with your original assertions completely.

While I am a card-carrying Wildman fan, and have been more excited by the Xmas sales than I care to admit, I think your comments are very well placed (love the "creates it's own weather" comment). I'd rather see a few limited sales per year than one massive sale that takes months to complete and lays waste to composite part inventory for at least as long.

However, seeing some other vendors get in on the 'fire sale' idea creates competition that can only be good for the consumers...perhaps when done in moderation. Having 'in stock only' sales does that (believe Madcow did this...meant to get that Frenzy XL and missed out...too slow).

 

[DAllen]

I participated in the sale both as a vendor and as a customer. The sale, like a fire, has gotten big enough to create its own weather. Having some rocketeers buy their motors and kits for an entire year at the Wildman sale isn't just a theoretical possibility, that's a reality for some people. After talking with another dealer, believe me they feel the loss of those sales. If Tim only sold at the sale what he had in stock, I'd be all for this. Higher volumes at lower prices is a legitimate way to win in retail. But if kits and motors that are bought months in advance continues to become a bigger part of the whole rocketry market, that could threaten to put dealers that keep everything in stock out of business. I don't know about you guys, but usually I like to be able to follow up on an idea when I have it and get some parts a few days later. Right now, when I need a part, maybe only 1 or 2 out of 10 dealers I usually buy from carry what I'm looking for in stock. I would really hate to see that go down to zero. So I have mixed feelings about the Black Saturday sale. If Tim were to change the policy so that he only sold what he had pre-stocked, it would be great. But as it has been run the last 2 years though, I'm not sure this sale is a good thing for the hobby in the long run.

Couldn't agree more. It's risky to sell what you DON'T have in stock. What happens when suppliers screw up and can't get what you need? Let's say your one and only supplier of super special nose cones goes belly-up? Oops?

This is why I did not participate in this sale and probably will never participate in one. If you ain't got it, I ain't buying. Period. I refuse to let someone take my hard-earned fun money on a promise they will deliver some day. Unless you are a close friend or my mom, forget it. I don't care how good the vendors reputation is.

It was a mistake for me to offer my opinions about the sale; it's not my business.

No it wasn't. And I sure hope Tim did not give you grief about it either because that would be real dumb.

 

[jpummil]

This point may have already come up, and if so, I apologize for the duplicate.

It is entirely likely that Tim was caught completely by surprise by just HOW BIG this sale was! Certainly last years sale was a hit, but I'd like to know percentage wise just how much bigger the inventory required for this one was!

Troj? CJ?

 

[troj]

It is entirely likely that Tim was caught completely by surprise by just HOW BIG this sale was! Certainly last years sale was a hit, but I'd like to know percentage wise just how much bigger the inventory required for this one was!

Sales statistics (even percentages) are up to Tim as to whether or not he'd like to post them.

-Kevin

 

[SMR]

IMHO, I think minor delays from Tim are acceptable. My build queue is long enough to wait out a few parts. All retailers are limited by supply, and production delays from the BSS are highlighted only due to the sheer volume of product moved, which is a direct result of the good values made possible during the sale. Which, as KenRico pointed out, was available to everyone. What was frustrating to me was the two hours I wasted with Madcow, trying in vain to get one of the limited number of kits they "made available" during their Black Friday event.

 

[atxcple]

amazing how people fine a way to complain about anything....the sale was good to get new products out into the market......the only downside i have noticed (as someone that talks to manufacturers) is the ammount of motors sold created a shortage at the source, thus making it slow for their orders to be filled.

 

[jcowles3]

I did get some stuff from Tim's sale and will continue to do so, but for me I support my local on site vendor with about 80% of my purchases... worth it to me to have people show up at your launch site with a fully stocked trailer! My scuba is the same way, yes, I can get it cheaper on line but when I want to talk to someone about the product or a comparison or an opinion the internet goes quite with un-answered questions. Currently Madcow and Wildman fit that demographic in my not so happy opinion, once you buy your done; service is part of the sale, be it before or after. Support your local folks (who are helping me with the other companies responsibilities) but splurge on a good sale makes sense too...

 

[ECayemberg]

Rest assured, as soon as the merchandise is available, it will be shipped to you promptly.

A recent example (today). I called in an order yesterday morning, received it this morning! Furthermore, I got a call from Tim before the order shipped giving me an option to save a few bucks. Granted, the items were in stock and I'm in the same geographic region, but man what service! My last several orders from Wildman were the same super speedy delivery!

It stinks waiting, but have faith that Wildman gets the best product from reputable vendors as timely as possible; then delivers said awesome product to you as soon as humanly possible.

Thinking back to some vendors and manufacturers of the past (and present as well) I'd venture to say that waiting is an unfortunate reality of this hobby.

-Eric-

 

[dixontj93060]

Same experience on my part about 10 days. Called Jackie and while Tim was out in the trailer they were able to locate my rather obscure requested part--had it in my hands within 48 hours of picking up the phone.

Rest assured, as soon as the merchandise is
available, it will be shipped to you promptly.

A recent example (today). I called in an order yesterday morning, received it this morning! Furthermore, I got a call from Tim before the order shipped giving me an option to save a few bucks. Granted, the items were in stock and I'm in the same geographic region, but man what service! My last several orders from Wildman were the same super speedy delivery!

 

[Mad Bomber F/X]

amazing how people fine a way to complain about anything....the sale was good to get new products out into the market......the only downside i have noticed (as someone that talks to manufacturers) is the ammount of motors sold created a shortage at the source, thus making it slow for their orders to be filled.

Which manufacture, if you don't mind me asking? I haven't noticed a shortage?

 

[tbonerocketeer]

Which manufacture, if you don't mind me asking? I haven't noticed a shortage?

How about CTI being out of hardware for the other dealers?