Paypal Friends and Family and VENMO Warning.

[manixFan]

I have bought a lot of stuff from members of this forum over the years, and thankfully have never been burned. But a while back I did send payment as a purchase rather than F&F and added in the fee. (I had never done that before but had just read an article about PP fraud and got nervous). However, I got a very cryptic message back from PayPal that my payment was on hold while certain information was verified. The hold could last up to several days. Both the seller and I were frustrated by the hold as it delayed the shipment of something I needed quickly. The seller was understanding even though it implied he might be a risk when I knew he wasn't. He shipped the item before the payment cleared so I would get it on time, which I greatly appreciated. So make sure you let the seller know you want to pay as a purchase and not as F&F so there are no surprises.

Just a bit of information.


Tony

 

[RocketRev]

Here at Wilson F/X I do take payments by PayPal, but I do NOT request that they come by F&F. I just figure that the almost 3% is worth it for both myself and the customer's security.

If you want the convenience, you gotta expect to pay the price that convenience costs.

Brad

 

[cwbullet]

Here at Wilson F/X I do take payments by PayPal, but I do NOT request that they come by F&F. I just figure that the almost 3% is worth it for both myself and the customer's security.

If you want the convenience, you gotta expect to pay the price that convenience costs.

Brad

And 100% top notch service!

 

[cerving]

Eggtimer Rocketry does everything with PayPal, when we send you an invoice and you pay it they take their 3% cut. That's the price of securely taking whatever payment the customer happens to use... if we had a payment cart we'd be paying the credit card company the 3% fee, so it's really a push. I personally really like PayPal (or Square, which I have to use for some EU transactions) because we never see the payment card information. It's safe for the customer, and we don't have to worry about things like PCI compliance. In the few instances in which I've run into PayPal issues, they've always been resolved quickly.

 

[jadebox]

Eggtimer Rocketry does everything with PayPal, when we send you an invoice and you pay it they take their 3% cut. That's the price of securely taking whatever payment the customer happens to use... if we had a payment cart we'd be paying the credit card company the 3% fee, so it's really a push. I personally really like PayPal (or Square, which I have to use for some EU transactions) because we never see the payment card information. It's safe for the customer, and we don't have to worry about things like PCI compliance. In the few instances in which I've run into PayPal issues, they've always been resolved quickly.

We use PayPal for the same reasons. The only issue we have had that occasionally a customer will balk at using PayPal during checkout because they don't have a PayPal account or think they will be required to use or create one. But, with most merchants, you can pay through PayPal using a credit or debit card without having a PayPal account.

 

[Motocrossman24]

I am also really into fpv racing drones, and there are many Facebook marketplace groups selling drones and parts...it seems like every other day there is a high dollar “I got scammed” post for paying friends and family...I get that the rocketry demographic is generally much older, and I would assume much more honest in general. But having seen it happen more times then I can count. I’ll never use friends and family unless it’s literally a friend or family member that I can visit if something goes wrong. We live in a different time now, and it seems everyone and their mother is out to make a quick buck at the expense of the next guy. Digital scams are only in their infancy now, and it’s extremely important to be diligent and cover yourself where ever possible. I simply won’t make a purchase online unless it’s through PayPal goods and services or my credit card company.

 

[EvryThngIsAOk]

I've received money one time that wasn't F&F, buyer wanted the protection and that was fine. The problem was that I sent the item first class, no tracking number to save money. The items arrived, the buyer was happy but I couldn't touch my money for I think 30 days. There was no way to confirm delivery so PayPal wouldn't release my money. So now if buyer wants protection, they pay extra for shipping as well. Don't know if that is the case now.
Large pricey items gets insurance and tracking anyway of course but this transaction was aluminum bulkheads, didn't need shipping costing more than the items.

I had the same exact problem at Christmas . I sold many items on the forum some for large sums. And they were sent traditional PayPal.
I couldn’t touch my money for 30 days and I was selling to fund Christmas for the family.
It was horrible. I now sell friends and family or UsPs money order.

 

[wadavidson]

I have sent and received money using F&F. Currently have motors for sale and ask the guys to use F&F but on pickup when the see everything

Bill D

 

[cwbullet]

I have sent and received money using F&F. Currently have motors for sale and ask the guys to use F&F but on pickup when the see everything

Bill D

If I were going to do it, this is how I would do it.

 

[bibbster]

I belong to many various hobby forums and it makes me chuckle at the number of sellers that request to be paid via PayPal Friends & Family. The percentage that PayPal takes is very small, 3% plus a $.30 transaction fee. I will offer to include that amount to the seller and use Goods & Services. If they balk at that, I dont buy from them. And, of course, depending on my mood, I won't bother even buying from them.

Add to that, don't be a cheapskate and ship first class. At least offer the buyer the option to pay the extra few bucks for priority. It covers both your butt's when relying on USPS. And you get paid immediately as a seller.

 

[Binder Design]

I process all credit cards from my desk and get a lower rate though my bank than Paypal. What gets me is when a customer insists that I take Paypal instead and they don't pay the fees, so it costs me extra to do them a favor. And it's much harder on my bookkeeper because the order doesn't come through our usual portal, and she has to track it down or have me do it.

So as a customer, if you talk a vendor into taking paypal as a favor to you, please return the favor and pay the fees. It's the right thing to do.

 

[afadeev]

I process all credit cards from my desk and get a lower rate though my bank than Paypal. [...]
So as a customer, if you talk a vendor into taking paypal as a favor to you, please return the favor and pay the fees. It's the right thing to do.

Did you mean entire 3% PayPal fee, or just the delta between your direct processing CC's fee vs. PayPal's?

If the former, you've got some balls!
If the latter, what's the delta?

a

P.S.: Personally, I've paid folks via PayPal F&F, via standard rout, and via credit cards.
P.P.S.: For smaller $$ amounts, I don't mind taking marginally greater risk from F&F transactions. For later amounts, or when dealing with a vendor, request for F&F would raise a yellow flag. Not red, but definitely yellow.

 

[Binder Design]

Did you mean entire 3% PayPal fee, or just the delta between your direct processing CC's fee vs. PayPal's?

If the former, you've got some balls!

The entire 3%. And it's not just about the customer end either, I do this
regularly when I pay vendors through paypal. Here's the funny thing I've noticed about human nature. They say "It's only 3%" when they talk about the vendor paying the fee, but freak out if they have to pay it.
If they are doing you a favor by taking a payment that is a PITA compared to their normal process, it's unfair to penalize them for it. Don't be a cheapskate, do the right thing and return the favor.

If your opinion is that it takes balls to say that, well to me it's just common sense. This is not Walmart, these vendors are our friends that you see out on the field. You are not "sticking it to the man".

And to be clear, I've never demanded a customer pay the fees, but it's the nice thing to do. When a customer does this, I throw in extra goodies and choose them as friends out on the field. I always remember their names.

 

[Lowell]

This discussion may have proven to be moot.

PayPal popped up a warning saying that my credit card company "may" interpret my F&F payment as a cash advance and charge me a fee for doing so.
I went that way anyway, and my credit card company charged me $10. I wasn't too upset, as the item really was a "free, you pay the shipping" item and I would have paid the extra bucks if it had been part of the asking price, but it was lots more than 3% of the original sum.

So, you might be buying things with the vendor option in the future, and willingly. I get 3% back on online purchases with my card, so it's a wash. Oh, and adding the extra bucks to make it a round number is polite. Posters do seem to have forgotten about being polite.

 

[crossfire]

Mad Cow takes PP for payments.

 

[jbr]

link your bank account in paypal, it is a free payment option

 

[Major Tom]

I’m surprised Venmo isn’t used on here more often. It was designed for P2P transactions whereas Paypal was geared towards small business. They both have the same parent company.

 

[dhbarr]

I’m surprised Venmo isn’t used on here more often. It was designed for P2P transactions whereas Paypal was geared towards small business. They both have the same parent company.

With much love to all my friends here -- this is barely a PayPal kind of place, I've had to send a check or money order more than once.

 

[afadeev]

I’m surprised Venmo isn’t used on here more often. It was designed for P2P transactions whereas Paypal was geared towards small business. They both have the same parent company.

Interesting. How do Venmo's fees compare with PayPal's ?

 

[Major Tom]

The same, although Venmo waives the 30 cent fee for credit transfers. No friends and family stuff though.

 

[Major Tom]

2% is nothing for security.

Amen to that

 

[DaHabes]

The same, although Venmo waives the 30 cent fee for credit transfers. No friends and family stuff though.

Since Venmo is P2P, I believe if you put money in your Venmo account from your bank account, there are no fees on a transaction. I use Venmo with my adult kids (Millenials!) who never bothered with PayPal and I don't recall ever seeing a trx fee.

 

[TBob]

The drawback to Venmo for sales transactions is it offers no protection for buyers or sellers.

 

[beeblebrox]

PayPal F&F is only no charge if you either have a cash balance or you are funding it from your checking account. If you use PayPal credit or Credit card, you get a fee, it comes off the recipient side...It happened to me when I clicked too fast, and took the payment from my credit card...oooops cost $12

 

[High Desert Rocketry]

A couple of years ago a GPS was sold and seller asked buyer for F&F. As soon as the money was sent PayPal the seller dropped out of the group and blocked the buyer on facebook. Lesson learned, just saying...buyer beware.

 

[gdjsky01]

Although I am late to the party. Last I knew, mentioning adding 3% to your sale was a violation of PP T&Cs. Maybe that has changed.

 

[jadebox]

Although I am late to the party. Last I knew, mentioning adding 3% to your sale was a violation of PP T&Cs. Maybe that has changed.

It hasn't:

PayPal User Agreement - PayPal US

PayPal User Agreement provides information regarding opening and closing an account, managing funds in multiple currencies, account statement, fees, and more.

www.paypal.com

No surcharges
You agree that you will not impose a surcharge or any other fee for accepting PayPal as a payment method. You may charge a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge and is not higher than the handling fee you charge for non-PayPal transactions.

 

[manixFan]

Here's scenario that has happened to me on several occasions: The seller asked for payment as FnF, I told them instead I was sending it as a payment and would add in the fee so the amount to them was the same. If they don't complain, that gives me a bit of a clue they are legit. If they say they only want payment as FnF, I would not complete the sale. Technically they have not violated the terms of service because they did not impose the surcharge, I offered it voluntarily. So far no one here on TRF has said no to me paying as a service, but as mentioned above, it has held up payment a couple of times.


Tony

 

[cwbullet]

Here's scenario that has happened to me on several occasions: The seller asked for payment as FnF, I told them instead I was sending it as a payment and would add in the fee so the amount to them was the same. If they don't complain, that gives me a bit of a clue they are legit. If they say they only want payment as FnF, I would not complete the sale. Technically they have not violated the terms of service because they did not impose the surcharge, I offered it voluntarily. So far no one here on TRF has said no to me paying as a service, but as mentioned above, it has held up payment a couple of times.


Tony

That is a pretty good way to handle it. I personally would rather pay extra.

 

[jadebox]

Here's scenario that has happened to me on several occasions: The seller asked for payment as FnF ...

Sellers are not allowed to do that.