Rockets exceeding 37 km (121 kft)

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J

jwhunter

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I am interested in talking with folks performing launches in excess of 121 kft. My team members at UCSD and Harvard are looking to recover 200 cc of air from that altitude. The air sample is then put thru mass spectrometers to determine oxygen isotopic composition. One of the participants is using the data in working towards a doctorate. The other participants are working for the National Science Foundation on a project involving atmospheric science.

Our company has had a delay in delivering the sample so I thought there may be folks on the forum who might provide a ride in the interest of science.
Any info is appreciated.
Best regards.

Dr. John Hunter
CTO for Green Launch, Inc.
 
jwhunter said:
Our company has had a delay in delivering the sample so I thought there may be folks on the forum who might provide a ride in the interest of science.
Click to expand...
As I take my hobbyist hat off and dawn my suit and tie, why is GL asking a third party to fulfill contractual obligations in the interest of science? Quoting directly from your website here: https://greenlaunch.space/july-20, "Green Launch has multiple contracts with customers that are interested in the unique services of Green Launch (GL) for sub-orbital delivery and atmospheric sampling."

Has GL completed Phase 1 (Karman Line Launch Sequence) of the project? What has been flown since Dec 21, 2021? I'm confused how this is being positioned as "in the interest of science" when this appears to be supporting GL business objectives directly.

Best,
 
rfjustin said:
As I take my hobbyist hat off and dawn my suit and tie, why is GL asking a third party to fulfill contractual obligations in the interest of science? Quoting directly from your website here: https://greenlaunch.space/july-20, "Green Launch has multiple contracts with customers that are interested in the unique services of Green Launch (GL) for sub-orbital delivery and atmospheric sampling."

Has GL completed Phase 1 (Karman Line Launch Sequence) of the project? What has been flown since Dec 21, 2021? I'm confused how this is being positioned as "in the interest of science" when this appears to be supporting GL business objectives directly.

Best,
Click to expand...

A nice coincidence that this comes up same time as the UPS thread. Perhaps TRF needs a collective bargaining agreement lest one of us do something harebrained like launch a commercial operation's payload to >121k ft for free!
 
Last edited:
robopup said:
A nice coincidence that this comes up same time as the UPS thread. Perhaps TRF needs a collective bargaining agreement lest one of us do something hair-brained like launch a commercial operation's payload to >121k ft for free!
Click to expand...
Who says it has to be free? If I had a BALLS project (don't, and won't for the foreseeable future if ever), that could accommodate the payload, I'd probably take it for a reasonable fee or barter. Say 3-5 times the cost of the motors in cash, or a half dozen L3 motors in trade. :D
 
boatgeek said:
Who says it has to be free? If I had a BALLS project (don't, and won't for the foreseeable future if ever), that could accommodate the payload, I'd probably take it for a reasonable fee or barter. Say 3-5 times the cost of the motors in cash, or a half dozen L3 motors in trade. :D
Click to expand...
OP's post containing, "...who might provide a ride in the interest of science" has some level of insinuation tied to it IMO.

Be right back, popcorn is ringing in the pan like a doorbell on a busy Halloween and I need to go melt the butter! :headspinning:
 
rfjustin said:
As I take my hobbyist hat off and dawn my suit and tie, why is GL asking a third party to fulfill contractual obligations in the interest of science? Quoting directly from your website here: https://greenlaunch.space/july-20, "Green Launch has multiple contracts with customers that are interested in the unique services of Green Launch (GL) for sub-orbital delivery and atmospheric sampling."

Has GL completed Phase 1 (Karman Line Launch Sequence) of the project? What has been flown since Dec 21, 2021? I'm confused how this is being positioned as "in the interest of science" when this appears to be supporting GL business objectives directly.

Best,
Click to expand...

Dear Justin,

I am a mere courier here so please leave the scolding, the ponderous admonitions and snarkiness at the door.
The two groups that benefit are indeed scientists at Harvard and UCSD. I suspect they could pay for the ride along if it was a fair number.
One member is getting her doctorate and the others are working to advance atmospheric science.

My company Green Launch gets zero out of this. Repeat zero. Your cynical appaisal is bass ackwards since in fact
using a rocket is un-aligned with the Green launch business trajectory.

All credit would go to the universities plus the rocket supplier.

Regards,

John Hunter
 
boatgeek said:
Who says it has to be free? If I had a BALLS project (don't, and won't for the foreseeable future if ever), that could accommodate the payload, I'd probably take it for a reasonable fee or barter. Say 3-5 times the cost of the motors in cash, or a half dozen L3 motors in trade. :D
Click to expand...
I am unfamiliar with your launch costs or even if you could get the NSF package to altitude. If it looked like it works out, I will try to find funding to pay for the cost of the hitchhiker.

Best.

John Hunter
 
Dear repliers,

We are not the Fed Ex of Space quite yet. SpaceX and Rocket Lab are still the leaders.
Merely looking to advance science in a totally non-greedy, sustainable, politically correct and woke fashion.
Whew, this pandering to suspicious types can be fatiguing. Sweat, sweat.

In my next life I will likely be a redneck and so will not be expected to respond to I'm sure well intended ?!!$$&**&!!.

Best.

John Hunter
 
jwhunter said:
I am unfamiliar with your launch costs or even if you could get the NSF package to altitude. If it looked like it works out, I will try to find funding to pay for the cost of the hitchhiker.

Best.

John Hunter
Click to expand...
We don't have launch costs because this is a *hobby*. I happen to be working on a similar project to what you request right now. It's a little tough to determine (in part because I don't want to know how much I spend), and because of the R&D that goes into it, but I'd guess I'm in probably 5k on my project right now. If I bill my time at $50 an hour, add in another 50k give or take. Further, according to your website, you estimate your cost at getting past the karmen line (and so forth) at 225k. Accordingly, I'll start the bidding by offering my services for 220k to the karman line.
1689888041974.png

In all seriousness, hopefully @cwbullet locks low effort spam like this. This forum already contains a wealth of information *for free* by us hobbyists. Isn't that enough?
 
robopup said:
We don't have launch costs because this is a *hobby*. I happen to be working on a similar project to what you request right now. It's a little tough to determine (in part because I don't want to know how much I spend), and because of the R&D that goes into it, but I'd guess I'm in probably 5k on my project right now. If I bill my time at $50 an hour, add in another 50k give or take. Further, according to your website, you estimate your cost at getting past the karmen line (and so forth) at 225k. Accordingly, I'll start the bidding by offering my services for 220k to the karman line.
View attachment 593125

In all seriousness, hopefully @cwbullet locks low effort spam like this. This forum already contains a wealth of information *for free* by us hobbyists. Isn't that enough?
Click to expand...
The two academic groups don't want to go to Karman. They are looking for a mere 37 km.
Regards. John Hunter
 
boatgeek said:
Who says it has to be free? If I had a BALLS project (don't, and won't for the foreseeable future if ever), that could accommodate the payload, I'd probably take it for a reasonable fee or barter. Say 3-5 times the cost of the motors in cash, or a half dozen L3 motors in trade. :D
Click to expand...
Hi Mr. boatgeek,

I like your attitude.

What if the Universities tossed in a Nobel Prize? (shared of course).

John Hunter
 
jwhunter said:
I am unfamiliar with your launch costs or even if you could get the NSF package to altitude. If it looked like it works out, I will try to find funding to pay for the cost of the hitchhiker.
Click to expand...

jwhunter said:
What if the Universities tossed in a Nobel Prize? (shared of course).
Click to expand...
As noted in my post above, I'm not in the position or certification levels to run a serious BALLS project. FWIW, you're probably looking at fewer than 50 people in the country who would be in a position to take on that job with reasonable confidence of success. I'd be willing to work hard at it for a Nobel Prize. I can accept a shared prize. [and yes, I'm kidding]

That said, an O to M staged project would probably do the job for an MSRP on the motors of ~$3K. If the payload is moderately large (ie larger than a 3" diameter tube), then you might need to be up in the O to O range at $6K MSRP. As @robopup says, the cost of the hobbyist's time is another matter entirely.
 
jwhunter said:
Dear Justin,

I am a mere courier here so please leave the scolding, the ponderous admonitions and snarkiness at the door.
The two groups that benefit are indeed scientists at Harvard and UCSD. I suspect they could pay for the ride along if it was a fair number.
One member is getting her doctorate and the others are working to advance atmospheric science.

My company Green Launch gets zero out of this. Repeat zero. Your cynical appaisal is bass ackwards since in fact
using a rocket is un-aligned with the Green launch business trajectory.

All credit would go to the universities plus the rocket supplier.

Regards,

John Hunter
Click to expand...

Your original post was ambiguous and offered no clarity or explanation of the relationship (if any) between GL and your team members at Harvard and UCSD. In fact, your ask for someone to provide a ride in the interest of science was in not only the same paragraph, but the same sentence with the reference to "Our company." I also find it perplexing that you made a point to sign off your post including your title of CTO at GL. Why include your title if your ask was not related to GL in any way? Why even mention GL in the first place. You only took the time to clarify after my reply. Perhaps consider for a moment that my "cynical appraisal" is simply objective critical thought based on common problem solving methodologies. I analyzed your problem and ask based on limited context.

Good luck with your project... or business, or whatever you are doing here...
 
jwhunter said:
I am interested in talking with folks performing launches in excess of 121 kft. My team members at UCSD and Harvard are looking to recover 200 cc of air from that altitude. The air sample is then put thru mass spectrometers to determine oxygen isotopic composition. One of the participants is using the data in working towards a doctorate. The other participants are working for the National Science Foundation on a project involving atmospheric science.

Our company has had a delay in delivering the sample so I thought there may be folks on the forum who might provide a ride in the interest of science.
Any info is appreciated.
Best regards.

Dr. John Hunter
CTO for Green Launch, Inc.
Click to expand...
What is the size and weight of the sampler? How does it collect and then seal the sample, assume this would occur after after apogee separation.
 
jwhunter said:
In my next life I will likely be a redneck and so will not be expected to respond to I'm sure well intended ?!!$$&**&!!.
Click to expand...

rfjustin said:
Mere 37km... so easy a redneck could do it right?
Click to expand...

I identify as redneck and am offended by this callus sterotipe… sterio… steor... nevermind, I ain't all that worried.
 
rfjustin said:
Your original post was ambiguous and offered no clarity or explanation of the relationship (if any) between GL and your team members at Harvard and UCSD. In fact, your ask for someone to provide a ride in the interest of science was in not only the same paragraph, but the same sentence with the reference to "Our company." I also find it perplexing that you made a point to sign off your post including your title of CTO at GL. Why include your title if your ask was not related to GL in any way? Why even mention GL in the first place. You only took the time to clarify after my reply. Perhaps consider for a moment that my "cynical appraisal" is simply objective critical thought based on common problem solving methodologies. I analyzed your problem and ask based on limited context.

Good luck with your project... or business, or whatever you are doing here...
Click to expand...
Dear Justin,
By the time I am fully politically correct to your high standards and do "everything right" and disclose my number of marriages, provide my 2005 tax returns etc. the project will be over.

Good luck with your excellent job as a professional critic.

Dr. John Hunter
CTO for Green Launch
 

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