Why Get HPR Certified?

[gldknght]

I started like most do, flying Estes rockets in jr high and high school. Kind of lost interest during college, but then once when I was driving trucks, I rolled in next to a hobby shop one evening. They had Public Missile rocket kits hanging on one wall. I thought building one was something I could do when parked for the night or waiting on (truck) reloads. The kit I picked had a 38mm motor mount. It was only after I had the rocket completed did I find out (kind of by accident, I was actually researching something else) about the high power certification process. That first rocket I mostly built in my truck became my L1 cert flight.

 

[86mustang408w]

I started like most do, flying Estes rockets in jr high and high school. Kind of lost interest during college, but then once when I was driving trucks, I rolled in next to a hobby shop one evening. They had Public Missile rocket kits hanging on one wall. I thought building one was something I could do when parked for the night or waiting on (truck) reloads. The kit I picked had a 38mm motor mount. It was only after I had the rocket completed did I find out (kind of by accident, I was actually researching something else) about the high power certification process. That first rocket I mostly built in my truck became my L1 cert flight.

Thats awesome, it seems like we all have about the same story really with starting out younger with Estes then lost track for a bit now back into it.

 

[Art Upton]

Sometimes you just need to do something to scare the wife to know what you are capable of doing....

Like really Drag Racing at the track

 

[Art Upton]

This is why.View attachment 615957

I have two of those, one has been flown, one has not ... one is #6 and one is #7

 

[Art Upton]

I got my L1 partly because it seemed to be straightforward enough to do with the then just-introduced Estes PSII builders' kits. I wanted to show that one didn't have to build what appeared to me to be flying furniture — the HPR stuff I'd seen was mostly stuff that was overbuilt with thick plywood parts, huge metal hardware and then needing an I motor to get to 1000 feet because of all that mass. An Alpha can get to 1000 feet on a C....and a model not much bigger can get to over 5000 feet on an E6....

Anyway, I built a Leviathan that was almost entirely stock and flew it on a baby H CTI three-grain 29mm motor for my L1. The only epoxy in that rocket is that used to attach the motor retainer, and it's been finer.

I've only flown a few Hs since and no Is (yet). But I do like some of the more-than-80N-average-thrust Gs, so that's where I most often put my L1 to use. And this is only at flying sites that are several hours away. Locally, it's all LPR and some MPR for me, and there are many challenges there yet to be mastered.

Correct

 

[MikeT]

Sometimes you just need to do something to scare the wife to know what you are capable of doing....

Got a two car garage full of wife scaring stuff?

 

[MikeT]

Mike T, did I read your entry correctly? Did you actually say that your kids don't want your money?

Waiter, I'll have what he's having.

You know I'm truly blessed both my kids were really motivated to do well in life. Hard work paid off for both of them and they could care less about inheriting anything. They just tell my wife and I to enjoy our life and we do. I couldn't be more proud of them and know my grand-kids are well provided for.

 

[KenECoyote]

My friend bet me a dollar I couldn't do it. A few thousand dollars later, I got that dollar.

 

[neil_w]

This has gotta be the most replies to a poll ever on this forum…

 

[Lord Rory Gin]

What motivates people to go for certification levels? Is it just Tim Taylor urge? That's what it was for me quite a while ago, and now I don't think that was worth it.

• L1, when I decided to do it, was partly about "More power (grunt grunt)", and partly a sense that that's what one is expected to do. Now I have ideas that may simply require stronger motors than a G, like the thrill of greater altitude up to a point, and some scale families whose sizes vary so much that the family will span a lot of letters.
• With L1 under my belt, I set my sights on L2 for the same reasons of feeling like it was just the thing to do and "More power". I'll finish it now, in the spirit of finishing what I started, and yes, I'll be pleased with the accomplishment. But I will likely never fly another J or higher motor after that, unless and until I have another specific project that really requires it (such as if that scale family grows even more). I could have waited on L2 until some project comes around that needs it. I've bitten off, not more than I can chew, but more that I'd have wanted to chew had I thought more about it first.
• I don't think I'll ever go for L3. I decided that a long time ago because of the price of those motors. And now, having found the above perspective, I don't think I would even if I won the lottery.

So, what about you? Are you going for L1? L2? L3? Why?

In Canada the levels are a bit different with L1 and L2 together basically equalling L1 in the US. Thus we have 4 levels. My desire is to get to L3 because that's what I can afford. L4 is too much for me unless I win the lottery. Mixing my own APCP propellant is outside my desires. I might dabble in hybrid NO systems. Advanced building techniques will be explored. HP staging will be explored. Bigger rockets will be explored. I also want to get involved as a launch control officer (LCO) and rocket inspector (RI, 3 levels in Canada). Who knows, maybe even get to the RSO (3 levels in Canada).

We also have a separate recognition for dual deployment (electronics endorsement) which is required before the L4 attempt. Other than that its basically another certificate on the wall that recognizes your addition efforts.

I like LPR and MPR rockets because they are generally simpler to build, are cheaper, reach less altitude, and yet still a lot of fun. I can fly them at my brother's farm any time I like and not worry much about airspace and regulations. But HPR brings with it a lot of social camaraderie with it. Its fun to be with other like minded people all with their own goals and at different levels of expertise. Seriously a 3-day event is especially great with on-site camping, "shooting the breeze", learning from others, getting inspiration from others, mentoring others, etc.

 

[mitchboese]

I have two of those, one has been flown, one has not ... one is #6 and one is #7

I scratch built my Titan II at 1/12th scale and it flew on twn k550's at Kloudbusters Distant Thunder Launch in 2012.

 

[Art Upton]

I scratch built my Titan II at 1/12th scale and it flew on twn k550's at Kloudbusters Distant Thunder Launch in 2012.

Kewl ! Mine are clones of the Estes Kit from the 70s, nothing that big.

 

[BABAR]

More power...to a point. L3, not likely. Way out of my price range. As a kid flying all the rockets we could put our hands on, and the motors we could afford on our limited income, it was always about how high we could get it, and get it back. Mosquitoes the exception. Amazing how fast those disappear on a C6-7. Launch once, build the next!

Yeah, I can imagine a C6-7 would be a challenge. Especially getting it into a BT-5 rocket!

 

[stealth6]

Starting off by noting that I'm technically not actually flying anymore, and haven't for a while. Just to be clear.

I'll also note that during the years that I was actively flying, the vast majority of the time I flew "cowboy" and solo ...... meaning not at sanctioned launches and on my own. And yes, this does "imply" that I was flying "outside of proper authority", and I do understand and realize the implications and legal complexities involved. It is what it is (or more accurately, "it was what it was"). This also means that actually having any specific certifications was somewhat of a moot point. For the record, probably about 80%+ of my flights were LPR, and I was also SUPER careful, cautious, respectful, and responsible at all times ..... following "the spirit of the law", if not the letter.

But I did "go legal" and attended sanctioned group launches now and then. And when I did, I played by all the rules. And there was no question for me about getting my L1 cert ....... I had many projects that I wanted to explore that required L1 motors and such. I also thought of it as "supporting the sport" to some degree. As well, getting that L1 cert was so simple and easy, and relatively inexpensive, I figured "why not?".

When it came time to consider L2 certification, it was much more of a thought out decision. On the one hand, the challenge was compelling ..... both in terms of testing my knowledge (and actually passing the test), as well as managing all aspects of flying more complex rockets, at higher altitudes, with much more consideration of tracking, greater "risk", etc. And I also had some specific projects in mind that, again, necessitated L2 class motors. But on the other hand, I didn't have the time/money/resources to fly a lot in this realm, and I did question if going for my L2 would be "worth it". In the end, I went for it, and got my L2. For my actual cert flight, I went "above and beyond" just meeting minimum requirements. And true to my earlier considerations, I never did fly a whole lot of L2 class flights (again, limited time/money/resources). But I did "use" that L2 cert for plenty enough flights for me, and it was "worth it".

L3? Honestly, I never had any real desire or motivation to go there. WAY out of range for me with that time/money/resources consideration in play. And quite frankly, I've always had plenty of fun watching and/or helping others fly their "big boy" rockets (and spending their money doing so). Never really felt the need to do it myself. I'm glad others did so, because they ARE a blast, but I was able to participate in those flights (sometimes just by being there watching) enough to satisfy my needs.

In short ...... L1? - of course, why not?, L2? - ummmm, yeah I'll give it a try, L3? - nah, too much for me.

(but am I still cowboy flying the occasional whoosh/pop (or bigger) bird out in the lonely desert someplace? I ain't sayin.....)

s6

 

[RiffD]

Planning to go for L1 next year for a few reasons.

1. One of those BAR and got to spend the summer and fall learning MPR rockets. Getting a L1 feels like a natural culmination of those efforts. I've made it a point to learn some HPR components and build techniques with those rockets and find myself becoming more comfortable with modifying a rocket to suit my vision for it.
2. We launch at a field that generally supports L2 and I've seen even a couple of L3 rocket launches. So having access to a field where I could comfortably launch a L1 capable rocket just makes sense to pursue the certification.
3. The occasional H or I motor is within my budget and my kids just LOVE to watch the big rockets launch off so what dad wouldn't want to keep the kids interested by launching one as well.
4. Bigger motors are just plain fun and a lot of the interesting rockets are capable of using H and I motors.

That said, I still plan to mostly launch and build within MPR and LPR. I get a heck of a lot of joy out of every rocket launch. I think in the end, pursuing a L1 just means I'll have more options to enjoy. Well, and the kids grins.

 

[tsmmiller]

Been

Yeah, I can imagine a C6-7 would be a challenge. Especially getting it into a BT-5 rocket!

50 years ago. It may not have been a mosquito, but derned similar. The body tube had just enough room for the motor. It was tumble recovery. We would build and launch. Not one did we ever find.

 

[TheTank]

Like really Drag Racing at the track

There are only two activities my wife has every asked me to stop doing (especially after kids).... 1 - motorcycles as I was almost killed in a wreck 10 years ago due to no fault of my own. 2 - Drag racing - She saw a close friend of mine's life change forever in a wreck when he suffered a TBI. I still have one of my drag cars that I toned down to a "mostly legal" street rod but man would I love to race again every time I drive it.

 

[Back_at_it]

With my return to rocketry this time I'm in a better place in life to build and fly bigger stuff and while I will always love low and mid-power, there is only so much to can lift before you need an H motor. I got my level one so I could buy and fly H and I motors. No other reason.

I'm hoping to get my level 2 this coming year as I'd like to be able to fly J and K motors at some point but I honestly don't think I'm every going to go for level 3. I can't see myself traveling to these events sometimes thousands of miles away to fly a rocket but you never know where life will take you

 

[Art Upton]

With my return to rocketry this time I'm in a better place in life to build and fly bigger stuff and while I will always love low and mid-power, there is only so much to can lift before you need an H motor. I got my level one so I could buy and fly H and I motors. No other reason.

I'm hoping to get my level 2 this coming year as I'd like to be able to fly J and K motors at some point but I honestly don't think I'm every going to go for level 3. I can't see myself traveling to these events sometimes thousands of miles away to fly a rocket but you never know where life will take you

I said that once, then found myself with a trailer on a truck driving to places like Argonia KS for Air Fest/LDRS.

I can't do that anymore but will miss it, enjoy your time.

 

[sriegel]

My L1 happened by accident when I overbuilt my BOMARC and needed a small H to fly it.

L2 happened to support some specific larger projects like my scratch 4" Sidewinder.

L3 will eventually happen for the technical challenge.

All that said, I fly tons of low and mid power and a lot more L1 than L2.

 

[boatgeek]

So this all started in ~2012 when my son was sitting in the hall eating lunch and a member of the school rocketry club invited him in to share birthday cake. They were a great group of kids and he joined up. The club went out to an HPR launch every year, so the whole family piled in the van to go dry land camping over Memorial Day weekend. I got bit by the bug, built and promptly lost a Wizard. The next spring, another parent and I realized that the students weren't going to be successful at TARC without a little more structure and support (the previous teacher/club sponsor was a long-time rocketeer, but his replacement didn't have the knowledge or interest to really run things). So I decided to go L1 so that I could learn what they needed to know for F flights. I learned a lot on that rocket, much of it what not to do.

Later on, the students qualified for SLI. I didn't have an L2 cert, so we needed to find a mentor. He was absolutely fantastic, but I wanted a backup plan. Plus Moar Power! And Sparkies! (technically, those are L1 only, but who's counting?) So I got my L2 on the second try. At this point, 90% of my flying days are on a G-limited field, so I've been building more D-F power rockets. I do still dust off the big boys for the Labor Day launch, and I also work with the students on Jr. L1 certs as well as a larger group HPR project.

 

[bjphoenix]

Been

50 years ago. It may not have been a mosquito, but derned similar. The body tube had just enough room for the motor. It was tumble recovery. We would build and launch. Not one did we ever find.

In the old catalogs there was the Streak with catalog weight of 1/8 ounce and stated altitude of 2000 ft. (There was also the Scout with tumble recovery but it was more heavily constructed. I remember that I owned one of each. We launched them with smaller motors and found them.) And back then the biggest motor they sold was a B. I don't know how they predicted 2000 ft, you certainly can't see it at that altitude and back then any altitude determination was strictly from optical tracking. Maybe with some magnification and/or tracking chalk they could see one. Trying to track something that small as it tumbles from 2000 ft would also be a big challenge.

 

[bschultz32]

" . . . but I honestly don't think I'm every going to go for level 3. I can't see myself traveling to these events sometimes thousands of miles away to fly a rocket but you never know where life will take you" - That's exactly what I said when I entered this hobby in the mid-90's! But Art Upton is right, life is what happens to you when you were busy making other plans. The included photo shows my Blushing Bride steadying my L3 certification rocket at BALLS. That smile on her face is genuine; she like the spectacle of rocketry, and she has the special gift of being able to get along with just about anybody. We sometimes travel thousands of miles together for HPR events. But, as usual, the key is moderation. We recently took a vacation that had absolutely nothing to do with rockets.

 

[neil_w]

We recently took a vacation that had absolutely nothing to do with rockets.

Sorry, you lost me there.

 

[pondman]

We recently took a vacation that had absolutely nothing to do with rockets.

Currently on the gulf coast of Florida for a week with NO rockets. I guess I will survive......

 

[NTP2]

We recently took a vacation that had absolutely nothing to do with rockets.

Currently on the gulf coast of Florida for a week with NO rockets. I guess I will survive......

" . . . but I honestly don't think I'm every going to go for level 3. I can't see myself traveling to these events sometimes thousands of miles away to fly a rocket but you never know where life will take you" - That's exactly what I said when I entered this hobby in the mid-90's! But Art Upton is right, life is what happens to you when you were busy making other plans. The included photo shows my Blushing Bride steadying my L3 certification rocket at BALLS. That smile on her face is genuine; she like the spectacle of rocketry, and she has the special gift of being able to get along with just about anybody. We sometimes travel thousands of miles together for HPR events. But, as usual, the key is moderation. We recently took a vacation that had absolutely nothing to do with rockets.
View attachment 616478

You… you… monster you must be banished from sacred halls of rockets!!!

 

[bschultz32]

"Sorry, you lost me there" - Drag your long-suffering Significant Other to many desolate places like the Black Rock Desert and the Kansas plains of Argonia to fly rockets. But give her an occasional break by also taking her on a "normal" vacation that won't provoke unbelieving stares from her friends when she tells them about it. You know, a Caribbean cruise, a week in Vegas, Disneyworld - any regular place this does not reek of burnt APCP. Moderation. Gary gets it . . . .

 

[bschultz32]

Alas alack, it's far too late for banishment . . . .

 

[NTP2]

Alas alack, it's far too late for banishment . . . .

The gallows then…

 

[Rschub]

But give her an occasional break by also taking her on a "normal" vacation

I managed to secure my lodging for LDRS 42 by telling my brother and his GF that the launch would be in the middle of wine country, they are bringing their trailer up there for the weekend and may come to one day of the launch, and then will flit about the touristy area.