LDRS Project
- Thread starter Neil
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Yup... mailing tubes make good 3" motor mounts... just needs a little sanding (BTW, it's nice to know people look at your website! 
). When I went to put the HyperTek motor in that rocket, the thing didn't fit... took about 20 mins to sand it out. Other than that, worked like a charm! I'm planning on using 3" mailing tubes as motor mounts in my Nike Smoke... we'll see how they hold up under 3x M2000s!
BTW Neil, I'd be a little worried about epoxy (or anything for that matter) bonding to the PVC. Possibly mechanically fasten the stuff to the pipe (e.g. thick centering rings and lots of little screws)? Or get some 4" airframe tubing, it's pretty cheap compared to the rest of the costs of a rocket...
Then again, you could go the route I did with No Sniveling (see link above or website in my signature) and buy 7.5" Quik Tubes for your body tubing. You can scratch build a nose cone for it out of styrofoam and fiberglass (go get styrofoam insulation from Home Depot, "pink foam", or from aircraft spruce, it's cheap. Glue it together with polyurethane glue and hot wire it to shape. Make a hot wire cutter out of some PVC, a guitar E string, and a train transformer. Great descriptions at https://www.vatsaas.org/rtv ). Now you've got yourself a 7.5" rocket for $50. Glass the tubes and I wouldn't be afraid to throw it up on an M or an N!
). When I went to put the HyperTek motor in that rocket, the thing didn't fit... took about 20 mins to sand it out. Other than that, worked like a charm! I'm planning on using 3" mailing tubes as motor mounts in my Nike Smoke... we'll see how they hold up under 3x M2000s!BTW Neil, I'd be a little worried about epoxy (or anything for that matter) bonding to the PVC. Possibly mechanically fasten the stuff to the pipe (e.g. thick centering rings and lots of little screws)? Or get some 4" airframe tubing, it's pretty cheap compared to the rest of the costs of a rocket...
Then again, you could go the route I did with No Sniveling (see link above or website in my signature) and buy 7.5" Quik Tubes for your body tubing. You can scratch build a nose cone for it out of styrofoam and fiberglass (go get styrofoam insulation from Home Depot, "pink foam", or from aircraft spruce, it's cheap. Glue it together with polyurethane glue and hot wire it to shape. Make a hot wire cutter out of some PVC, a guitar E string, and a train transformer. Great descriptions at https://www.vatsaas.org/rtv ). Now you've got yourself a 7.5" rocket for $50. Glass the tubes and I wouldn't be afraid to throw it up on an M or an N!
Looking forward to attending LDRS and being able to fly lots of rockets and not working my butt off. I'm planning on acquiring a 75mm hybrid 'M' motor from Doug Pratt and modifying my L3 Cert project to fly the motor and still be able to fly AMW and AT motors, (if they ever start making those in any quanity again), as well.
After trying the second time in Pennsylvania at NSL 03 I gained my L# cert,(thank you Andy Schecter and Rich Pitzeruse for all you're help), and now will extend the back side with a boat tail motor retainer to fit the hybrid motor. Since the new hybrids from Pratt Hobbies vent out the bottom, that will be the only modification i will have to do for it. Since Dougs motor comes with two loads, and with hope I will be able to afford another AMW 'M' load, I should be able to fly Marvin two to three times at LDRS,( maybe more times.
SIDE THOUGHT== Is there any record for any rocket that flew three or more times at any LDRS event on 'M' motors?
Mike Dutch
After trying the second time in Pennsylvania at NSL 03 I gained my L# cert,(thank you Andy Schecter and Rich Pitzeruse for all you're help), and now will extend the back side with a boat tail motor retainer to fit the hybrid motor. Since the new hybrids from Pratt Hobbies vent out the bottom, that will be the only modification i will have to do for it. Since Dougs motor comes with two loads, and with hope I will be able to afford another AMW 'M' load, I should be able to fly Marvin two to three times at LDRS,( maybe more times.
SIDE THOUGHT== Is there any record for any rocket that flew three or more times at any LDRS event on 'M' motors?
Mike Dutch
Neil
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Welcome to the forum! A hybrid M sounds cool, though I personnaly prefer APCP, cause of the flame! AMW is making motors in quantity, no worries there. AT is a different story..... They are up for bid, as you proabably already know. from what I have heard, AMW is going to try for it. That will be interesting. Got any pictures of the rocket your plannning on using the M in? We do like pics here.....
WHat is the average pic to post ratio? Someone around here must know.....
WHat is the average pic to post ratio? Someone around here must know.....
Niel,
here is a link to a series of photos from Rich Pitzeruse, my L3CC, preping and flying my L3 Marvin at NSL 03.
https://rmpitzer.syr.edu/launch/nsl03/index.htm
Hope you enjoy them, I know I had fun!
Mike Dutch
Level 3
here is a link to a series of photos from Rich Pitzeruse, my L3CC, preping and flying my L3 Marvin at NSL 03.
https://rmpitzer.syr.edu/launch/nsl03/index.htm
Hope you enjoy them, I know I had fun!
Mike Dutch
Level 3
havoc821
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Neil,
Somehwere in this thread, you made a comment about how you have 6 years to prepare a checklist. That comment was way off and you need to rethink that. You don't seem to take high power stuff too seriuosly. You think that the only time you have to care and worry is on your cert flight. WRONG!!!! You should treat EVERY high power flight just like a cert flight and use a checklist on EVERY high power flight to make sure nothing goes wrong, ESPECIALLY since you are under age! I am going through the same thing you are. I am building a high power rocket that can fly on motors up to an M (although it will probably never see and M). It will fly on a J540R for its first flgiht. At first, I thought to myself, how hard could this be? but I was wrong. This turned out to be a lot more expensive and complicated than I thought. L2 and L3 rockets are no easy task (not to say L1 doesn't, it just isn't anywhere near the skill level of L2 and L3 rockets). It takes a lot of planning and designing that comes with building these size rockets. I'm not sayign you aren't capable of this, all I am saying is slow down and come up with the FINAL design of the rocket and figure out how you want every part of the rocket to be built before actually starting construction. You seem to be changing ideas and designs quite frequently and I think you just need to slow down a little. I wish I did. I made some minor mistakes with my rocket that I wish I didn't make that could have been prevented with a little more planing than I gave it. I'm NOT trying to discourage you from building BIG rockets that are L2 and L3 capable. I would love to see you build something that big. I would be pretty impressed if I went to a launch and saw a 12 year old with a very complex and big rocket. Good luck with your project and give us LOTS of pictures!
Somehwere in this thread, you made a comment about how you have 6 years to prepare a checklist. That comment was way off and you need to rethink that. You don't seem to take high power stuff too seriuosly. You think that the only time you have to care and worry is on your cert flight. WRONG!!!! You should treat EVERY high power flight just like a cert flight and use a checklist on EVERY high power flight to make sure nothing goes wrong, ESPECIALLY since you are under age! I am going through the same thing you are. I am building a high power rocket that can fly on motors up to an M (although it will probably never see and M). It will fly on a J540R for its first flgiht. At first, I thought to myself, how hard could this be? but I was wrong. This turned out to be a lot more expensive and complicated than I thought. L2 and L3 rockets are no easy task (not to say L1 doesn't, it just isn't anywhere near the skill level of L2 and L3 rockets). It takes a lot of planning and designing that comes with building these size rockets. I'm not sayign you aren't capable of this, all I am saying is slow down and come up with the FINAL design of the rocket and figure out how you want every part of the rocket to be built before actually starting construction. You seem to be changing ideas and designs quite frequently and I think you just need to slow down a little. I wish I did. I made some minor mistakes with my rocket that I wish I didn't make that could have been prevented with a little more planing than I gave it. I'm NOT trying to discourage you from building BIG rockets that are L2 and L3 capable. I would love to see you build something that big. I would be pretty impressed if I went to a launch and saw a 12 year old with a very complex and big rocket. Good luck with your project and give us LOTS of pictures!
DPatell
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$15!?!?! I am spending $50 on a Fat Boy so it will withstand an I motor...don't be surprised if that K1075 flies right through it. I doubt you've ever seen a K1075 go, but it's a butt kicking motor...flung a 30# Bruiser off the pad like nothing...Think AT K1050W, that stinking fast...
Ryan, reserve me space in the bunker, I'll bring a sleeping bag and pillow.
Ryan, reserve me space in the bunker, I'll bring a sleeping bag and pillow.
rocwizard
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Ryan, go with the K1275 over the K1050. Obviously it has a higher thrust, but it is also half the cost of the K1050 which goes for a cool 250 bucks, and thats if you can find one. Or if white lightning is sounding good to you, take that M.I. of yours and load it up with a K700 and two J570s. Then you can get almost twice the impulse for the same price as that K1050.
Food for thought. hope this helps you motor making choices Plus, the rocket might scream, literally with the three motors in line!
Food for thought. hope this helps you motor making choices
Plus, the rocket might scream, literally with the three motors in line!
Neil
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Jeez, havoc!!!!! I was talking about my LEVEL THREE PROJECT, not every project! I am not going to just "throw together" all my other rockets without anything, I was just saying that I am 12 years old and i dont have to worry about my L3 flight for a good long time. After all, I cant cert for 6 years, so why do I have to worry about my L3 checklist for 5 years or more? I know I DO have to give thought to all my other rockets, but my L3 is in the DISTANT FUTURE, not tommorow! I dont have to worry about my L3 checklist for at least 5 years, so I am not going to obsess over it! My bigger worry is my dad's L2 flight! THAT is what I am going to be thinking about. Not my L1,2,3. If I even get that far in a year. So really we are looking at 6-8 years before I start thinking about cert. All my other flights get my attention (how could it NOT get my attention!? I couldent just MAKE, PREP AND FLY a rocket without giving it any thought!). I am not going to go flying an N2000, or an H128, or even an F25 without THINKING, for crying out loud!
If you think that hurt, YOUR RIGHT! IT DID! What do you think I DO all winter anyway? I cant build rockets, my workshop is one block of ice. I cant fly rockets, outside is an even bigger block of ice! So what does that leave? PLANNING! And just so you know, I am not building ANYTHING bigger than 4" by 60" right now, just so you know I am not getting any crazy ideas. And yes, they have 54MM motor mounts, not 75, so I cant go flying Ls, so you can all forget about your bunkers! I plan more than enough for these things, even if you dont know about it! Id post the files, but the stinkin things are too big! Im gonna go read the comics. I could do with a laugh.
If you think that hurt, YOUR RIGHT! IT DID! What do you think I DO all winter anyway? I cant build rockets, my workshop is one block of ice. I cant fly rockets, outside is an even bigger block of ice! So what does that leave? PLANNING! And just so you know, I am not building ANYTHING bigger than 4" by 60" right now, just so you know I am not getting any crazy ideas. And yes, they have 54MM motor mounts, not 75, so I cant go flying Ls, so you can all forget about your bunkers! I plan more than enough for these things, even if you dont know about it! Id post the files, but the stinkin things are too big! Im gonna go read the comics. I could do with a laugh.
DPatell
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To keep this thread from degrading any further, I think the best thing is for it to stop.
Neil - You're 12 years old. Yes, that's a weakness for HPR flyers. There's nothing you can do about it but wait. The level of criticism is high because of the non-chalantness that you show. A PVC tube, some Adapters for a nosecone and the like. In HPR, you will find, as any other experienced HPR flyer has discovered, that cheaper is not always better! Buy commercial parts, more expensive, but if you can't afford them, this isn't the hobby for you.
Also, experience is low for you. I doubt that you've seen more than 10 K motors fly in your life. If you had, you'd know a K1075GG is a force to be reckoned with. The 54-2550 is a nasty case, but a very cool one if your rocket can handle it.
If you do not like the criticism, don't post the ideas. No matter what you say, you're 12 years old. And as I said before, waiting a couple years is the only option.
Neil - You're 12 years old. Yes, that's a weakness for HPR flyers. There's nothing you can do about it but wait. The level of criticism is high because of the non-chalantness that you show. A PVC tube, some Adapters for a nosecone and the like. In HPR, you will find, as any other experienced HPR flyer has discovered, that cheaper is not always better! Buy commercial parts, more expensive, but if you can't afford them, this isn't the hobby for you.
Also, experience is low for you. I doubt that you've seen more than 10 K motors fly in your life. If you had, you'd know a K1075GG is a force to be reckoned with. The 54-2550 is a nasty case, but a very cool one if your rocket can handle it.
If you do not like the criticism, don't post the ideas. No matter what you say, you're 12 years old. And as I said before, waiting a couple years is the only option.
Neil
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OK, just so you know, the PVC idea is D-E-A-D for a number of reasons.
1: It just isnt worth taking all this from you guys just to build a rocket.
2: the tube is too ridged to make a coupler out of
3: the PVC glue wont stick to the plywood fins, and if I use PVC sheet I might melt the trailing edge of the fins right off.
4: I just cant afford the motors it would take to lift the thing, and you guys would have a hayday if I DID buy a K1075.
So I dont think this rocket is "fair ammo" anymore. so, if you wouldent mind, LEAVE IT!
Oh, BTW, I am 13 in 5 days, so age 12 is only fair game for another couple of hours.... Then you get to use "age 13" as ammo! What fun!
So on to do list is my dad's L2, a nice tall 3" bird, and some 4" birds sooner or later. And no, none of them will weigh 45 pounds, none of them will be taking K1075s, none of them will have 75MM motor mounts (54MM just so I can use J370GG motors sometime.), yes, most of them will be glassed, just cause I like the extra strenth, and no, I wont be using very many commercial products on them. And, finally, they will be flying on Gs, Hs and Is mostly. A J in the future, but I havent got my sights set on Ks and Ls anymore, just so you know.
I came to the conclusion after that sono-tube thing that it isnt a good idea to post my larger ideas here, but someone went digging through old threads............................ And no, I havent got any sono-tube rockets planned, and I dont think I ever will, now that I figured out they have wax on the inside of those things............... So, if you wouldent mind, please let this thread die as I meant it to a long time ago.
1: It just isnt worth taking all this from you guys just to build a rocket.
2: the tube is too ridged to make a coupler out of
3: the PVC glue wont stick to the plywood fins, and if I use PVC sheet I might melt the trailing edge of the fins right off.
4: I just cant afford the motors it would take to lift the thing, and you guys would have a hayday if I DID buy a K1075.
So I dont think this rocket is "fair ammo" anymore. so, if you wouldent mind, LEAVE IT!
Oh, BTW, I am 13 in 5 days, so age 12 is only fair game for another couple of hours.... Then you get to use "age 13" as ammo! What fun!
So on to do list is my dad's L2, a nice tall 3" bird, and some 4" birds sooner or later. And no, none of them will weigh 45 pounds, none of them will be taking K1075s, none of them will have 75MM motor mounts (54MM just so I can use J370GG motors sometime.), yes, most of them will be glassed, just cause I like the extra strenth, and no, I wont be using very many commercial products on them. And, finally, they will be flying on Gs, Hs and Is mostly. A J in the future, but I havent got my sights set on Ks and Ls anymore, just so you know.
I came to the conclusion after that sono-tube thing that it isnt a good idea to post my larger ideas here, but someone went digging through old threads............................ And no, I havent got any sono-tube rockets planned, and I dont think I ever will, now that I figured out they have wax on the inside of those things............... So, if you wouldent mind, please let this thread die as I meant it to a long time ago.
DPatell
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Congrats Neil, that proved you definately do think about your projects. You took advice, and you went through the cons of the project.
It's not ammo at all, it just adds to the equation. Good luck with the 3" L2 project and 4" birds, I agree that they are the better way to go.
It's not ammo at all, it just adds to the equation. Good luck with the 3" L2 project and 4" birds, I agree that they are the better way to go.
Neil
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the L2 project is 4", the 3" is just one of my mailing tube projects.
Blue!? Ha! We have grey, with about a foot of snow per minute around here! And I should know, I am the one who gets to shovel it all! What fun! At least I get paid good money... Now I can pay for part of the case of tubes for all these projects!
I cant believe they cancelled school... We didnt have any snow on the ground when school started. Oh well. I didnt do much work today anyway. Mostly I just kept the woodstove going, did a little puppy proofing and figured out where is a good place to start on some geometry textbook. THIS is the life! Or at least it will be in 4 days.... Gettin a puppy, and turning 13. Two of the biggest events of my life so far, and both on the same day... And my usual snow-tubing birthday party (I have been doing the same thing for 5 years... I really pity those with birthdays in mid summer! I suppose there are fun things to do then too, but nothing beats coming in from a huge hill for a big cup of hot chocolate and a big slice o cake.... Pity there is supposed to be freezing rain tommorow... We were going to go tubing tommorow, but we had to postpone it to Sunday. Oh well. OK, I gotta go stoke the fire and clean the hampsters cage (poor things in her last week or two. Shes been panting a lot, just like her mother did when she was in her last week. pity they only last two years... Another reason to buy a turtle, they live longer!). be back in a while. -Neil
Blue!? Ha! We have grey, with about a foot of snow per minute around here! And I should know, I am the one who gets to shovel it all! What fun! At least I get paid good money... Now I can pay for part of the case of tubes for all these projects!
I cant believe they cancelled school... We didnt have any snow on the ground when school started. Oh well. I didnt do much work today anyway. Mostly I just kept the woodstove going, did a little puppy proofing and figured out where is a good place to start on some geometry textbook. THIS is the life! Or at least it will be in 4 days.... Gettin a puppy, and turning 13. Two of the biggest events of my life so far, and both on the same day... And my usual snow-tubing birthday party (I have been doing the same thing for 5 years... I really pity those with birthdays in mid summer! I suppose there are fun things to do then too, but nothing beats coming in from a huge hill for a big cup of hot chocolate and a big slice o cake.... Pity there is supposed to be freezing rain tommorow... We were going to go tubing tommorow, but we had to postpone it to Sunday. Oh well. OK, I gotta go stoke the fire and clean the hampsters cage (poor things in her last week or two. Shes been panting a lot, just like her mother did when she was in her last week. pity they only last two years... Another reason to buy a turtle, they live longer!). be back in a while. -Neil
havoc821
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Neil,
Breathe in, breathe out. Chill just a little. The way you made it sound was that you weren't going to make checklist for rockets untill you had to certify. I never said or implied that you didn't think and I'm sorry you took it that way. The way you made the thread sound was that you were building a level 3 size rocket, not your actual level 3 rocket. Try to make things a little more clear in the future so that this won't happen. Try not to get so worked up when someone gives a little criticism. I was just trying to get you to think outside the box, not put you down. Well, whatever you do build, have fun with it and keep us informed.
Breathe in, breathe out. Chill just a little. The way you made it sound was that you weren't going to make checklist for rockets untill you had to certify. I never said or implied that you didn't think and I'm sorry you took it that way. The way you made the thread sound was that you were building a level 3 size rocket, not your actual level 3 rocket. Try to make things a little more clear in the future so that this won't happen. Try not to get so worked up when someone gives a little criticism. I was just trying to get you to think outside the box, not put you down. Well, whatever you do build, have fun with it and keep us informed.
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