What keeps you from flying hybrids/What needs to be improved?

[Damian]

NICE!!!!

D

 

[Pem Tech]

Of all the problems stated, the one I have no problem with is complexity. I am a "Do it myself" kind of guy that reloads my own ammo, fletches my own arrows, pours my own candles, maintains my own Jeeps, dips my own igniters (as soon as the kit arrives) and scratch builds almost all my rockets.
So, BRING ON THE COMPLEXITY!

Now, start up cost for GSE and motor hardware is a major factor. That is, after selecting which type of hybrid as well as casing manufacturer. Then there is the Dark Art of Electronics, at least for those of us with no experience in that area.

But, with the ongoing legal battle concerning HPR motors, hybrids seem to be a safe bet for the near future.

 

[fyrechaser]

I'm still waiting for Aerotech to bring back thier hybrid systems........

Tap....tap....tap

Now would be a good time!


Jim
NAR/TRA L3

 

[doug_man_sams]

Originally posted by fyrechaser
I'm still waiting for Aerotech to bring back thier hybrid systems........

Tap....tap....tap

Now would be a good time!

Jim,

While you're waiting, Tim Sapp might be able to give you a good deal on some HyperTek stuff

Doug

 

[fyrechaser]

Hiya Doug!

I had a good sign from Gary a few months ago that AT was looking at bringing back thier Hybrid line. Very attractive to me because only a few items are needed for GSE. No complicated and expensive pad equipment.

I think Tim has some Contrail hardware now as well!


Jim

 

[edwardw]

Jim,

Alpha Hybrids should have a nice New Year present for everyone


Edward

 

[Dan]

Well,

I have purchased my first hybrid motor, an SRS 580 case. I have not flown it as of yet, since I still need to get some GSE pieces together. GSE for me will cost about $450, but that's because I'm going with the hybrid system and new N20 tank from pratt.

I'd like to see the hand-fill style motors come out, since you don't need to wait for the motor to vent on the pad, can transport a full tank, etc.

But really, since I have an LEUP, nothing will ever replace solids for me. Hybrid motors just can't match the effects and thrust curves of motors having similar total impulse. Plus I can have my choice of a dozen different propellant types w/ solids. Performance and effects are my main problem with hybrids. If someone could make a hybrid motor that matched the throaty roar and smoke column of a J570, I'd fly exclusively hybrids...

 

[fyrechaser]

Originally posted by edwardw
Jim,

Alpha Hybrids should have a nice New Year present for everyone


Edward

Cool Edward! Looking forward to it!

Jim
NAR/TRA L3

Edit: I do check the Alpha Hybrids website periodicaly for updates, I'll keep checking!

 

[quickburst]

Originally posted by ContrailRockets
Yes, this is True fyrechaser...
But you have to remember how much you will save in the long run over AP Motors, as well as the hastle of an ATF Permit.

Not necessarily. The e-matches and black powder needed for ejection charges will still require a permit. So in that respect, Hybrids and APCP are equal.

I don't mean to crap on your post, and I mean no disrespect. I am only presenting the facts.

 

[Dan]

Not necessarily. The e-matches and black powder needed for ejection charges will still require a permit. So in that respect, Hybrids and APCP are equal.

I agree, and although you may save a few bucks after the initial investment, you will have to deal with the extra hassle and low performance of hybrids.

No offense, but I saw a sparky K hybrid a few weeks ago, and it was pathetic. I've seen more sparks come out of an EX H motor.

I guess like large flames and lots of smoke more than a smallish flame with very little smoke.



$0.02

 

[edwardw]

Jim,

The website is woefully out of date. Just don't have the time in the day to deal with it at present. Hopefully in the next month or so I'll be able to put some time to it. Just busy with life!

Edward

 

[fyrechaser]

Originally posted by edwardw
Jim,

The website is woefully out of date. Just don't have the time in the day to deal with it at present. Hopefully in the next month or so I'll be able to put some time to it. Just busy with life!

Edward

Certainly understandable Edward. Life has to come first!


Jim

 

[edwardw]

So I just read this thread again front to back and found the main issue with hybrids is GSE. Seems too expensive, complex and has a high fiddle factor. I think the best thing anyone looking to hybrids can do to familiarize themselves with GSE and its purpose is attend a launch and help with setting up a hybrid flight. You'll get first hand experience and see what is involved, all the other tools you'll have to get and an overview of the process. That would require you logging off TRF and getting some real world experience. That and the motivation to learn something new.

Edward

 

[denverdoc]

Ed,

Well put. I certainly hope to expand my horizons this upcoming year and look forward to flying some hybrids. Now that I have finally unpacked, can see the garage floor in spots, and have most of my power tools set up, I plan to start building again. One of the projects we discussed was using the tank as a nose cone and putting the recovery gear in between that and the motor, and slicing the fuel lines at deployment. I'm still interested in pursuing that project--maybe fly it at MHM. Let me know.

John S

 

[Daedalus]

Originally posted by nialloswald
It would seem that knowing how much NOx is in the tank would be very handy, as others have said a lot of HyperTek/hybrid issues are to do with this.

One idea I had, for smaller motors primarily, would be to have two small tanks of NOx at the pad, each with a solenoid valve, connected into a T-piece. Obviously you'd need one more channel on your launch controller, but this way if you ran out half way through the fill you could continue the fill from the second tank and then swap out the empty one when you had a chance.

Just an thought, my idea was to reduce the problems of running out of NOx and to avoid lugging huge heavy cylinders about for smaller motors.

Does this make sense? Effectively you'd just have two fill switches, or one fill switch and a 'tank selector' switch.

It doesn't even need to be a solenoid - you could use a motor drive valve / remote bottle opener as used in car systems before the solenoid - or possibly a non-return valve on the main bottle and a reserve bottle with a pyro-actuated valve for emergency use only.

Weighing is a good idea but in addition with twin bottles would let you use the known remnants of a bottle for chill down and preliminary fill and a good bottle for top-off giving a maximum fill of Nox.

 

[Ramjet]

My L1 bird is a Mars Lander. A 29/240 is MAXED out length, actually over mfg recommended length. So, the Hybrids are WAAAAY too long for me.
Yes, GSE is expensive, but I've got email saying a fellow club member has it and will bring it to launches on request.
Low thrust? I like it. I'm using the over long casing to get it !
H128 is the recommended size but I like the slow flight an H97 gives me.

Make a Hybrid H-97 in a 29mm dia240mm or less length and I'll buy it today.

Ramjet

 

[edwardw]

Build another rocket!

Edward

 

[fyrechaser]

Build a lot more rockets!



Jim
NAR/TRA L3

 

[Ramjet]

Originally posted by edwardw
Build another rocket!

Edward

I am, A BIGGER Mars Lander, Same issue. Needs a Short Fat Motor. 38mm or possibly 54mm if I mod it. MAX Length of complete motor is around 12".
Mebbe I should Really mod it and go with a spread 4 cluster of 29mm's...
Nasty if I get a no light on one tho....

3FNC is boring. Gotta go retro futuristic models.
If I get around to building my 1.8X Explorer Aquarius Upscale it'll take long ones.

I'm working on a Discovery design from 2001, That could take a longer motor...
But it's still just in the computer. Very complex design.

Ramjet