They were. They're long gone now. I suspect the stock of the discontinued motors is pretty much already spoken for, probably from an earlier notice to a few selected dealers.
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The stock at Aerotech itself? I kinda figured that, unfortunately. Have to find a vendor with stock on hand if you want something discontinued, I guess.
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According to the website it looks like Wildman has that case and reload in stock:
https://wildmanrocketry.com/collections/38mm/products/381320mhttps://wildmanrocketry.com/products/j510w
https://wildmanrocketry.com/collections/38mm/products/381320mhttps://wildmanrocketry.com/products/j510w
I have no issues with removing slow moving items from stock... Taking them out of production all together, going to a pre-order system for them, or limited occasional runs for novelty ... etc. It's all part of business, and the goal of the business is to make a profit. There needs "turns" of inventory to be sure. (Inventory just sitting on the shelf, is the same has letting cash, sit on the shelf. Worse, if the product degrades with time.)
This does not seem to be a great way to go about this though.... Letting us know after the decision is made, is fine (we are customers not shareholders. ) Letting some sales channels have access to the list is fine too. If that was a preliminary list that was to be kept confidential, while you worked with those sales channels to see what their thoughts were: That is fine. If those channels "leak" information (shown it to their customers so they can buy up stock)...They should be "reminded that it was privileged information". If it was "allowed to be shown around in closed circles"... that is playing favorites.
THANK YOU FOR BEING AS OPEN AS YOU ARE ABOUT THE BUSINESS. Coming ideas, listing to customers, quickly responding to issues. That is all GREAT. Again THANK YOU. I look forward to what you keep in production, and what you have "in the works".
This does not seem to be a great way to go about this though.... Letting us know after the decision is made, is fine (we are customers not shareholders. ) Letting some sales channels have access to the list is fine too. If that was a preliminary list that was to be kept confidential, while you worked with those sales channels to see what their thoughts were: That is fine. If those channels "leak" information (shown it to their customers so they can buy up stock)...They should be "reminded that it was privileged information". If it was "allowed to be shown around in closed circles"... that is playing favorites.
THANK YOU FOR BEING AS OPEN AS YOU ARE ABOUT THE BUSINESS. Coming ideas, listing to customers, quickly responding to issues. That is all GREAT. Again THANK YOU. I look forward to what you keep in production, and what you have "in the works".
mtnmanak
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I didn't know the J510 was "long gone", I have not had any trouble getting them. I have really loved that unique motor. It still is in stock at a number of vendors. If it really is discontinued, I will stock up, since it is the only reload available for the 38/1320 case. It is a tough sell to customers to only have a single reload for an expensive case. I guess my 1320 will be relegated to research use.
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I was really hoping they would do more with that case, maybe a fast jack or propellant x load.
mtnmanak
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Definitely. I had always thought this case would have been great for a long burn/moon burner motor in a minimum diameter rocket, but I realize that would have been super niche and probably never would have been produced. It is tough to make motors for these long, narrow diameter cases.
It will still be fun to buy 38mm grains on RCS for use in this case. Too bad the CTI 38mm loads aren't compatible.
mtnmanak
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Whoa, that pretty much wipes out the motors for the 98/2560 and the 98/5120. Both those cases will be down to one reload each, which will effectively kill them off.
And the K1499 is probably the motor I use the most. It is the perfect motor for a 75mm shakeout flight. Really going to miss that one.
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This is the gist of the email that was sent to our dealer network:
"The attached is a listing of low volume products that we have targeted to be currently discontinued and not produced for an undetermined period of time. All items are listed with the current inventory showing. When supplies are gone, the product will not be produced until further notice. If an item is already showing “0” inventory, it will not be produced again until we have determined a need. Normal Order Minimum Requirements apply when ordering these items. For additional information please contact the AeroTech/Quest Customer Service Department at [email protected] or call (435) 865-7100, ext. 2#."
Many of these items are already sold out. Others, such as the 32mm RMS-R/C hardware and F13 and F16 reloads, are still available on the AeroTech store.
These items are not necessarily permanently discontinued. They will likely be produced once a year or so depending on the level of interest. There is at least one item we are considering putting back on the price list for various reasons.
"The attached is a listing of low volume products that we have targeted to be currently discontinued and not produced for an undetermined period of time. All items are listed with the current inventory showing. When supplies are gone, the product will not be produced until further notice. If an item is already showing “0” inventory, it will not be produced again until we have determined a need. Normal Order Minimum Requirements apply when ordering these items. For additional information please contact the AeroTech/Quest Customer Service Department at [email protected] or call (435) 865-7100, ext. 2#."
Many of these items are already sold out. Others, such as the 32mm RMS-R/C hardware and F13 and F16 reloads, are still available on the AeroTech store.
These items are not necessarily permanently discontinued. They will likely be produced once a year or so depending on the level of interest. There is at least one item we are considering putting back on the price list for various reasons.
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Here is an updated list of what is still available as of today:
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I am pretty upset at the loss of the K458. The Pyramid in my pictures relies on the 98/2560 series of motors. Alas I understand though. I ordered one last one from my usual vendor.
How long do motors stay certified post being discontinued? I ordered a few from the list....
How long do motors stay certified post being discontinued? I ordered a few from the list....
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While they did say [above] that not all of the motors would be discontinued, some might be relegated to special runs or once a year runs. I couldn't see the old K458 being completely discontinued. Its the original oil can motor. I think it might have fallen out of favor due to the grown prevalence of FG kits now which are heavier that older paper rockets and while the K458 is no slouch, its not up to the task for most 98mm FG kits save for a very select few. And obviously the random oddroc.
I think the K650T though is a pretty beefy motor and has far more viability. People just need to make rockets for these motors!! Maybe AT needs to contact the rocket kit MFG's with a list of good motors, but need good hosts!?!?!?!
I would be willing to bet Tim and the others could whip up some cool kits for some of the more odd but cool motors that are looking for a home. Though, that might be a little bit backwards as far as product development goes, but hey, I am an unconventional engineer!!
Personally, I think the guys at LOC could make up a few really cool paper rockets that take 98mm motors and could be flown on the oil can reloads (98/2560 for the n00bs). And with their MMT conversion design they have now, you could swap in 75, 54, clusters, etc in lieu of the 98mm MMT.
I've been accused of that a few times... I prefer to say I think outside-the-box...sometimes WAY outside...but hey, I am an unconventional engineer!!
rharshberger
Well-Known Member
The once a year/ periodically reminds me of obsolete or uncommon ammunition brass, the manufacturers occasionally do runs of the older stuff like 32-20, 307 win, and other less popular ammo.
As for the discontinuing and certification sounds like most of the stuff "discontinued" might be more like delayed production, certs should stay good unless something changes.
As for the discontinuing and certification sounds like most of the stuff "discontinued" might be more like delayed production, certs should stay good unless something changes.
I am not aware of motors losing their certification just because they were discontinued. If that was the case, I would have a lot of unusable motors...
Comment on NAR-TMT combined motor list from: https://www.tripoli.org/content.aspx?page_id=22&club_id=795696&module_id=494525
"OOP motors are NOT “de-certified”. You may continue to use them until supplies are exhausted."
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Wow! A lot of 38mm stuff on that list!. I better see what I can afford and place an order.
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Is Charlie still on here ? I sent a PM but have not gotten a response
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Phew!
I'm personally bummed about all the 38mm Black* motors. I'll just have to stock up when available I guess.
Charlie has not been here in many years. The current Aerotech contact is @AeroTech
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I agree with all of this. Jay from LOC is making me a custom "Magnum 4" kit. Ie the classic Magnum with a 98 mm mount. It should be light enough to fly on the K458 and I really really want to try the M750. I hoping I can find an M750.While they did say [above] that not all of the motors would be discontinued, some might be relegated to special runs or once a year runs. I couldn't see the old K458 being completely discontinued. Its the original oil can motor. I think it might have fallen out of favor due to the grown prevalence of FG kits now which are heavier that older paper rockets and while the K458 is no slouch, its not up to the task for most 98mm FG kits save for a very select few. And obviously the random oddroc.
I think the K650T though is a pretty beefy motor and has far more viability. People just need to make rockets for these motors!! Maybe AT needs to contact the rocket kit MFG's with a list of good motors, but need good hosts!?!?!?!
I would be willing to bet Tim and the others could whip up some cool kits for some of the more odd but cool motors that are looking for a home. Though, that might be a little bit backwards as far as product development goes, but hey, I am an unconventional engineer!!
Personally, I think the guys at LOC could make up a few really cool paper rockets that take 98mm motors and could be flown on the oil can reloads (98/2560 for the n00bs). And with their MMT conversion design they have now, you could swap in 75, 54, clusters, etc in lieu of the 98mm MMT.
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Having worked in retail for years in a previous career, completely understand what Aerotech is doing.
Every vendor has sku's that dont turn well. that doesnt mean that there arent customers that like them, or that have built their portion of the hobby around them.
For large manufactures to remain in business and profitable they must remain agile and savvy. the K458 is an OG 98mm load. Possibly one of the first 98mm loads along with the L952, M1419, and M1939. back when most all 98mm rockets were cardboard it worked well. not so much anymore with fiberglass.
Agree that the black motors are cool, but you need to ask yourself how many you really see at a given launch. Cant remember ever seeing a fast black or original black jack I or J at a NOVAAR launch, and we get maybe one every four launch days at Battlepark.
Sure its disappointing, however if we want Aerotech or any vendor to keep coming out with new motors (I know I have a few more that I would like to see), they need room to do so.
-Sean
Every vendor has sku's that dont turn well. that doesnt mean that there arent customers that like them, or that have built their portion of the hobby around them.
For large manufactures to remain in business and profitable they must remain agile and savvy. the K458 is an OG 98mm load. Possibly one of the first 98mm loads along with the L952, M1419, and M1939. back when most all 98mm rockets were cardboard it worked well. not so much anymore with fiberglass.
Agree that the black motors are cool, but you need to ask yourself how many you really see at a given launch. Cant remember ever seeing a fast black or original black jack I or J at a NOVAAR launch, and we get maybe one every four launch days at Battlepark.
Sure its disappointing, however if we want Aerotech or any vendor to keep coming out with new motors (I know I have a few more that I would like to see), they need room to do so.
-Sean
n3tjm
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What really disappoints me is the RC motors on the list. I have not seen G12's for a long time. But Doug, didn't you see the new DMS G and H that's perfect for those? Yeah, but I also saw the price tag on those... And not enough people stock them to get some price competition (Ie for this type of motor, go to vendor x, for this type vendor y is cheaper.) And The E11? NNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! The PERFECT load for Estes rockets. Not to much thrust. Near Three Second Burn. Usually No Catos. (Had one Forward Seal Failure, but since it was Black Jack, the closure was fine). The only thing that could of made it better was longer delays. D9. Yeah, That one could go. White lighting can get unpredictable at lower thrust levels and seems anemic. Maybe has something to do with the huge void in the case where (E16 is another example). I to am disappointed in the 38mm Blackjack discontinued, but imo they should of went back to normal casting tubes instead of thicker tubes once the weight issue problem was resolved. I wasn't going spend A 240 motor price for 20% less propellant due to the casting tube being thicker. Speaking of which, The G33 should come back in its former 3 second burning glory! Yeah, I know... You have the G53FJ.... BUT ITS FJ. NOT BJ. Not the same thing! Different color, different sound... Well it will be a HazMat motor! Well, you already have a Hazmat (and HPR) load for that case.
Agent J - "Can you tell me why you felt little F37 deserved to die?" (Men in Black reference).
I actually had that load in my shopping cart for my next motor purchase but I had to postpone the order till hopefully next month, and now I am hoping it will still be available when I do pull the trigger. Kind of sad that a low mid-range F motor is almost expensive as a G motor.
Yeah, I know... You have the G53FJ.... BUT ITS FJ. NOT BJ. Not the same thing! Different color, different sound... Well it will be a HazMat motor! Well, you already have a Hazmat (and HPR) load for that case.Agent J - "Can you tell me why you felt little F37 deserved to die?" (Men in Black reference).
I actually had that load in my shopping cart for my next motor purchase but I had to postpone the order till hopefully next month, and now I am hoping it will still be available when I do pull the trigger. Kind of sad that a low mid-range F motor is almost expensive as a G motor.
I just bought a bunch of 38mm slow jack from BMS and they still have some left.
I scored their last L1365M though.
I'd love to see some new ST motors in 38/54/75. Like the comments above, I too think an ST in the 75/3840-6400 case would be more appealing. I just dont have any rockets with a 75mm mount that could fly on a single grain 75 besides my 7.5" T-Loc and Id be hard pressed to buy a case just for that one motor as that rocket would probably be shred-city on the only other option (K1499) which was also just discontinued.
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