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stealth6

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Joined
May 1, 2011
Messages
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Location
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This has been a dream for a long, long time, and many years in the making. I present to you my (finally completed!) ultimate touring bike.

nxxtour completed.jpg
Bit of background….I’m a lifelong cyclist, with long distance unsupported touring as my main passion. I do lots of other types of riding…road/mountain/gravel/commuting/etc. ……but if I had to choose just one, it would be loaded touring. Some of my longer tours have included 3 months all over New Zealand, up and down the Baja peninsula, Canada to Mexico along the Great Divide, etc. I tour on paved roads, gravel (or “metal” as they say in EnZed) roads, singletrack, and “other”. I’ve owned/ridden custom-built bikes in the past, but I’ve been dreaming of “the perfect bike” for a very long time…all along tweaking details in my mind, and honing in on exactly what I wanted. And for the past couple of years I’ve been actively working toward that goal. And now it’s “done”, the journey of building that bike has been completed, and I’m VERY much looking forward to doing some actual bike-tour journeys with it.
Note that in these modern days, “bikepacking” has become something of a thing. This bike is more along the lines of traditional “bike touring”, as opposed to “bikepacking”. My approach and style are something of a crossover of the two, but optimized more towards the touring side.
  • It starts with the frame. I designed and commissioned a titanium frame with every tiny detail exactly what I wanted….geometry of course with an absolutely dialed in fit, but also tubing specs, strength/compliance considerations, cable routing, braze-ons and mounts, space/clearance for tires and gear, compatibility with other components, etc. A LOT of time and thought was put into the design of this. I was going to have a fork custom built as well, but I found that the Surly Bridge Club fork was pretty much exactly what I would have designed myself, they are well made, and relatively inexpensive (compared to custom-built) so I went with one of those.

  • I’m using Redshift ShockStop suspension post and stem. Well made, clean design, and makes long days in the saddle (on sometimes very rough terrain) a lot more comfy. I’ve used both of these on my gravel bike and really like them.

  • Bar and saddle….using my trusty Salsa Cowchipper bars, which I’m a huge fan of. Been riding one for many years already. I’ve been using Brooks saddles (Swift and B17) for decades and love them. For this bike I’m going with their C17 Cambium, which I’ve again been using on my gravel bike for a while and liking.

  • Wheelset. I built up (yes, I hand build my own wheels) a truly bombproof wheelset. DT Swiss 540 tandem hubs, Alpine III spokes (36h), and Ryde Sputnik rims. They are heavy as all get-up, but as indestructible as can be, which is pretty much necessary for loaded touring (in sometimes rough conditions in very remote places). Paired with my favourite gravel/touring tire, Clement/Donnely’s X’Plor MSO in 50x700c. And yes I still use tubes (I kinda hate tubeless).

  • Phil Wood bottom bracket, and Cook Brothers E-cranks. Pretty old-school, but exactly what I want. The Phil bb allows me to dial in a perfect chainline (which is important if you are running an equally old-school triple chainring, which I am). Been riding and abusing Cooks cranks for well over 30 years, and they’ve never let me down….so sticking with it. Oh, and these are all (again, old-school) square taper. Also using Syncros Crank-O-Matics for easy servicing in the field and remote places

  • Drivetrain…..yeah this is where things get real interesting, and probably downright weird to some folks, ‘specially the young-uns. First off, I’m going with 9-speed…..reliable, versatile, simple, and just plain works…especially for my needs. Second, I’m going with a triple chainring, for much the same reasons. Third I’m going with thumbshifters. WHAT?, you say? On drop bars? Here’s the thing…I LOVE thumbshifters, and have never abandoned them through all the years, since before indexed shifting even became a thing. They are super reliable, work great, are simple and easy to use and take care of, and ergonomically for me they just make sense. AND they can be easily switched to friction mode in the case of damage or problems in the field (remember, a lot of the time I’m not just on a day ride and can just take my bike to the shop before my next ride). In fact the front is always in friction mode (which means that I can micro-trim the position at any moment due to chain rub….which is super annoying that you can’t do with indexed front shifters). Thankfully (for me!) in this modern age, MicroShift actually makes thumbshifters patterned after my old favourite Suntour XCPros in 9 speed!. (they actually make 10/11/12 speed too). The only real problem is that you can’t really use them (as is) on drop bars……..so I custom made my own (hinged clamp) mounts. Yes, I know that Paul Eng. makes ones that could work, and I’ve used them on other bikes, but I like the Suntour-style ones so much better ergonomically.
    Lastly, my gearing range is huge. Super low gears (for climbing steep/rough terrain on a fully loaded bike), and plenty big enough gears for cruising on smooth flats, with plenty of useful steps in between. For you bike nerds out there, the numbers look like this……my low (using 20 x 36) is 16.32 gear inches, and my high (using 42 x 11) is 104.16. That’s a 612% spread…..try that with your 1x mullet rigs, kiddos.

  • Brakes…..mechanical discs. Don’t ever want to deal with hydraulics (maintenance, repairs, etc.) when I’m “out there”, and mech. discs work fantastically well, are very reliable, and simple to maintain.

  • Cages…..again with the old school. I’ve been using the same old WTB “bomber” cages since the early nineties. These allow me to use pretty much any 1.5 litre water bottle available at any convenience store…..which are great bottles, cheap, and nice and big.

  • Racks and bags……can’t go wrong with my trusty (and again, very old-school) Tubus racks and Ortlieb bags. Simply the best, most reliable, most versatile touring racks/bags available, as they have been for decades. My racks are also multi-position, allowing me to put the bags where they make the most sense for the conditions (low for cruising paved roads, higher up for clearance on tight singletrack, etc.)

  • Pedals….this is something of a new departure for me. I’ve always used clipless pedals on all my bikes, including touring. But for touring they present a bit of an issue. See, proper shoes for clipless pedals need to have pretty stiff soles. Which makes them awful to walk/hike in. And when I tour I also do a fair bit of walking/hiking (town days, days off the bike, side excursions, etc.). There ARE lots of “bike touring” and/or “dual purpose” bike shoes made out there that in theory are good for cycling and walking……the problem is that they just aren’t. They all, in fact, suck. It’s one of the those “best of both worlds” situations that are in reality the worst of both worlds…..they aren’t good for cycling OR walking. In the past I’ve done some custom tweaking to try and make something that was good for both, but pretty much failed every time. And so I’ve mostly ended up bringing two pair of shoes…one for on the bike, and one for off. But I hate doing that and never was happy with that either.
    So this time I’m going with a new plan. I’m going to use my regular hiking/trekking/everyday shoes, but I’m pairing them with these new Catalyst pedals from Pedaling Innovations. The main thing about them is that the platform is huge….kinda ridiculously so. But the idea is that they pretty much support the whole shoe, so flexibility in the (hiking) shoe is not a problem. I’ve been experimenting with them on my gravel bike, and so far I kinda like them.

  • Flickstand. Been out of production for decades, but have been a “must have’ item for all my tours over the years. If you don’t know them, they are a little down-tube mounted bracket that has a wire bail that you can flick down and “lock” against your front tire. This keeps the wheel from rolling AND the fork from turning………which makes your bike a rigid structure that you can easily and safely lean against pretty much anything, without it wanting to twist, roll, and fall over. WAY better than any sort of kickstand, leaning pole, wheel/brake strap, or any other such solution, AND it’s small, light, quick, and easy.
    The problem is that they have been, as mentioned, out of production and unavailable for many years, and they were never really made to fit the tubing size I have on this bike. So, I needed to be do fair amount of tweaking, fabrication, and customization to make it work. But very much worth it for me (like I said, it’s a “must have”).
I'm going to go for a ride,
s6
 
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Awesome build.

As a more casual rider who sucks at climbing (which I discovered a few years ago is likely heavily contributed to by a congenital birth defect that has no major symptoms other than lifelong aerobic underperformance), I'm somewhat dismayed at the death of three-ring cranksets on cross-country MTBs. I still have 3x9 on my old hardtail, and I use all the gears. Knowing how I use my bike and its gearing, it's inconceivable to me that 2x10 or 2x11 could actually work as well. Just seems like the victory of marketing over common sense, to me.
 
That sounds like an awesome build. I built a Surly Cross Check as a commuter/gravel/touring/light mtb a while back and it is an incredible workhorse. I kept with a 2x9 drivetrain and bar end shifters. I didn't care much for indexed shifters built into the brake levers. I like the Brooks B17. I will probably upgrade my mountain bike to the Cambium model. I have a set of Shimano combo flat/DPD pedals. I ride clipless solo, but whenever I ride with my son I ride with Vans on the flats.

I wish my Cross Check frame had braze on mounts for disc brakes. I have hydraulic disc brakes on my mountain bike, but I would go with mechanical BB7 on the Cross bike if I could. V brakes with the salmon kool stop pads still give me good stopping power.

I enjoy wrenching my bikes and have built them from the frame up myself. Except for wheels. I leave those to the pros. I should just practice more amd get good at it.
 
Wheels aren't that hard to do. GIve it a try. Then you can do stuff like a rear wheel that's got heavy, 3 or 4 cross spokes on the freewheel side, and radial or maybe 1 or 2 cross light gauge spokes on the other side. This makes the ones on the other side much less likely to periodically go slack and fatigue. For bikes that don't have disc or drum brakes, you can make the front wheels radial, at least if the hubs are beefy enough around the spoke holes. Then you can route all the spokes around the outside, instead of half in and half out. (i.e. the heads are all on the inside, but the spoke emerges from the hole in the hub on the outside.) I've done a couple of radial front wheels. but have yet to make any rear wheels with different numbers of crosses on each side.

I hardly ever ride, since I've had unpleasant experiences with cars and live close to town. But they just put in a new bike path nearby. If I can figure out when the pedestrians and roller bladers stay inside...
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Stealth6's bike looks very nice. I'm sure I'd enjoy something like that if I had one. My own dream bike would have enclosed gears, and maybe an enclosed chain, too, or a belt. I don't enjoy cleaning chains all the time. I do have an ancient Motobecane that's heavy, but very comfortable to ride. It has a badge proudly proclaiming that it's made from 1020 steel. (kind of like gas pipe, I think). However, a previous owner put nice alloy wheels and a triple chainwheel up front.
 
P.S. Around here, it's probably prudent to paint any really nice bike with sloppy camouflage paint, or something like that. At least if going closer to the city.
 
P.S. Around here, it's probably prudent to paint any really nice bike with sloppy camouflage paint, or something like that. At least if going closer to the city.
I had a basic 10 speed Schwinn with suicide shifters that I bought at a Church rummage sale and badly spray painted orange in college. It was still stolen. After that I decided that a brake less, fixed gear with egg beater pedals was the way to go on campus. At least then it would be entertaining to watch the thief ride off and do a face plant.
 
Nobody ever touched my 3 speed, even after I put an alloy front rim on it so I could stop in the rain. With radial spokes. And somewhat better pedals. And drop bars. Unless you count the guy who clobbered it with his truck, decades later, while I was on it. Thinking back, it seems the only original parts left, that I can recall, are the rear hub (except for the cog, which is 21 or 23 teeth instead of 17), the crank set (ugh!). Maybe the seat post? Head set? It had the original frame before that truck. Some of the gears in the rear hub have been replaces, too.
 
Just seems like the victory of marketing over common sense, to me.
Ding, ding, ding.......we have a winner!

I do use a "compact" double on my road bike (Campy Record 10spd, and yes I also use indexed/SDI "brifters" on it as well).
But absolutely give me a triple for a touring bike, and even a mountain bike, please (and thumbshifters!).
I do comprehend the logic that a lot of folks use for justifying 1x rigs for "modern" mountain biking.......I just don't agree with it.
And I also believe that a large percentage of folks go with it because.......well.....a lot of folks go with it (and that's what the marketing tells them that they want).

s6
 
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Wheels aren't that hard to do. GIve it a try.
Two tips....

1. Get yourself a copy of "The Bicycle Wheel", by Jobst Brandt. THE definitive reference on building bike wheels. First published in 1981 and all still completely relevant and timeless information. My own copy is the "Third Edition" and was published in 1993. This is what you need for the technical and step-by-step side of things. This is really all you NEED.

2. Spend some time with an old-school wheel building guru. There IS a bit of art/craft to it, and the best way to learn and absorb that side of things is from a mentor who has "the touch". I was lucky enough to learn from someone who was a bit of a master, and during my 13 years working in bike shops I built hundreds of wheels....some for some pretty famous folk. You don't actually NEED to to do this )and you can build wheels straight "by the book"), but doing so will make a pretty dig difference in the quality, durability, performance, and reliability of your wheels.

Bonus tip...........knowing when your wheel is "done". In the final stages of tensioning and truing a freshly built wheel, you are making very small adjustments. At some point you will be down to just a couple of spots that need just a tiny tweak. Do those tweaks and "stress" the wheel (squeeze the spokes, bounce the wheel - semi-gently - on the floor, push the rim side to side a bit). You will likely find that you now need to do a couple more small adjustments.....do them and stress the wheel again. Keep repeating this process until you reach the point when stressing the wheel does not produce any more small errors. This is when your wheel is done.

s6
 
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I use a 1x9 on my mountain bike with a bash guard in place of the large ring for protection from rocks and logs. I also still run 26" wheels on my mountain bike, but I feel like I have to succumb to the planned obsolescence by the marketing departments for a 29" 10 speed whenever I can't replace or repair the bits I own.
 
sheldonbrown.com has lots of interesting info about wheels and many other bicycle related things. Alas, Mr. Brown, who I once met, Harris Cyclery, and even our local bike shop are no more. The site lives on, though. The writings of John Allen live there too, and, to my knowledge, the man is still with us. He's quite thorough, as I recall. I think there is also info there from Jobst Brandt.

My own wheel building started with information from a small booklet whose name I forget, though it was quite helpful.
 
I do comprehend the logic that a lot of folks use for justifying mullet rigs for "modern" mountain biking.......I just don't agree with it.
And I also believe that a large percentage of folks go with it because.......well.....a lot of folks go with it (and that's what the marketing tells them that they want).

s6

Is "mullet" now the term for two-chainring bikes with the enormous cassettes?

I thought a mullet was my old 1998 S-Works M2 with a new disc fork and V-brakes on the frame out back. It's retired to pavement/utility/beater status now with a Surly 1x1.

My "new" bike was put together in around 2007 or 2008 from an ex-Ryan Trebon custom Kona hardtail frame. Built up the rest with XT-ish components. It's the only bike I've ridden in my adult life big enough for my 6'4" frame. No reason to ever get rid of it.
 
Actually the term "mullet" is used in a few different ways.

One is using different sized wheels front and back.
Another is an actual company called Mullet Cycles (that does the different wheel sized thing).

I'm using the term, how a lot of folks are doing these days, when describing a "mullet drivetrain".
This is a way some folks are getting lower gears, with a wider range, for drop-bar bikes.....typically when using a single chainring and no front derailleur.
Basically it's using a drop-bar "road" shifter, paired with a wide range "mountain" cassette and derailleur.
This can be tricky to do, and it requires some specific components, as these setups are not really made to be compatible with each other.
This does allow for lower/wider-range gearing typically found on modern mountain bikes, but when using drop bars (such as on a gravel, cyclocross, or some "drop-bar atb" bikes).
But it doesn't come anywhere near close to what I'm running on my touring rig.

Kids these days,
s6
 
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I grew up riding bikes everywhere, then cars...

I still have my 1999 Dimond back racing X2 mountain bike.

20230620_190823.jpg

Trusty specs: medium aluminum frame, full suspension, Marzocchi Z2 front fork (100mm?), Fox vanilla rear coil over shock, 3x9 drivetrain, v brakes, carbon bars on a Titec neck, shortend seat post (no dropper here), 26" wheels, maxxis tires 26x2.3, 33lbs.

I bought a used set of wheels with rotor mounts on the hubs, I bought hydraulic disk brakes and need to weld/modify the mounts for calipers.

I just started riding single track about 2 years ago. It's a totaly different atmosphere and seeing the latest and greatest geometry, 29" tractor tires and 3' wide bars is something. I can keep up with the new stuff, just have to work hard.
 
I put a CaneCreek Thudbuster ST seat post on my commuter bike, not exactly the same technology, it has an elastomer/damper instead of a spring, but it also made a big difference in avoiding fatigue in my lower back on longer rides and makes gravel off roading a lot more tolerable.
 
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Cool Stuff!!! I have a Trek 520 2nd-hand frame, 2nd-hand bar and bar ends, put fenders front and back (I live in Western Oregon and ride all year, all weather), Schmitt(sp?) front dynamo hub and headlight, cargo racks front and back and I LOVE my Bike!!! My Wife and I also have a Burley brand 2 wheel flatbed bike trailer we can load with all sorts of things.

I bike to hike, bike to go skateboarding (and train for slalom like in my picture) with skateboard stuff on the trailer, bike with my loaded panniers and backpack to go launch rockets or fly my RC Gliders or Freeflight gliders, bike to go grocery shopping and run errands usually.

In fact, I generally don't take up a hobby unless I can get to where I do it on my bike. We have 2 small trucks between us that we have to make ourselves drive because my Wife and I both prefer to bike most of the time.
 
I put a CaneCreek Thudbuster ST seat post on my commuter bike, not exactly the same technology, it has an elastomer/damper instead of a spring, but it also made a big difference in avoiding fatigue in my lower back on longer rides and makes gravel off roaring a lot more tolerable.
I put one of those on my MTB when I was commuting to work every day. I had a really sore back at one point (caused by something else) and the Thudbuster was amazing. I still have it, just in case I need it again.
 
That’s nice. I used to do biathlon (run-bike-run) and time trials. I did a exactly one criterium race. I still have a 58cm Gianna Motta racing bike in the US flag color scheme, but I have always wanted a full-up touring bike like the old Fuji models.
I’m also a big fan of the Flick Stand. Awesome piece of gear.
Note to self- see if Rivendell bicycles is still in business.
 

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