Estes Amazon Rebuild(s)

[Rocketholic]

A little history:
I got the Crossfire/Amazon/Launch pad kit and started again after a 40 year break. The Amazon is a great flier with Estes C motors. I got into Aerotech/Quest motors and tried a couple D20-4s in 18mm. The batch of D20's I got were faulty and greater than 50% that I tried resulted in CATOs from motor failure. The motors would start then burn fully at both ends or blow out the side of motor case. Bad news. After the first CATO I was able to salvage everything except the lower body tube section. After surgery I had the Amazon II about 2" longer than stock. It was nearly identical to the stock version. Another D20 try and CATO #2. Everything was toast except for the Estes shock cord, nose cone, and the 4 fins. The Amazon III build resulted. Why? because I still had viable parts!
Amazon III specs:
Length: 35 inches
Weight w/o motor: 3.9 oz.
Motor mnt: 24mm x 95mm.
(Using adapters, I still fly it on 18mm motors to about 700' on D16-4s. Haven't tried anything more powerful yet...)
I even put in a payload fence in the tube coupler to stop the streamer (and stuff) from sliding down to the motor mount - much like the original.
I made 1/4" loops out of surgical stainless-steel suture wire for the guides. They work great!
The fins are through-the-tube and are glued in like a miniature version of a MPR or HPR motor can.
There is also a 4" camera pod section that can be added to the top tube for fun videos.

 

[BABAR]

That’s a wonderful finish, especially for a particularly CATO prone personal rocket! Are you TRYING to tempt fate?

 

[SolarYellow]

Where did you get the extra BT-56 tubing?

I am planning an Enerjet Nike RAM clone using the BT-56 from an Amazon. I'm not aware of any current source for BT-56 other than the Amazon/Tandem-X launch set.

I have cut the shoulder off PNC-56 and slid a chunk of BT-55 coupler into it, but it doesn't look like that's what you've done.

FWIW, I think with a tiny amount of massaging, I can adapt the Amazon fin can to the ID of BT-55 and do something simple and generic with it that way. The PNC-56 that came with the Amazon will go on the pile of PNC-56s that might get used with LT-125 tubing down the road.

 

[Art Upton]

Where did you get the extra BT-56 tubing?

I am planning an Enerjet Nike RAM clone using the BT-56 from an Amazon. I'm not aware of any current source for BT-56 other than the Amazon/Tandem-X launch set.

I have cut the shoulder off PNC-56 and slid a chunk of BT-55 coupler into it, but it doesn't look like that's what you've done.

FWIW, I think with a tiny amount of massaging, I can adapt the Amazon fin can to the ID of BT-55 and do something simple and generic with it that way. The PNC-56 that came with the Amazon will go on the pile of PNC-56s that might get used with LT-125 tubing down the road.

Quote from a past post: "BT-56 is the same as the old Centuri #13 tube. Semroc calls it "Series 13" "

https://www.rocketryforum.com/threads/estes-bt-56-body-tube.17958/

 

[SolarYellow]

The longest piece of ST-13 available from eRockets is 4.6 inches. Might make a zipper or core sample repair, but not really useful for building a rocket.

https://www.erockets.biz/st-13/

 

[Art Upton]

The longest piece of ST-13 available from eRockets is 4.6 inches. Might make a zipper or core sample repair, but not really useful for building a rocket.

https://www.erockets.biz/st-13/

Interesting, as a past Semroc dealer [Before Randy Bought Them] I had bought many ST-13 and ST-20 body tubes that were normal sized. Guess they are not making them anymore.

 

[SolarYellow]

Yeah, it's been a topic of discussion over the past year and a half here and at YORF that 13 is gone.

Still plenty of ST-20 on hand at eRockets, though. And a little in this box of tubing next to me...

One on my long list of projects is to downscale the PNC-56 to BT-55. Jack Hydrazine has already done that, but I like my own detail design when printing NCs. I will also do improved versions of the BT-56 fin can for BT-55 and LT-125.

 

[PDawg]

Have you contacted the company to see if they will send you warranty replacement motors?

 

[Rocketholic]

That’s a wonderful finish, especially for a particularly CATO prone personal rocket! Are you TRYING to tempt fate?

Thank you for the compliment! The red/copper metallic paint wasn't easy to find. The blue is readily available Rustoleum metallic blue. The Crome is actually a piece of autobody wrap from Amazon.

HAHA! If you're going to take the time to do something to honor the fallen then you should do it right. Right? LOL That is my reasoning. Besides, I like having nice looking rockets (initially) since they get ding'd up quick enough.

Tempting fate was putting another D20-4 in it after the first CATO. I learn slowly at times...

 

[Rocketholic]

Where did you get the extra BT-56 tubing?

I am planning an Enerjet Nike RAM clone using the BT-56 from an Amazon. I'm not aware of any current source for BT-56 other than the Amazon/Tandem-X launch set.

I have cut the shoulder off PNC-56 and slid a chunk of BT-55 coupler into it, but it doesn't look like that's what you've done.

FWIW, I think with a tiny amount of massaging, I can adapt the Amazon fin can to the ID of BT-55 and do something simple and generic with it that way. The PNC-56 that came with the Amazon will go on the pile of PNC-56s that might get used with LT-125 tubing down the road.

I spoke to techs at Estes and they said the tubes on the Amazon were BT-55's, but the originals are ever-so-slightly bigger in diameter. No, I couldn't locate a reliable source for the BT-56 tubes either. The 55's fit fine on the plastic motor can that was partially melted from the first CATO. For the second rebuild the entire body was replaced with BT-55's and the nose cone would not fit. Sanding was taking too long, so I got out a flat file to remove material then sanded it smooth. Fits great now - nice and loose.

BTW, the fins on the Amazon are excellent! Thin, not so rigid that they're brittle, and effective.

 

[Rocketholic]

Have you contacted the company to see if they will send you warranty replacement motors?

Yes. I got bulk boxes of C12-4, D16-4, and D20-4's. The C12's and D16's are awesome 18mm motors!! I emailed Aerotech and was put in contact with the production manager. He said he would send me another box when they resolve the issue.
I need to email him back - thanks for the reminder!

I think I got 2 of the D-20's to operate properly. I.E. not CATO. After the first CATO I secured one to a stick and anchored it to the ground. Test fired it and all went well. Put one in the rocket and it turned into a flaming SCUD. I still have half a box of pricey and unpredictable flame throwers.

 

[neil_w]

That really came out beautiful.

 

[roy_lappalainen]

Yes. I got bulk boxes of C12-4, D16-4, and D20-4's. The C12's and D16's are awesome 18mm motors!! I emailed Aerotech and was put in contact with the production manager. He said he would send me another box when they resolve the issue.
I need to email him back - thanks for the reminder!

I think I got 2 of the D-20's to operate properly. I.E. not CATO. After the first CATO I secured one to a stick and anchored it to the ground. Test fired it and all went well. Put one in the rocket and it turned into a flaming SCUD. I still have half a box of pricey and unpredictable flame throwers.

I bought a couple of packs last month. Can you share the lot numbers?

 

[Rocketholic]

I bought a couple of packs last month. Can you share the lot numbers?

The lot # from the bulk pack of defective D20-4s that I got is:
020923-04

The word from the production manager is that it took quite a bit of work to get them to behave. He said he was going to send me replacements to try but I haven't seen any show up.

Honestly, if I were you I wouldn't risk igniting a D20 in a rocket you don't want destroyed. Like a questionable fart, is it worth it to find out?

 

[roy_lappalainen]

I also have some D22 white lightnings or good ol’e D12’s. I have a competition next weekend and I would hate to scramble some eggs.

My D20’s are another batch but, I think I will leave them in the range box for now.