Mach 6 Project

the model rocket show
Onebadhawk
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here's a 3 stage. it would be easy for anyone moderately versed in openrocket to draw up a 2 stager with an O8000 booster to an N5800 sustainer that gets around mach 6.4 on the simulator. of course, none of this accounts for payloads including recovery hardware and materials, electronics...etc...with the bare minimum stable design in OR for a two stager using an O8000-N5800, mach 6.4 was the highest i could achieve. this is all assuming the density of the body tube material is the same as phenolic. i dont know the properties of the OP's materials.

anyway...at very least, it's fun to sim. lol.

btw removing the O8000 booster results in mach 5.8 with a 15 second stage delay. significantly less altitude however.

View attachment hyper-sonic_backup_stable.rkt
 
Last edited:
We are now moving into meta arguments and cross-examinations in this thread...:confused2:
 
If this rocket is to be launched at a TRA event……

Motors.
The commercial rules limit the total installed impulse to be 40,960 or less to meet NFPA. To be launched over this limit under TRA research rules it would need to have at least one motor a research motor. On this page, https://www.tripoli.org/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=RhLaGq2C+HY=&tabid=326 , you will see the cells for commercial over 40,960 are “N/A”.
If the plan works out to use commercial motors it would be best to contact the TRA BoD in advance of cutting the first part. Maybe something can be worked out.

Waivers
A two stage rocket has a much smaller splash than a three stage, short staging delays will also help reduce the waivered radius. The FAA can issue waivers to 150Km, above I do not know who the authority is but I am sure the FAA can tell you-someone has to be the first to get a waiver over 150km. Since your plan is to go higher than anyone before (Speed does not matter to the FAA) I recommend contacting the TRA Class 3 committee (assuming you are a TRA member) early in the design process. The TRA Class 3 committee has a very good rapport with the parties at the FAA who issue the waivers, going through TRA C3 would be better than contacting the FAA directly.

Mark
 
MClark said:
A two stage rocket has a much smaller splash than a three stage, short staging delays will also help reduce the waivered radius.
Click to expand...

I read a paper the other day about sounding rockets where they determined that 90% of the dispersion in a 2-stage rocket comes from the initial direction of the first stage. Thus, it's in your best interest to have as much liftoff thrust and as long a launch guide as possible, so that it won't weathercock. 1, 2, or 3 stages, an initial weathercock means it's going to go faaaaaaaaaar.
 
im really happy to see that we are all starting to get on the same page. Thanks, everyones help.

as far as the money goes, my pockets are shallow but i know ppl with very deep pockets and they maybe interested in the project. I have brought it up to them in the past and they have asked me to get details about the plan and what not, to write up a proposal and give that to them. I know this does not mean a sure thing but, i got yo start some where.
 
Hyppersonic_Monkey said:
im really happy to see that we are all starting to get on the same page. Thanks, everyones help.

as far as the money goes, my pockets are shallow but i know ppl with very deep pockets and they maybe interested in the project. I have brought it up to them in the past and they have asked me to get details about the plan and what not, to write up a proposal and give that to them. I know this does not mean a sure thing but, i got yo start some where.
Click to expand...

If the people who may sponsor you are not rocketry people, you should probably emphasize the challenges and realistically the very low odds of success of reaching this goal as an amateur. Some successes that are more attainable than M6 might be testing novel heat- and force-management techniques that have not been used by other rocketeers or construction techniques that survive MaxQ where others have shredded. What you're describing is basically a scientific endeavor, and the real success would be obtaining the knowledge and experience along the way. Hitting M6 is the headline achievement here, but there are lots of other interim goals that can be successful even if the ultimate one is elusive (at first). If your sponsors are not academics or scientists, they may feel that building a composite rocket that survives but only reaches Mach 5.5 would be a failure, when in reality that would be pretty kick-ass. (and would lead to hitting M6 down the road).

Example: when the first SpaceX launch was aborted due to engine problems, a friend who is an MBA business-type smugly asked me what I thought about their "failure" and whether commercial space technology would ever be viable. At the time, I said I didn't see it as a real failure (although the launch didn't go as planned), but that it demonstrated the efficacy of their monitoring system and allowed them to avoid a CATO and live to launch again (which they did, of course).

If you have sponsors, make sure they have reasonable expectations if you want them to stick around.
 
Hyppersonic_Monkey said:
i would gladly email you the file but i can't figure out how to use the forum to do so....
Click to expand...

You can post directly to the discussion. Click on the "Reply" button, then click on "Go Advanced". When that window opens, click on the paperclip icon next to the yellow smiley face. Another window opens. Click on "Add Files", then "Browse". Select file and click on "Open", then "Upload File". When the file is uploaded, click on "Insert Inline" at the bottom right of the window. The file should now be attached to your post. You can also type in comments, or add additional files. Hope this helps. You can play around in the "Area 51" section of the forum to try out posting and attachments.
 
sooner.boomer said:
You can post directly to the discussion. Click on the "Reply" button, then click on "Go Advanced". When that window opens, click on the paperclip icon next to the yellow smiley face. Another window opens. Click on "Add Files", then "Browse". Select file and click on "Open", then "Upload File". When the file is uploaded, click on "Insert Inline" at the bottom right of the window. The file should now be attached to your post. You can also type in comments, or add additional files. Hope this helps. You can play around in the "Area 51" section of the forum to try out posting and attachments.
Click to expand...


Thanks ill have to play around in area 51 to teach my self.



Later today i plan on posting up puctures of making my md bt. Does anyone out there have a carbon fiber or glass tube they can weigh for me? The specs are 38mm and 36" long.
 
how many wraps of carbon? what is the density of your resin? there's a lot of variables which will differ from someone else's tubing vs. your own.
 
I think air and gravity are your enemy... to turn your enemies against each other... drop a rocket from a weather balloon and light off the engine at terminal velocity going down. Call it meteor research... :)
 
 
I'm guessing it died. Anyone who can't figure out how to attach a file probably shouldn't be designing a M6+ rocket.
 
Screw all the naysayers, and build what you intend to fly. Test after test and constant tweaking in design will get you to your goal. Just remember, be safe about everything you do. God speed.


Sent from my iPhone using Rocketry Forum
 
Hyppersonic_Monkey,

Even if your project never flies the commitment at doing so will benefit you your entire life. Ambitious goal setting backed by scholarism is rare. Fear of ignorance even rarer. Persistence in the face of universal doubt rarer still.

Sometimes it’s the journey that’s most important.

Feckless
 
Monkey,
How about a status report?
Been a year since first post.
Not a nay sayer here, the Loki hit 3900 mph with 1940's tech

M
 
Feckless Counsel said:
Hyppersonic_Monkey,

Even if your project never flies the commitment at doing so will benefit you your entire life. Ambitious goal setting backed by scholarism is rare. Fear of ignorance even rarer. Persistence in the face of universal doubt rarer still.

Sometimes it’s the journey that’s most important.

Feckless
Click to expand...

Project is still on going. Since everyone thinks I'm crazy for trying to do this I have run into a lot of challenges. I am working threw these and learning on my way.

Any one who has seen my fugly fly they can back me up on my builds and speeds.

This winter I have a few projects in mind. Tho if I buy a house this project goes on a back burner. As soon as I get more info I will be posting.

Thanks for asking
 

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