Estes Wizard mods?

[DocSeuss]

I have been reorganizing my rocket inventory and found a bulk pack of Wizards. I passed a few along to my BIL so my nieces and nephews could build 'em, but I got a few leftover. As I relearn how to build rockets, I'm teaching myself stuff like laminating fins (k'tesh's method is great!) and I'm wondering... what kinda skills could I teach myself with a rocket this small? I think the tube's BT-20? Any fun modifications I could try?

 

[cls]

Not sure about what you could learn about construction. For flying, I find a real challenge to fold, fit, deploy a maximum parachute for epic duration! Maybe get a dry cleaning bag, cut a 24" chute. At that cramped density, even shroud line attachment becomes critical.

 

[DocSeuss]

Not sure about what you could learn about construction. For flying, I find a real challenge to fold, fit, deploy a maximum parachute for epic duration! Maybe get a dry cleaning bag, cut a 24" chute. At that cramped density, even shroud line attachment becomes critical.

Haha it's more re-learn than learn, but also just stuff to mess with. Like, I've never laminated fins before, and I'm thinkin' about what a screw on retainer might be like. They're inexpensive rockets in case I mess anything up. I'm also trying to teach myself how to cut fin jigs from payloadbay.

A dry cleaning bag, you say... hmm. I like that.

 

[K'Tesh]

Glad to hear that you like the papering method I came up with.

Spiral filling, painting and masking could be practiced... As well as printing your own decals. The classic look of the Wizard from the 1980s is very popular. Black, white, and purple...

 

[K'Tesh]

Haha it's more re-learn than learn, but also just stuff to mess with. Like, I've never laminated fins before, and I'm thinkin' about what a screw on retainer might be like. They're inexpensive rockets in case I mess anything up. I'm also trying to teach myself how to cut fin jigs from payloadbay.

A dry cleaning bag, you say... hmm. I like that.

24" parachute? It's likely gonna be a one time shot... Dry cleaning bag? Good luck seeing that in the sky. You might want to try converting a mylar balloon into a parachute... If it's sunny these can be quite flashy.

https://www.rocketryforum.com/threads/making-parachutes-from-mylar-balloons.60583/post-630596

 

[DocSeuss]

Glad to hear that you like the papering method I came up with.

Spiral filling, painting and masking could be practiced... As well as printing your own decals. The classic look of the Wizard from the 1980s is very popular. Black, white, and purple...

View attachment 604952

Painting's the big thing I'm unsure how to do on a logistical level. Dunno if I'd get in trouble for painting in my storage unit.

Printing decals sounds like it'd be really fun.

Then there's glue.

That said, I'm still trying to make kits without getting wood glue everywhere. This is an LOC Iris 1" kit I got on sale a while back. Dunno if that much wood glue can be everywhere.

Figured out last night that my diabetic alcohol pads do a good job getting up plastic cement on some of those old e2x fin cans.

Been a long road back to normal from when I got disabled in 2005. Had to give up the actual plane flying part forever, so rockets are my way of reconnecting with the sky, but I might as well be completely new to the hobby; there's so much I've forgotten.

 

[SolarYellow]

Make small tweaks to the stock fins. Sand the stock fins into nice airfoils. Try different finishing methods like CWF, sanding sealer, etc. Work on your finishing and painting procedures. Make a payload bay for a small altimeter in the nose cone. Get an inexpensive gram scale and calipers, then build a file from scratch in OpenRocket. Optimize fin size/shape/position vs. stability in OR; build and fly the result with an altimeter. Buy a sheet of balsa and make alternate fin shapes. Experiment with different parameters on streamer design. Get some BT-5 and centering rings and build a 13mm powered version for very small fields. Play with staging; the 13mm version might be the way to go for this if your field isn't big.

 

[K'Tesh]

For paint, I like to use Rusto's filler primer... kinda heavy on it with the spirals, then sand them down with 320 grit... allow to fully dry (does it still smell like paint? Yes? Wait). Prime, allow to fully dry... Paint white, then mask off for the purple, and paint it. to mask for the second color wrap it in clean office paper, tape it with masking tape on the paper. And paint from the mask to the area I want to paint to prevent spray from blowing under it. Allow it to dry for a few minutes, and remove the masking before it's fully cured, taking care to only touch it on the dry side of the paint scheme.

I tend to use 30 minute epoxy for fillets... I've also just bought some "modeling ball tools" (The kind used for cake decorating or sculpting in wax or clay) to make them even prettier.

 

[DocSeuss]

Make small tweaks to the stock fins. Sand the stock fins into nice airfoils. Try different finishing methods like CWF, sanding sealer, etc. Work on your finishing and painting procedures. Make a payload bay for a small altimeter in the nose cone. Get an inexpensive gram scale and calipers, then build a file from scratch in OpenRocket. Optimize fin size/shape/position vs. stability in OR; build and fly the result with an altimeter. Buy a sheet of balsa and make alternate fin shapes. Experiment with different parameters on streamer design. Get some BT-5 and centering rings and build a 13mm powered version for very small fields. Play with staging; the 13mm version might be the way to go for this if your field isn't big.

Oh, there's a lot of really cool ideas here. Is there an altimeter that would even fit in a Wizard? Or would I need a transition to a bigger payload tube?

I'm actually learning to sand now--using that new Estes sanding Tee but I think the 120 grit it came with might be a bit too rough, so I was gonna try moving to something finer on the next Wizard I build.

For paint, I like to use Rusto's filler primer... kinda heavy on it with the spirals, then sand them down with 320 grit... allow to fully dry (does it still smell like paint? Yes? Wait). Prime, allow to fully dry... Paint white, then mask off for the purple, and paint it. to mask for the second color wrap it in clean office paper, tape it with masking tape on the paper. And paint from the mask to the area I want to paint to prevent spray from blowing under it. Allow it to dry for a few minutes, and remove the masking before it's fully cured, taking care to only touch it on the dry side of the paint scheme.

I tend to use 30 minute epoxy for fillets... I've also just bought some "modeling ball tools" (The kind used for cake decorating or sculpting in wax or clay) to make them even prettier.

Oooh, that makes sense. My big issue is that I live in a small apartment and it's been 120+ with heat index this summer, and with my health issues, letting paint or epoxy dry indoors where I can breathe it in is an issue. My BIL and his dad have invited me over to KC, so I maaay end up having a place to paint there.

The modeling ball tools sound really cool--is epoxy gonna be light enough for the Wizard to still fly? This is the perfect rocket to mess up epoxy on, but I don't know anything about epoxy weight.

 

[K'Tesh]

Oh, there's a lot of really cool ideas here. Is there an altimeter that would even fit in a Wizard? Or would I need a transition to a bigger payload tube?

Likely you'll need to go bigger than a BT-20.

Oooh, that makes sense. My big issue is that I live in a small apartment and it's been 120+ with heat index this summer, and with my health issues, letting paint or epoxy dry indoors where I can breathe it in is an issue. My BIL and his dad have invited me over to KC, so I maaay end up having a place to paint there.

The modeling ball tools sound really cool--is epoxy gonna be light enough for the Wizard to still fly? This is the perfect rocket to mess up epoxy on, but I don't know anything about epoxy weight.

Putting the rocket inside a hot car can help cook off the VOCs that could be a problem for you. Of course you'll want to ventilate the car before driving, but that shouldn't take long.

You're fillets should be pretty small on a BT-20 kit, so the weight shouldn't be a problem. Nice thing about them is they look extremely smooth when done right, and you don't have to keep re-applying them because of popping glue bubbles (my bane as a younger rocketeer).

 

[mh9162013]

Nose cone payload bay, removable baffle system and installing a 13mm MMT.

A MicroPeak or FS Mini will both fit inside the nose cone (whether a Viking, Yankee or Wizard).

A PerfectFlite Firefly won't fit into the nose cone, but will fit into the BT-20 main body tube.

 

[SolarYellow]

Oh, there's a lot of really cool ideas here. Is there an altimeter that would even fit in a Wizard? Or would I need a transition to a bigger payload tube?

I'm actually learning to sand now--using that new Estes sanding Tee but I think the 120 grit it came with might be a bit too rough, so I was gonna try moving to something finer on the next Wizard I build.

The modeling ball tools sound really cool--is epoxy gonna be light enough for the Wizard to still fly? This is the perfect rocket to mess up epoxy on, but I don't know anything about epoxy weight.

I haven't used anything coarser than 220 grit on a rocket. 220, 320 and 400 get it done for me, but I'm not doing automotive quality paint on my rockets that get dinged up on the first flight. Just smooth enough to call it "smooth paint" in OpenRocket.

Your fillets should be pretty small on a BT-20 kit, so the weight shouldn't be a problem. Nice thing about them is they look extremely smooth when done right, and you don't have to keep re-applying them because of popping glue bubbles (my bane as a younger rocketeer).

Second all of what he said.

A MicroPeak or FS Mini will both fit inside the nose cone (whether a Viking, Yankee or Wizard).

I have flown a MicroPeak in two different Estes PNC-20 nose cones.

https://altusmetrum.org/MicroPeak/

 

[Art Upton]

It is going to be high flying , since 1976 attending Pittsburgh Spring Convention... I painted any and all potential high flying rockets in Enerjet colors ... Black and High Output Florescent Orange.

I continued that with many of my BoosterVision rockets but added the Yellow and black checker board Model Airplane Monocoat sticker tapes up at the point of the payload to the nose cone. I even have a Estes PSII Nike smoke I have flown in that paint scheme.

 

[DocSeuss]

It is going to be high flying , since 1976 attending Pittsburgh Spring Convention... I painted any and all potential high flying rockets in Enerjet colors ... Black and High Output Florescent Orange.

I continued that with many of my BoosterVision rockets but added the Yellow and black checker board Model Airplane Monocoat sticker tapes up at the point of the payload to the nose cone. I even have a Estes PSII Nike smoke I have flown in that paint scheme.

Now I'm thinking about maybe painting one like one of those Public Enemy Ultra Fatboys.

 

[Back_at_it]

Clustering. You could glue two or three of them together and build yourself a nice cluster rocket. I've been messing around with the idea as I have one of those bulk packs as well. Been thinking of gluing three tubes together and building a Wizard version of what you see below.

 

[GlenP]

The little yellow tubes for pushing in the thrust ring can also be used to make a baffle and/or coupler. I used one of those to make an extended Wizard.

 

[SolarYellow]

Thanks to @PaddyDaddy, I have a set of those decals. I'm going to try them over white. I think it will make the colors in the decal a lot brighter. That particular blue Estes uses, with a lot of grey in it, I think sucks the life out of the decal colors.

 

[Neutronium95]

Reinforce it enough to not shred on a Quest D20. The old Aerotech D21 was theoretically capable of sending a Wizard supersonic. The D20 is a bit lower performance than the D21, but is should still go like hell.

 

[SolarYellow]

Reinforce it enough to not shred on a Quest D20. The old Aerotech D21 was theoretically capable of sending a Wizard supersonic. The D20 is a bit lower performance than the D21, but is should still go like hell.

I think that's a fin shape change. Those Wizard fins are efficient at whoosh-pop speeds, but are pretty much made to flutter, being all long and skinny like they are. The D12 and D24 should put a Wizard into the 3000-ft range, at which point you need a tracker if you want to be "assured" of getting your 18/20 case back. The EF Mini won't fit cleanly in BT-20, so that says falcon tracker, which is a bit more money.