Dealing with Waterslide wrinkles: Suggestions?

[Marc_G]

Hi folks,

I applied six wraps today, to three rockets. They are Icarus clones, two wraps per bird. To be clear, there was nothing wrong with the decals... they were Excelsior high quality stuff and the first five went on just fine. All also give Sandman a plug in that he had provided an extra wrap decal so that if what I'm about to whinge about bothered me THAT much, I could have had another go at it in hopes of better results. So, due diligence: pilot error.

Anyway, this is a roll pattern wrap on my BT56 Icarus upscale (parts of it are actually BT55 upscale, but that's another story). I got the bottom one on fabulously (just like four wraps in the 2 hours prior). But this one at the top really wanted to wrinkle, and all my tricks to tighten it, swab bubbles out, etc.. didn't work. This is what I got:





I'll note that the paint surface was rougher than usual, because I laid down a coat of Hot Rod Sparkle, which goes on kinda rough (small scale) pebbly. So, the decals don't slide around as well on this surface. Next time I'll try mixing it into some transparent base medium so it will be smoother.

Anyway, I tried pulling it taught, swabbing, peeling back and getting more water under there... but was unable to get it anywhere near as flat as the bottom one.

Is there some better method for this?

By the way, here's what the sparkle looks like:

 

[sandman]

Before they dry too much remove the wrinkled wraps.

I use cellophane tape to carefully remove the decal.

I'll send replacements out right away.

The first thing in the morning.

 

[Marc_G]

Hang on Sandman!

Remember, you did include an extra for me. I was just too lazy to remove the wrinkled one.

OK, let me try removing it and use the extra.

Marc

 

[sandman]

Maybe that's why I included a spare.:wink:

 

[Marc_G]

So, I tried cellophane tape and it wasn't getting the decal off (other than pulling some of the pigment, but not the actual film).

So I went to light tack blue tape, and got some off but not enough. I soaked a warm-water paper towel around it to loosen stuff up.. Worked a bit better but still not quite there.

Went to full-tack blue tape. Bollocks! Pulled off some of the underlying acrylic paint.



On the bright side, acrylic finishes are usually pretty easy to fix. Hang tight.

 

[Marc_G]

OK, I've sprayed a layer of white over the immediate area of the pull. I'll let it dry overnight, and maybe hit it with another coat tomorrow after a SUPER-light high grit sanding to knock off the edges a bit. Acrylics don't like sanding, in my experience, but a very light touch with 400+ grit can safely knock off the bumps.

 

[Marc_G]

I remembered that acrylics, sprayed thinly, can be dried very quickly with a hair dryer. After three or four THIN coats of white, and an overcoat dusted on of the hot rod sparkle, here we are:



I will wait until tomorrow night to try with the backup wrap. To fit on the page, Sandman printed it in halves. Initially I was reluctant to use it thinking I'd never get the two halves properly lined up. But after dealing with the issues with a very long wrap, I think I can do just fine with the half-pieces.

Meanwhile, since I mentioned this is a family of Icarus clones, here's the Series 7 one (similar to BT20):



Doesn't that beautiful ALPS red POP against the yellow (Createx Wicked Detail Yellow)? Sandman's stuff is always top notch like this. This one will get a clear coat... still going back and forth between Valspar clear lacquer, liquitex high gloss clear varnish, or just hitting it with future.

Marc

PS: If anyone is really paying attention, they will notice the yellow rocket's lower roll pattern is a bit short. This is due to my needing to adjust the decal to fit under the launch lug. Oops.

 

[Pat_B]

It's really difficult to get decals to set down properly on uncoated acrylic paint. Try spraying with a gloss clear coat, letting that dry, then applying your decals. You can then spray with a dull clearcoat if you don't like the gloss look.

 

[modeltrains]

A theory, not scientifically tested in double blind experiments, but more or less empirical -
The slightly pebbly finish might be acting like a sandpaper or rough concrete sidewalk surface and catching decal film instead of allowing it to slip and slide. On a smooth gloss finish it is possible to use a paint brush to introduce a bit of water under the decal and coax it in to position.

 

[Marc_G]

OK, this morning I got up a bit early to have at the retry. It worked out well.

Here's the area in question:



And another that's blurry but by reflection you can see it's not very wrinkly, just a little bit bumpy due to the repair of the paint.



Thanks to the prescient Sandman for supplying an extra roll pattern in the order!

 

[Marc_G]

As a bit of post-mortem on the situation:

On thinking back, I think I should have been more aggressive in de-wrinkling the decal early on (in the first 20% of application) as the wrinkles just got worse. I think I thought I could smooth them out after getting the whole thing on safely, then squeegeeing out the wrinkles. Doesn't work like that on the rougher "hot rod sparkle" sandpaper-like finish, as Pat_B and modeltrains suggested.

Also, I usually coat the decals before application with either a light coat of gloss lacquer or sometimes Future. I find this makes them easier to handle and less likely to wrinkle/curl. I didn't do that this weekend for some strange reason. So, the feel of the decals was different than I'm used to. I was uncertain what gloss coat I'll use on this trio of Icarus clones, and so just decided to apply them naked. As it was, I only had challenges on one decal out of the entire trio, so overall my technique must be improving...

Again, thanks to Sandman for offering to send a new decal (he's awesome!) but no need, since he included extra in the order.

Marc

 

[modeltrains]

Hey, success is good!

 

[Sully]

I found this thread as I was about to post my own "post-mortem" waterslide issue.

I hadn't used any waterslide decals for a while, but never had any real trouble before, except for occasionally tearing a delicate one. But last night I applied the Estes waterslide decals to a Mega Der Red Max. These are by far the biggest waterslides I have ever dealt with, and it was unpleasant: for me, and also for those poor decals! I handled them roughly and said very mean things about them!

First I started wrangling with the circumferential wrap (about 4X12") and fought to keep it straight and get the wrinkles and bubbles out, and tore it (and then tore it some more trying to cover up the first tear). At some point I decided to leave it alone, and moved onto the other smaller, but still big, decals. They went on easier, but still had lots of wrinkles and bubbles, most of which I thought I had smoothed out. As I was doing this, I recalled all manner of tips I had heard in the past about adding soap to the water, special prep for the surface, etc., but none of which I had done.

So, my results are pretty mediocre. My son and I build our rockets to fly, not display, so I console myself that mostly I will see it from a distance moving very fast. But up close there are obvious wrinkles and patches of raised decal. From across the room, though, it's fine.

After reviewing posts above, it seems like I should have clear-coated the rocket first. I was applying the decals over several coats of smooth (but not glassy-smooth) Rusto glossy spray enamel. I planned to clear-coat over the decals. Am I right to conclude that I should pre-clearcoat also? And does anybody add soap or anything else to the water?

I'd like to do it better next time. Although next time I'll probably order more substantial vinyl decals from Stickershock, which I have had good luck with, even in large wraps.

 

[dgreger]

I was very intimidated by the size of the black jolly roger wrap on the Mega Der Red Max, the rocket was painted with Rusto gloss red and I used gloss black on teh section where the decal was to go. What I came up with was simply cutting the decal in half making it two smaller pieces to work with. No soap added, and was able to line it up well enough you can barely tell its more than one piece.

 

[TheSamurai]

I'm not a big fan of the decals for this specific reason. I've never been able to get them to look good. There are always wrinkles and crap. Plus they usually don't fit our paint schemes.

 

[Sully]

I was very intimidated by the size of the black jolly roger wrap on the Mega Der Red Max, the rocket was painted with Rusto gloss red and I used gloss black on teh section where the decal was to go. What I came up with was simply cutting the decal in half making it two smaller pieces to work with. No soap added, and was able to line it up well enough you can barely tell its more than one piece.

Wish I'd thought of that!

My other question is: Now that its been 16 hours, is there anything i can do to make the decals look a little better? I haven't been home yet today, only saw the results briefly this morning. Aside from pulling them off and starting with fresh ones, is there anything that will make the flaws less obvious. Yes, I believe you CAN put lipstick on a pig, and I'll try it on rockets too!