Shipping motors

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mjennings

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So I just found out that I will be relocating, last time we moved the moving company was squeamish about my rockets let alone the motors. It wasn't a big deal as we had planned to drive one car so the motors road with me. This time we are seriously considering shipping both cars and flying. I have probably 89 1/8A - D12 BP motors and an E30-4T APCP motor. If the moving company won't move them how do I go about shipping them to myself legally? Do I just show go to the post office and say I would like to ship some hazardous material? Or is there a better way to help them help me? Thanks
 
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I'm not sure if the post office will ship them, although it never hurts to ask. You should also check with UPS and FedEx. It should be legal for either UPS or FedEx to ship as long as the boxes are marked and are sent surface only.
 
I'm not sure if the post office will ship them, although it never hurts to ask. .....


341.22 Mailable Explosives

The following specific types of explosives may be mailed only when the applicable conditions are met. Full responsibility rests with the mailer to comply with Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) regulations before mailing.
Toy Propellant Devices. The proper shipping name for a toy propellant device is “model rocket motor” or “igniters.” A toy propellant device assigned UN0454 or NA0323 and classed as a Division 1.4S explosive is eligible for mailing in domestic mail via surface transportation only when prior written permission has been obtained from the manager, Product Classification, USPS Headquarters, Washington, DC. A device approved for mailing is subject to the following conditions:
Each device must be ignitable by electrical means only; contain no more than 30 g (1.07 oz) of propellant; and produce less than 80 newton seconds of total impulse with thrust duration not less than 0.050 second.
Each device must be constructed so that all chemical ingredients are preloaded into a cylindrical paper or similarly constructed nonmetallic tube that does not fragment into sharp, hard pieces; must be designed so that it will not burst under normal conditions of use; must be incapable of spontaneous ignition under 500° F; and must not contain any type of explosive or pyrotechnic warhead other than a small, activation–charge, parachute–recovery system.
Each mailpiece containing approved devices must be prepared for mailing following Packaging Instruction 1A in Appendix C. A shipper’s declaration for dangerous goods is required.

https://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52c3_018.htm
 
Do you have a dealer somewhat local? If so, the path of least resistance is to get them to do the shipping for you.

The USPS will grant one-time shipping permission, but what it takes to get that I'm not sure. Call your local Postmaster and explain the situation to them, and ask if you can get such permission.

I'd suggest doing your homework in advance and have a copy of the appropriate manufacturer DOT approvals in your hands, and offer to provide them to the Postmaster.

-Kevin
 
thanks that's the info I was looking for, I don't know any vendors in the Philly area as I haven't been able to make many club lunches the last several years, any ideas where I can get copies of the DOT papers for aerotech and Estes?
 
looks like this one is pretty usefull to https://pe.usps.com/widgets/hyperli...TION, USPS HEADQUARTERS, WASHINGTON, DC #hit0

after talking to UPS you need to be DOT Haz Mat certified to ship via Haz Mat contract with them, I'm assuming FedEx is the same way. Has anyone gotten a permission letter from the Product Classification Manager of the USPS before? Looking for time frame if you have as I don't have a transfer date but it will very likely be before thanksgiving. Thanks again everybody.
 
I wonder if shipping a car involves all the same rules as shipping other items through USPS, UPS, FedEx, etc. Would it be OK to put them in the trunk of the car and ship the car? Is it going on a car hauler, or are you paying someone to drive it?

You've got a few hundred bucks worth of motors, but I wonder if it would make more sense to just unload them locally and buy them again at your destination. You might lose money on it, but some things are just not worth the PITA.
 
The car goes on a car hauler if it's done the same way as last time, they were very explicit not to leave stuff in the car last time. The company will pay to ship stuff the movers won't take it's just a mater of how.
 
after talking to UPS you need to be DOT Haz Mat certified to ship via Haz Mat contract with them, I'm assuming FedEx is the same way. Has anyone gotten a permission letter from the Product Classification Manager of the USPS before? Looking for time frame if you have as I don't have a transfer date but it will very likely be before thanksgiving. Thanks again everybody.

Yes, UPS and FedEx both require you go through their HAZMAT training before they'll accept HAZMAT shipments from you.

For what you want to ship, USPS is the best (and cheapest) route. There's a process for getting approval for one-off shipments; your Postmaster is your best resource for that.

-Kevin
 
A commercial mover can not accept them for transport as all rocket motors are hazmat in commercial transport. If they accepted and transported them. and were caught doing it, they would be fined thousands of dollars.

The motors could be shipped by a hazmat certified shipper under DOT-SP 7887 if they are a signatory to it, and if the motors are properly packaged, labeled and marked. Packaging and labeling would cost ~$15 in addition to a ~$30 hazmat fee and the regular ground shipping costs.

All Estes BP motors of D impulse and lower and any APCP motor with not more than 30 grams of propellant are USPS mailable if you have a letter from the Postal Service granting you permission to mail them. They must be packaged and labeled properly as per USPS regulations and send by surface mail only. It takes a couple months to get written permission from the USPS. Call customer services at Estes and explain your situation and ask if you could use their letter. If you can, you only have to [pay the ground mailing cost as the USPS does not charge any additional fees.

Bob
 
thanks Bob, I called a haz mat cert'ed company and they quoted me $600 for my 7 lbs (including current container) worth of LPR motors. I also have an email out to the local clubs seeing if they know of any vendors in the area who may be helpful. I was worried about the time line, as a couple of months is likely longer than I'll have (hope to have a start date soon and the move will likely be before Thanksgiving). I will give Estes a call this evening and see what they say.

Back up plan is I found out that my uncle who lives in Maryland drives to see family in the area at least once a year so that is my backup plan, I had hoped he was planning on coming in for Thanksgiving but they aren't coming again till next year and they aren't sure when. Plus then they have to remember them and hopefully they won't get thrown in a garage and temp cycle.
 
Curious to see what options you came up with. I am moving cross country as well. In less than three weeks (yikes!).

I am also planning to ship my car. I've probably got 8 reloads for my 29/40-120 casing, 20 for my 18/20 casing, and 4-5 for my 24/40. Not to mention tons of BP motors. Current "plan" is the hope that my wife will be driving. Would really like to have a backup in place. Besides trying to sell them and buy new ones out in UT.
 
Bill

For Estes Motors call Estes and speak with Mary Roberts. Kevin (Troj) above is right I have the paperwork for up to D BP motors. I need to call AT today and see if they will do similar for my lone AT E. Mary was very specific on following the rules to the letter otherwise Estes' ability to ship motors could be revoked and none of us want that. As long as the reloads are less then 80N-s it should be fine but if you're over the G line, get out and burn them or sell them, I think are your only options unless you can get some one who is haz mat certified to ship them for you. Good luck on your move.
 
An update

So my collection of Estes motors have successfully been shipped and received at my parents house, took 2 days longer than USPS said it would but no worries, I'll inventory them while house hunting next week to look for obvious mishandling.

Called AT they called back after several days, asked me to send them an e-mail which I did, and haven't heard anymore.
 
Called AT they called back after several days, asked me to send them an e-mail which I did, and haven't heard anymore.

That seems to be par for the course with AT - I wonder if their spam filter is a little too restrictive (more accurately, I would like to believe that rather than the alternative).
 
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