60,000feet in 60seconds; MD N5800; Cesaroni Challenge

[bandman444]

Rocket enthusiasts of the world, this summer a group of my friends and I have been given the opportunity to participate in an extreme high power rocketry competition.

We are planning to fly a high power rocket to over 60,000feet in 60seconds.

To fund a project like this, costs a lot of money. But we know that rather than asking for a lot of money from a few people, we have friends that could donate $5, $10, $50, maybe even over $100 to support this project.

Our fundraising goal is $4,400 which is our budget required for this project.

I know that with your help, you can help make our dream a success.

RocketHub is a website similar to the popular crowdfunding website Kickstarter. RocketHub accepts VISA, MasterCard, American Express, and Discover.

*Billy Mays*

BUT WAIT THERE'S MORE!!!

DONATING AND GETTING NOTHING IS LAME, THAT IS WHY FOR EACH DONATION CATEGORY THERE IS A PRIZE, well a little gift, FROM US TO SHOW OUR THANKS TO YOU.

WE WANT YOU TO WIN OUR GIFTS!

*Billy Mays off*

It is an exchange, your funds, for rewards from us! What more could you ask for?

So these are the steps to donate:

1) Click our link

2) Find our project interesting enough.

3) Click "Fuel this Project"

4) Earn rewards

5) Share with your friends.

For this fundraising effort to be successful we need as many "fuelers" as possible.

So please! even if you don't donate. FORWARD THIS TO YOUR FRIENDS, FAMILY, and help us spread the word.

Thank you very much,

Bryce Chanes

For more info and to donate, please use the link below.



https://www.rockethub.com/projects/7923-60-000-ft-in-60-seconds



Project Summary:

A team of well-rounded and talented college students from Southern California would like to build a record breaking amateur rocket. They have the skills, but unfortunately, not the money to do so. They have successfully flown to 30,000 ft in 30 seconds in April of 2012, and set a National Altitude Record thanks to a wonderful community of sponsors. But now, they look to a wider community for financial support of this challenging project.

This group of aspiring aerospace engineers each has a focused skill within the team: a propulsion expert, a computer tech, and a composites engineer. This group has worked together before on the aforementioned 30,000 ft project and was able to succeed fully in its goals.

In the 60,000 ft project they hope to achieve the goal of reaching the highest single-stage altitude in the commercial motor classification.

The rocket alone will weigh approximately 10 pounds empty, be about eight feet tall, and four inches in diameter; powered by a 33 pound rocket motor, that produces over 1,800 pounds of thrust. The rocket can expect to travel to nearly 4 times the speed of sound, about 3,000 mph!

To do this, they will need performance components and technology. This costs money and that’s where they will need your help. Many of the components will be made by the team, but many items will have to be bought due to the specific tolerances required to make this project a success.

We hope that you choose to “fuel” this group's rocket and share their story so that you know that you have supported the future scientists of our world. We have BIG dreams and hope for help achieving them.

 

[Rocketjunkie]

Min diameter N5800 contest entry ?:smile:

 

[Obelisk]

Should it read less than 60 seconds? I didnt sim it but a 10lbs min. dia. rocket reaching up to mach4 on an N5800 seems it would reach 60,000 much faster. Averaged speed to reach that goal would be 681mph, take into account it would be traveling a portion of that time supersonic would mean the majority of its flight would be far slower than that speed, guesstimating at 100mph... But like I said I didn't run any sims so my math could be off.

 

[bandman444]

Should it read less than 60 seconds? I didnt sim it but a 10lbs min. dia. rocket reaching up to mach4 on an N5800 seems it would reach 60,000 much faster. Averaged speed to reach that goal would be 681mph, take into account it would be traveling a portion of that time supersonic would mean the majority of its flight would be far slower than that speed, guesstimating at 100mph... But like I said I didn't run any sims so my math could be off.

Right now our sims produce an apogee at about 58seconds.

The N5800 is not a motor to be messed with lightly.

I cannot stress enough though that to make this shot a reality, we need funds.

Even $5 or $10 from you would be fantastic. And even better than that is if you could spend 5 minutes and tell your friends. Post our ad on you area Facebook page, or blog, or rocket chat group.

If we raise enough money to make this work, then be prepared to go along for a ride, because this rocket is going to be intense!

Thank you for those who have already donated.

 

[jadebox]

Your's is the first actual rocketry-related project that I've seen using RocketHub for funding!

Wishing you all the best ...

-- Roger

 

[k-rad du0d]

For $4,400 I would expect at least dinner. Where were you planning to buy lunch?

 

[Obelisk]

Bryce I see your High School is listed under your name and a college is doing the project... Are you part of the project? Good luck, hope it goes well.

 

[rfjustin]

They have successfully flown to 30,000 ft in 30 seconds in April of 2012, and set a National Altitude Record thanks to a wonderful community of sponsors.

What national altitude record does this statement refer to?



Justin

 

[jadebox]

According the the Tripoli web site, the Tripoli single-motor record for N-class motors is 44,623 feet by Ken Biba using an Aerotech N1000.

The site actually says 44,623 inches, but I suspect that's not correct.

-- Roger

 

[bandman444]

I admit, National Altitude record is a stretch, but no lie. According to the unofficial record keeping website our team hold the M840. MOTOR record, not the M impulse record.

I apologize if that is unclear.


Also I am in high school currently, for less than a month. So this project will be while I am out of high school.

HUGE thanks to Roger of Jon Rockets.com for the generous donation!

 

[bandman444]

For $4,400 I would expect at least dinner. Where were you planning to buy lunch?

Donor picks the place.

 

[Sully]

Donor picks the place.

At that price, I would choose Paris!

 

[bandman444]

Huge thanks to Roger of JonRocket.com, John Sullivan, and Warren English.

Be sure to spread the word to other friends of rocketry.

It just takes a second to post our link to your home clubs website, and that would be amazing.

Thanks guys.

 

[MClark]

Where/when are you planning of launching?

Mark

 

[bandman444]

When/If we receive the funding required, then we will attempting to fly at XPRS in September of this year.

 

[Aksrockets]

Have a design file?
I'm quite curious.

Alex

 

[bandman444]

We do have a design file, but we can't give out all of the info.

 

[edwinshap1]

I am with Bryce on this one. I have been running simulations regarding the aerodynamics, and giving out the design characteristics would not be ideal. If a person, group, or company's sponsorship of the project hinged on knowledge of the details of our flight, that would be a different story, as I don't think anyone would pay much money just to find out the numbers we've crunched.

 

[bandman444]

Website is up!

Please check it out, let me know what you think.

This my first website, so don't yell at me too bad.

Thanks again to the great donors so far.

I know there are more than 5 interested rocketeers on here, so show your support of this project by donating $10, or whatever this project is worth to you. This is your chance to be a part of a truly and undoubtedly EXTREME rocket!

https://project60k.com/

Bryce

 

[MarkH]

Bryce,

I think if your group is asking for funding from the rocket community, potential donors would like to be reasonably sure that they are not funding a spectacular disintegration project, and that you have a reasonably good chance at a successful flight. I think you would attract more donations if you gave more visibility into your design plans. I might even be inclined to chip in a few $ . You might get some valuable feedback as well. I am only saying this because as you know no one has yet to launch the N5800 in a minimum diameter rocket and have it stay together, and without details am naturally skeptical that your group would succeed.

I wouldn't be too concerned with giving away novel or proprietary design plans, because given the promotion from CTI for this event there will be numerous people trying to break the record in the next several months and probably little time for them to replicate what you are doing. You can count on one hand the launches that will have sufficient altitude waivers in the next 3-4 months.

Mark

 

[Sully]

Bryce,

I think if your group is asking for funding from the rocket community, potential donors would like to be reasonably sure that they are not funding a spectacular disintegration project, and that you have a reasonably good chance at a successful flight. I think you would attract more donations if you gave more visibility into your design plans. I might even be inclined to chip in a few $ . You might get some valuable feedback as well. I am only saying this because as you know no one has yet to launch the N5800 in a minimum diameter rocket and have it stay together, and without details am naturally skeptical that your group would succeed.

I wouldn't be too concerned with giving away novel or proprietary design plans, because given the promotion from CTI for this event there will be numerous people trying to break the record in the next several months and probably little time for them to replicate what you are doing. You can count on one hand the launches that will have sufficient altitude waivers in the next 3-4 months.

Mark

I agree that some information should be available if you're asking for donations, and I think that general information should be given: materials, design considerations, etc. If you have come up with something novel that you would like to work out a little more before exposing it to feedback/criticism/copying, then it's OK to hold some info back.

Based on my reading about Bryce and his group's last project, I DON'T worry that they are unrealistic or naive about the challenges they're facing. Bryce, it would be helpful to provide info about your last big project on both the project page and also your fundraising page. It could even be a link to the threads on TRF, like: https://www.rocketryforum.com/showt...7-75mm-Minimum-Diameter-Camarillo-High-School

 

[troj]

Something else that would help is to include information about what the team is doing to help contribute to the funding.

The way it reads right now, it comes across as "Hey, we want to do this, and want everyone else to fund it." Surely the team members are doing some things themselves to contribute to the budget?

-Kevin

 

[New Ocean]

I expect that you can get some help from vendors, as hobby vendors are usually very helpful in projects like this. For my part, I beg you to fly a small camera in the rocket to recover footage. And obviously post pics here when you start building. Documentation is really helpful for those of us who are thinking about this motor, even if your rocket does wind up shredding. If your nosecone is composite, I would think about some way to support it from within, perhaps even using heavy expanding foam as nosecones appear to be imploding on this motor.

 

[Aksrockets]

Something else that would help is to include information about what the team is doing to help contribute to the funding.

The way it reads right now, it comes across as "Hey, we want to do this, and want everyone else to fund it." Surely the team members are doing some things themselves to contribute to the budget?

-Kevin

Yeah, I was thinking along the lines of writing articles for apogee components or sport rocketry. You could easily make a few hundred bucks doing this

Alex

 

[bandman444]

Well here are some photos of minor progress.

I cut these fin alignment jigs on my schools CNC machine.

They have 1/4" slots.

Be sure to check out our website. At www.project60k.com

 

[jadebox]

Bryce ... has your team checked to see if any educational or research grants may be available to help you with your project? One place to start might be the California Space Grant Consortium.

Edit: The suggestion about writing an Apogee Newsletter or Sport Rocketry article is a good idea! It would be an interesting article, plus they may pay you for the article and it would help promote your project.

-- Roger

 

[edwinshap1]

This project will require custom machining of aluminum and titanium parts, all of which I will be doing myself, eliminating the cost of sending it off to a machine shop. The main cost comes from the raw materials, namely CF, aluminum, titanium (only a 1" dia by 2" long section, still expensive), and the motor/casing itself. I'll speak with Bryce and Tom regarding transparency, but I will not be releasing the specifics of my aerodynamics simulations to the public.

 

[bandman444]

Another piece of info for the people who just said, "Did he say titanium?"

At mach 3.5+ the heat and pressure at the nosecone are so great that our sims are saying that we a nearly approaching the melting point of aluminum, so we will be using a titanium tip to eliminate that variable from the equation.

Keep in mind the three main potential failures are:

Fins being torn off

Fin fatigue/disintegration (flutter)

Nosecone cone implosion (Structural failure)


So those are the areas we are focusing on as possible failure points.

 

[MitchR]

Not to be a debbie downer, but any decent side job between your group would easily raise that much money. In fact, if you all have those skills at any reasonable level there's no reason you couldn't find enough work to make that money in no time. I was married, took 18 credit hours, worked full time and still managed time for other things. It's all about time management. Just sayin ^.-

 

[bandman444]

In college=internships internships=free free=no money

I personally will be working at a Boy Scout Summer Camp, so no money there.

Our composite master is interning with a professional composites company, and I believe our computer tech is working in a machine shop.

We are all busy putting in all we can afford, in addition to the time we are putting in solidly working on the design. Not to mention that I still have another month of school!