R141 NAR S & T New Motor Certification

[billspad]

The following motor has been certified by NAR Standards & Testing for
general use as a Model Rocket Motor effective January 6, 2013.




*************************************
Estes:


E16-0,4,6,8
29mm x114mm
33.38 Newton-seconds Total Impulse
26.44 Newtons Peak Thrust
15.95 Newtons Average Thrust


Propellant mass: 40.0 grams


*************************************
View attachment ESTES E16.pdf

 

[dpower]

Ooh, a black powder, 29mm E motor - This should be fun!

 

[KennB]

And so ends the tale of the MIT test session photos.

Thank you all for playing. Whoever had E-16 in the pool, you are the winner. :clap:

There's no prize but in a thread full of winners, you stand out.

 

[marcusSRG]

Oh boy oh boy oh boy! Nicely done, Estes! Somebody on here called this on the F15 thread I believe.

 

[cwbullet]

E16? Sounds like fun, but the F15 or 16 has a betetr ring to it.

 

[n3tjm]

E15 has a better ring to it... but that would bring back BAD memories. (although of all the Estes E15's I flew, none of the catoed)

 

[rail-buttons]

Got this late last night:


The following motor has been certified by NAR Standards & Testing for general use as a Model Rocket Motor effective November 25, 2012.


*************************************
Estes:

F15-0,4,6,8
29mm x114mm
49.61 Newton-seconds Total Impulse
25.26 Newtons Peak Thrust
14.38 Newtons Average Thrust

Propellant mass: 60.0 grams

*************************************

 

[billspad]

Tell me I didn't send out the F15 certification notice twice. If you got it from the NAR through ConstantContact it should have been the E16.

Got this late last night:


The following motor has been certified by NAR Standards & Testing for general use as a Model Rocket Motor effective November 25, 2012.


*************************************
Estes:

F15-0,4,6,8
29mm x114mm
49.61 Newton-seconds Total Impulse
25.26 Newtons Peak Thrust
14.38 Newtons Average Thrust

Propellant mass: 60.0 grams

*************************************

 

[rail-buttons]

So anyone know when these will be available?

No sign of anything about them on Estes website.

 

[rstaff3]

Tell me I didn't send out the F15 certification notice twice. If you got it from the NAR through ConstantContact it should have been the E16.

The official email had the E16.

 

[Initiator001]

A 29mm 'E' motor...

Reminds me of the Enerjet E24 motor.

Maybe it is time for me to get out my Enerjet 1340 and Nike Ram models.

 

[shreadvector]

And, at exactly 40 grams of propellant, it can be used in a 3 motor cluster rocket and stay under the 125 gram limit.

Still, not a full 40 N-s E, but the F15 is looking to be a nice TARC motor for next year since it is just under 50 N-s (that one is exactly 60 grams of propellant).

 

[rail-buttons]

So these are two difference motors, correct? The E says 40 grams of propellant and the F says 60 grams.

 

[shreadvector]

Yes. there are 2 different certification notices from two different dates for two different testing sessions for two different motor types (with assorted delay times as noted).

Was there anything whatsoever on those certification notices that would lead you to beleive that they were the same motor?

So these are two difference motors, correct? The E says 40 grams of propellant and the F says 60 grams.

 

[rail-buttons]

Yes. there are 2 different certification notices from two different dates for two different testing sessions for two different motor types (with assorted delay times as noted).

Was there anything whatsoever on those certification notices that would lead you to beleive that they were the same motor?

It was Billspad comment above that threw me.

"Tell me I didn't send out the F15 certification notice twice. If you got it from the NAR through ConstantContact it should have been the E16."

And that it was early this morning after a late game.

 

[billspad]

It was Billspad comment above that threw me.

"Tell me I didn't send out the F15 certification notice twice. If you got it from the NAR through ConstantContact it should have been the E16."

And that it was early this morning after a late game.

That was because what you cut and pasted into your post was from the F15 announcement that went out almost a month ago.

 

[rail-buttons]

ok, had both emails up and cut from the wrong one. Guess I didn't read all that well either. I'm going to lay blame on it being early Super Monday. :wink:

So anyone know when these will be available? Not even an mention on the Estes website.

Also wondering if these are made int he US or if they are being imported like the Quest has done.

 

[billspad]

So anyone know when these will be available? Not even an mention on the Estes website.

NAR certification is somewhere in the middle of what they have to do to get them to market. The E12's were certified in the fall of 2011 and showed up for sale early in 2012 so I'd guess it will take about that much time.

Also wondering if these are made int he US or if they are being imported like the Quest has done.

I'd be really surprised if they weren't made in the USA.

 

[awseiger]

Oh Boy oh Boy oh Boy! Now these I can't wait for!

I was wondering when Estes was going to move up to 29mm motors. Any word on the casing? Does it have a built-in thrust ring or are we going to have to rely on good old motor blocks? Or can you not tell us these things

Still... Wohoo!

 

[UncleVanya]

Yes. there are 2 different certification notices from two different dates for two different testing sessions for two different motor types (with assorted delay times as noted).

Was there anything whatsoever on those certification notices that would lead you to beleive that they were the same motor?

If it were me - I would have said, length, diameter, manufacturer and very close average thrust... and aren't they both black powder?

 

[billspad]

Or can you not tell us these things

I'm not sure what I can't tell but I do know what I can tell and that's what I posted. I don't think it's a big secret but the Estes folks can take it from here.

Still... Wohoo!

I can tell you that I agree with that statement.

 

[shreadvector]

There is (as of this moment, 8:08 am PST) an error on the NAR S&T page:

https://www.nar.org/SandT/STchrono.html

The R141 subject is in error as an F16. It should say E16.

 

[RWmarlow]

A 29mm 'E' motor...

Reminds me of the Enerjet E24 motor.

Maybe it is time for me to get out my Enerjet 1340 and Nike Ram models.

wow and the Nike Ram goes high enough on a D....But I guess I'll start back to putting ST-115 mounts in anything that will fit...

 

[billspad]

Thanks. I'll try to get that fixed.

There is (as of this moment, 8:08 am PST) an error on the NAR S&T page:

https://www.nar.org/SandT/STchrono.html

The R141 subject is in error as an F16. It should say E16.

 

[powderburner]

Maybe this new motor is why I have not seen any of the reported E12 motors. I mean, why would Estes bother with an E12 when they are about to come out with an E15/16/whatever?

Any other updates or sightings on these new Estes products?

 

[BEC]

The E12 is a 24mm motor, not a 29mm motor. Flew (E12-6) one in my SLS Aero Dart today. Nice flight all around (except for the landing in a puddle on the field).

The E12 is for getting those birds that are a bit heavy for the E9 moving a little more quickly.

 

[shreadvector]

I've seen about a hundred of E12 motors both from web based retailers and several local hobby shops and hobby chains (like Hobby People).

The initial batch of 12 packs that I bought from various Hobby People store locations with the same two different early production date codes had a 33% failure rate.

The SAME exact date codes from later purchases from the SAME stores and from online retailers had a 100% perfect success rate (and insanely impressive flights).

I have absolutely no idea why the initial bunch that I bought had problems other than a non-provable theory that the first container full on the way to Hobby People was parked in a really, really hot location and got baked.

Maybe this new motor is why I have not seen any of the reported E12 motors. I mean, why would Estes bother with an E12 when they are about to come out with an E15/16/whatever?

Any other updates or sightings on these new Estes products?

 

[JumpJet]

The new 29mm E16 and F15 motors are made in Penrose Co, Use Black Powder, have paper casings just all our other BP motors and don't have a built in thrust ring. If you come to NSL 2013 you will see some of these motors fly including a two stage model.

John Boren

 

[awseiger]

The new 29mm E16 and F15 motors are made in Penrose Co, Use Black Powder, have paper casings just all our other BP motors and don't have a built in thrust ring. If you come to NSL 2013 you will see some of these motors fly including a two stage model.

John Boren

Sweet! I won't make it to NSL but you bet you've got a customer here! The E12 was great, I can't wait to see how an F15 works out.

Does Estes have kits planned to use these motors?

 

[JumpJet]

Does Estes have kits planned to use these motors?

The F15 flies all the current Pro Series rockets except the Mega Der Red Max. The E16 will lift these same models but the final altitude is a little low.

Yes, there are new kits coming out for these motors. Should be out the same time as the motors.

John Boren