FlightSketch Products for 2020

[Blast it Tom!]

View attachment 471918

View attachment 471919

Yikes. Gotta love paying 146% of the cost of the item just to get them to you! I gotta admit, the Islands are beautiful, but living there presents some interesting challenges! I recall my one trip there, passing over San Francisco and noting that I now had as far to go over open ocean as I'd travelled over land! That was when United used to let you listen to Air Traffic Control, and I recall hearing something like "United 1 heavy, San Francisco Center, you're on your own, good afternoon, have a safe flight!"

 

[BEC]

Thanks for the information. So I shouldn't give it a try? I don't want to burn out the altimeters.

I don't think you'd "burn them out" but they might not work, or maybe only work when the cell was brand new. I expect there are times when the Mini pulls significantly more than 0.03 mA and it's a question of whether or not the cell can deliver the current without sagging too much in voltage at that time.

If they are the same physical size and the same voltage, they will be interchangeable. The are likely squeezing a bit more capacity in the form factor by making the barrier material between anode and cathode layers slightly thinner.

CR1225 and BR1225 are physically interchangeable, but use different chemistries, and that limits their ability to deliver the current, per the data sheets. They (at least the two example data sheets I posted) have the same capacity.

 

[WillMarchant]

Uh, it's not really evident from the web page pictures and dimensions how small the FS-Comp and battery really are. But they're small! But not quite as small as a minimum diameter Micro Maxx motor. But mine might fit in the payload bay of a NewWay "micro size" C-Thru if I file the outer corners of the battery connector just the tiniest bit...

 

[DaHabes]

It's interesting how the two batteries can be so different.

CR1225 batteries are 3.0V non-rechargeable lithium batteries based on the Lithium/Manganese Dioxide (Li/MnO2) chemistry, featuring a cutoff voltage of 2.0 volts and a nominal capacity of ~50 mAh.

Standard continuous drain CR1225 battery current is up to 0.1 mA, with the maximum continuous drain current of 1.0 mA and pulse current of up to 5-6 mA.

BR1225 batteries are 3.0V non-rechargeable lithium batteries based on the Lithium/Poly-Carbon Monoflouride (Li/CFx) chemistry, featuring a cutoff voltage of 2.0-2.25 volts and a nominal capacity of ~48 mAh.

Note: although BR1225 batteries feature a nominal voltage of 3.0 volts, in real-life applications the voltage is a little bit lower, but very stable over a long period of time.

BR1225 batteries feature a standard drain current up to 0.1 mA, with (much) stronger currents than that generally not being recommended.

 

[user 35280]

Hmm, I'm going to have mine in an hour or so, and I ordered the pouch with it, but does it still fit in an 18mm tube with the pouch? Guess I'll let everyone know if someone else doesn't answer!

I’ve only used the FS Mini inside a payload section, but if I do have to have it inside the main BT I’ll use the SDR 3D printed case I bought. https://www.badassrocketry.com/product-page/sdr-fs-mini-protective-case

 

[BEC]

Uh, it's not really evident from the web page pictures and dimensions how small the FS-Comp and battery really are. But they're small! But not quite as small as a minimum diameter Micro Maxx motor. But mine might fit in the payload bay of a NewWay "micro size" C-Thru if I file the outer corners of the battery connector just the tiniest bit...

Which is why I posted those pictures further up in this thread (post 109).

I flew a Comp in a T-3-based scratch-built MicroMaxx model this past Sunday. It really makes me wish that there were longer delays available in these things as this one popped the streamer while still going up about 40 fps per the data from the Comp: https://flightsketch.com/flights/2592/

 

[Ronz Rocketz]

BR1225 batteries feature a standard drain current up to 0.1 mA, with (much) stronger currents than that generally not being recommended.

Ah, so the manufacturer wouldn’t recommend using the BR in a Mini because of the current draw.

I speculate that it’s the magnesium in the CR that excludes them from air shipment.

That being said, I ordered a pack of CR from eBay.

 

[OhioFlyer]

Looking forward to the FlightSketch SST

Me too, anyone have any insight into when the SST and FS Sport will be coming out of beta?

 

[BEC]

Me too, anyone have any insight into when the SST and FS Sport will be coming out of beta?

As with the others, I think this is about getting the right parts. I hope to participate in the beta for the SST when that happens. It hasn't yet. I think Russ mentioned the fall of this year when he talked about this. Yeah - here it is in post 90.

 

[DaHabes]

Thanks for the information. So I shouldn't give it a try? I don't want to burn out the altimeters.

I would be concerned not about the altimeter (directly) but about the battery. BR1225s are low drain batteries by design. If you try to draw too much current, how is the battery going to respond? If it implodes/explodes, you lose the battery, the altimeter and the rocket. Hmmmm.....

The only thing I can think of is do a ground test. Put the battery in a flame proof enclosure and connect it with long leads to the Mini; a little creativity required there. Then you put the entire setup in the back of a pickup truck and drive around so the Mini has to do the GPS calculations, which what will drive some of the current demand. The transmitter draw should be constant? Ideally you would use metering to see how much current is being drawn so you know what the Mini is demanding. My electronics knowledge falls short of figuring that out.

If the battery doesn't fail under that scenario, then it may be OK.

 

[DaHabes]

Me too, anyone have any insight into when the SST and FS Sport will be coming out of beta?

I wish. With the global chip shortages, who knows? Post earlier in this thread by the developer is that some components weren't going to be available until Spring 2022.

 

[DaHabes]

Whatcha think about this setup? 200# Kevlar (either that or 400# - that's all I have on hand!) Big 'O locking swivel connected to nose cone. I will also protect my precious w a pouch!

There is also a loop for the parachute attachment point - would the Mini ride better attached to this point instead?

View attachment 470743

I do have 4 - 1/16" holes just below the bottom of the nose cone on the smooth part of the sustainer. Trying to decide if I want to drill holes in my other rockets going to LDRS39a!

I highly recommend getting a protective pouch. I had one of the first gen Minis just in the extremely thin pouch that was sent with that generation. On it's 2nd flight usage my chute didn't deploy (too tight in the airframe), the rocket lawn darted and the mini was destroyed. It sheared the switch right off the board. It would have survived in a Dino Chutes pouch or anything equivalent.

 

[Huxter]

Thanks for the warning Mike. A big reason I did not get a FS Mini earlier is the exposed/fragile look of it. But at this price w Bluetooth - SOLD!

This thread did mention a 3d printed case, but I have not yet seen a link? I'm off to Thingiverse!

 

[BEC]

I highly recommend getting a protective pouch. I had one of the first gen Minis just in the extremely thin pouch that was sent with that generation. On it's 2nd flight usage my chute didn't deploy (too tight in the airframe), the rocket lawn darted and the mini was destroyed. It sheared the switch right off the board. It would have survived in a Dino Chutes pouch or anything equivalent.

Of course the current hardware doesn't have that big slide switch and the button switch on it. But protection is a good idea for several reasons, this being one of them. Keeping the pressure sensor out of the sun is another.

I would be concerned not about the altimeter (directly) but about the battery. BR1225s are low drain batteries by design. If you try to draw too much current, how is the battery going to respond? If it implodes/explodes, you lose the battery, the altimeter and the rocket. Hmmmm.....

The only thing I can think of is do a ground test. Put the battery in a flame proof enclosure and connect it with long leads to the Mini; a little creativity required there. Then you put the entire setup in the back of a pickup truck and drive around so the Mini has to do the GPS calculations, which what will drive some of the current demand. The transmitter draw should be constant? Ideally you would use metering to see how much current is being drawn so you know what the Mini is demanding. My electronics knowledge falls short of figuring that out.

If the battery doesn't fail under that scenario, then it may be OK.

GPS calculations?? The Mini doesn't do anything like that. The location data comes from the connected device (phone or tablet). Once it's out of Bluetooth range from the controlling tablet/phone there are no communications, though I expect it's periodically trying to reconnect. That could be one source of current pulses. Arming it for flight (and therefore erasing the onboard flash memory) is another source of a current pulse.

I'd love to see how you'd measure such tiny currents, too....

 

[DaHabes]

This thread did mention a 3d printed case, but I have not yet seen a link? I'm off to Thingiverse!

I looked at the 3D printed case but decided against it. You have to screw and unscrew the case, which is a PITA. The Dino Chutes pouch is very protective and more than sufficient. I also use Nomex blankets, so I typically tuck the pouch into the blanket as extra protection from the ejection charge.

But here is the link....https://www.badassrocketry.com/product-page/sdr-fs-mini-protective-case

 

[RocketTree]

I recently had a two stage flight with FS mini in the sustainer. It landed 1/4 mile away in a forest area.

After the launch event, with a rough idea of its location, I proceeded to walk through the suspected landing area while monitoring the signal strength on the app. Of course the FS mini is not connected via bluetooth once the rocket leaves the pad, but I assumed it would automatically reconnect when in range. I located the rocket an hour or so later, and there was no automatic re-connection. I was hoping the signal strength could be used as a short range locator.

How long does the altimeter stay "ON"?

Does it reconnect automatically when in bluetooth range?

What is the maximum (estimated) range of the FS mini bluetooth connection?

 

[Ronz Rocketz]

The pouches don’t protect against the ejection charge spike in the graph. As Bernard had determined, there needs to be a bulkhead or payload NC to prevent the spikes at burnout and event.

https://flightsketch.com/flights/2453/

I recently had a two stage flight with FS mini in the sustainer. It landed 1/4 mile away in a forest area.

After the launch event, with a rough idea of its location, I proceeded to walk through the suspected landing area while monitoring the signal strength on the app. Of course the FS mini is not connected via bluetooth once the rocket leaves the pad, but I assumed it would automatically reconnect when in range. I located the rocket an hour or so later, and there was no automatic re-connection. I was hoping the signal strength could be used as a short range locator.

How long does the altimeter stay "ON"?

Does it reconnect automatically when in bluetooth range?

What is the maximum (estimated) range of the FS mini bluetooth connection?

About 4 hours. About 20ft. This happened to me with a NC payload. The dew had weakened the tape adhesive and the NC and connected Mini went flying. I was able to find it nearby with the Bluetooth.

 

[Huxter]

I've been messin around w this Thing: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1874675 for a case for my Mini.

I resized the Y from 42 to 32 mm and the Mini fits nicely! This print is PLA, but will try some TPU tonite. Need some breather holes , and 1 for the kevlar line. May just drill them out? I would put some padding in there - maybe foam?

Edit: I would not trust the hinge, so I would put a wrap of tape around it before launch - still better than screws!

 

[Ronz Rocketz]

I've been messin around w this Thing: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1874675 for a case for my Mini.

I resized the Y from 42 to 32 mm and the Mini fits nicely! This print is PLA, but will try some TPU tonite. Need some breather holes , and 1 for the kevlar line. May just drill them out? I would put some padding in there - maybe foam?

Edit: I would not trust the hinge, so I would put a wrap of tape around it before launch - still better than screws!


View attachment 472439

Do you mind sharing the file you modified? My son has a 3D printer.

 

[Huxter]

I'd love to share! I'm trying to figure out which 3d files are better for sharing - just stl? Are the 3mf files too printer proprietary? I need to create the TPU file now...

 

[BEC]

How long does the altimeter stay "ON"?

Does it reconnect automatically when in bluetooth range?

What is the maximum (estimated) range of the FS mini bluetooth connection?

As noted elsewhere in this thread, it times out at four hours from last bluetooth contact.

It usually reconnects automatically once you get close enough to it but not always. Sometimes you have to back to the settings screen and reselect it.

I have occasionally gotten data from several hundred feet as a recovering rocket drifts overhead. I have also twice gotten data from a treed rocket that I could get no closer than ~50 feet to initially.

But on the ground, 30 feet or so is a reliable limit. I have, on at least two occasions, used the signal strength display to locate one (once in a payload section that came free of the recovery system in flight and the on-table story I posted above), but the signal strength also depends on the orientation of your phone/tablet's antenna so it's not quite a simple as just moving toward better signal.

 

[BEC]

The pouches don’t protect against the ejection charge spike in the graph. As Bernard had determined, there needs to be a bulkhead or payload NC to prevent the spikes at burnout and event.

https://flightsketch.com/flights/2453/

From the looks of those data you also have a little leakage around the base of the rocket and you were flying the Mini in with the parachute. Usually that downward altitude spike, which is ejection pressure, gets filtered out by the software. What version of the firmware are you running/were you running on May 30th when you did that flight?

 

[Huxter]

This is the STL file for the 32mm Mini case. Still need to try it in TPU...

 

[Ronz Rocketz]

This is the STL file for the 32mm Mini case. Still need to try it in TPU...

Thanks. Please let me know which works better so I can put an order in with my son.

From the looks of those data you also have a little leakage around the base of the rocket and you were flying the Mini in with the parachute. Usually that downward altitude spike, which is ejection pressure, gets filtered out by the software. What version of the firmware are you running/were you running on May 30th when you did that flight?

Yes, how do you know the date? The firmware is 27. It also says rev - 0g on it. I think I had the altimeter tucked into the payload but looks like I forgot to drill the holes in the acrylic.

 

[BEC]

Yes, how do you know the date? The firmware is 27. It also says rev - 0g on it. I think I had the altimeter tucked into the payload but looks like I forgot to drill the holes in the acrylic.

The date is part of the log file's name. You will get some of the spikes, especially the upward ones, taken care of if you update to firmware 29. This is how to do it: https://flightsketch.com/media/FSMiniUpdateGuide.pdf When I did it via my Android tablet I found there were a couple more steps. Let me know if that's your situation and I'll dig up the email I sent to someone else that included the extra Android-only bits if you need them.

For what it's worth, Firmware 29 is the version that recently received NAR contest approval.

Rev 0g is the hardware revision. That version added a blob of solder under the coin cell holder on the board to give a little firmer contact (to cut down on those flights where the data stops at ejection because there was a split-second power outage) over the rev 0f boards which were the first production versions (I think). I know, details you don't really need to know.

 

[Ronz Rocketz]

I know, details you don't really need to know.

Au contraire...

Thanks for the info. I'll update now.

All fixed. The nRF Toolbox app is weird.

 

[OzHybrid]

for all these coin batteries cr1225 etc 1st digits are diameter. last are thickness. in metric.......
2032= 20mmx 3.2 thick 1225 12mmx 2.5 thick simple.....
Also if you've got a battery and can fit a slightly thicker one, you'll get a lot longer operating life. I've squeezed a 2032 into a 2024 holder.

 

[Tractionengines]

Ok question... Where is the CSV file on an Android Phone. I went to the directory listed in the manual, and there are sub-directories for Files, and Cache, and no files in either.

I did 2 flights over the weekend. Both downloaded, ok. Then saved to local storage, AND upload to web. The files show in my "Logbook" in the Flightsketch App. But that just has the summary information, and not the full DATA. At the bottom of the summary are now 2 options. "UPLOAD TO WEB" or " DELETE FLIGHT". The files are fine on the WEBSITE, and I did download the CSV files from there and have them saved... but would be nice to figure out where they are saved locally. What am I missing?

 

[Ronz Rocketz]

Ok question... Where is the CSV file on an Android Phone. I went to the directory listed in the manual, and there are sub-directories for Files, and Cache, and no files in either.

I did 2 flights over the weekend. Both downloaded, ok. Then saved to local storage, AND upload to web. The files show in my "Logbook" in the Flightsketch App. But that just has the summary information, and not the full DATA. At the bottom of the summary are now 2 options. "UPLOAD TO WEB" or " DELETE FLIGHT". The files are fine on the WEBSITE, and I did download the CSV files from there and have them saved... but would be nice to figure out where they are saved locally. What am I missing?

I believe the Save to Local Storage is a backup for later if you're not able to upload to the website before the next launch. The Logbook on the website is the only visual data unless you download the CSV file and use another program to show the graphical data.

Russ indicated that he'll update the Logbook to make it easier to find your flights. For now, you have to scroll through several user names to find yours, many are empty.

 

[Huxter]

Did you look on a Windows device and not directly thru the phone: