Estes Altimeter First Look

[Initiator001]

The new Estes 2013 catalog features an altimeter unit on the back cover.

There has been some speculation about the unit and it's features.

I have been provided one of these unit to fly and test out.

The Estes Altimeter features a four-digit LCD readout, replaceable battery, anchor point, memory storage for up to ten flights and displays peak altitude in feet or meters (Max altitude is 10,000 feet or 3000 meters).

There is a seperate power switch and function button.

The unit has an overall length of 2 3/8", if the anchor flange is not included the length is 1 13/16" (44mm). The diameter is almost 18mm, a tight fit in BT-20 tubing but Centuri/Semroc ST-8 size tube should work fine. Weight is 14grams. Operating temperature is 41-100 degrees F.

I have flown the altimeter a several times and it's readings are within 2% of those recorded from 'other' altimeter units flown in the same rocket/motor combination.

The availablilty of Estes products in hobby shops and with a SRP of around $30-$35 should see many rocketeers flying these altimeters.

 

[stealth6]

First - there was some speculation when this first appeared that it was a rebranded Jolly Logic. It seems pretty clear that is not the case, correct?

Second - that "operating temperature": I wonder how much this could effectively be pushed. I know for a fact that I operate beyond those extremes on both ends (winter flying well under 41 deg., and desert summer flying where it can easily be well above 100 deg. inside a dark nose cone). I'd like to see results of someone testing this in "extreme" conditions (which are in fact pretty normal in my world).

Seems like a great price point - I bet they sell LOTS.

s6

 

[RoyAtl]

First - there was some speculation when this first appeared that it was a rebranded Jolly Logic. It seems pretty clear that is not the case, correct?
s6

Jolly Logic responded that they had nothing to do with the Estes product.

 

[be69ar]

...just a short note...first of all, I appreciate Bob taking the time to test one of the early prototypes. However, I want to make it clear that almost all of this altimeter design work was completed by Mike Dorffler before he passed away...with the exception of the case shape and the 10 launch event memory...so while it is small and sort of round like an AO, this was one of MD's last electronic projects and we wanted to present it as intended. As for the temperature range comment, I am working to get a better picture (perhaps some environmental chamber testing) to validate the prototype specs. We understand that this is not an AO...our audiance is a little different than John's and while we did not work together on the project, John was encouraging to us...and the retail was set at $34.99 including the 6V alkaline battery...so it will be ready to use out of the package.
Mike

 

[Rex R]

I would imgine that the lower temp limit is mainly due to the battery and upper limit is the display. as for exterieor size and shape...yet another demo of 'form follows function'(as rocketeers we should already be familer ith that adage ).
looks good Mike.
rex

 

[Davidtmp]

hey Mike, will these be able to be put in the tube and not be damaged by bp charges? No need for payload section?

 

[nute]

Is there any ability to export info from here to a PC?

 

[scsager]

Is there any ability to export info from here to a PC?

No export function at all - this is simply a maximum altitude display.

Very similar to the Jolly Logic "Altimeter One" except the Estes altimeter has an alkaline replaceable battery vs the rechargeable battery in the Altimeter one. Estes also stores the most recent 10 flights.

Here is the description from the AC Supply website.

A must have for all rocketeers! And a great price too. The Estes Altimeter has a 4 digit LCD read out and displays in English or metric untis. Accurately measures model rocket launch altitutes from 0 - 9999 feet (0 - 3000 m) and can store up to 10 consecutive flights! Includes replaceable alkaline battery.

Specifications:
One-piece fully assembled unit
Includes replaceable alkaline battery.
Weight: .42 oz. (12 g)

EST2246
MSRP: $39.99
YOUR COST: $23.99

https://www.acsupplyco.com/estes/2246_altimeter.html

 

[BEC]

It's also a little larger than the AltimeterOne and heavier. Some further impressions of a pre-production sample Mike gave me at NSL here: https://www.oldrocketforum.com/showpost.php?p=165127&postcount=8

Data export is the same as with the AltimeterOne and Two - via pencil and paper.

As it turns out, the Estes Altimeter was a project of Mike Dorffler's before he became too ill to continue, and it sat for awhile until Mike Fritz had a chance to work on it. So it was a parallel development to the Altimeter One.

Love that AC Supply price. I want to get a couple of these to use with students and sample the new PS II E2X line and the new 29mm black powder Es and Fs as well.

 

[JeromeK99]

Here is the description from the AC Supply website.

A must have for all rocketeers! And a great price too. The Estes Altimeter has a 4 digit LCD read out and displays in English or metric untis. Accurately measures model rocket launch altitutes from 0 - 9999 feet (0 - 3000 m) and can store up to 10 consecutive flights! Includes replaceable alkaline battery.

Specifications:
One-piece fully assembled unit
Includes replaceable alkaline battery.
Weight: .42 oz. (12 g)

EST2246
MSRP: $39.99
YOUR COST: $23.99

https://www.acsupplyco.com/estes/2246_altimeter.html

Cool deal! I checked yesterday and they didn't have it posted!

https://www.acsupplyco.com is my favorite Estes online dealer! At least 40% off kits, accessories and motors! Plus free shipping if you spend more than $100, which is easy as we all know. Order a Blast-Off pack of motors for $41.99 and you are almost half way there! I place an order at least a few times a year. Oh, and of course no sales tax for out of state.

Cheers!

Jerome

 

[Joe V]

If you go to the Civil Air Patrol page at AC Supply, you can get the Blast Off Pack for $39.89

 

[artapplewhite]

It's also a little larger than the AltimeterOne and heavier. Some further impressions of a pre-production sample Mike gave me at NSL here: https://www.oldrocketforum.com/showpost.php?p=165127&postcount=8

Data export is the same as with the AltimeterOne and Two - via pencil and paper.

As it turns out, the Estes Altimeter was a project of Mike Dorffler's before he became too ill to continue, and it sat for awhile until Mike Fritz had a chance to work on it. So it was a parallel development to the Altimeter One.

Love that AC Supply price. I want to get a couple of these to use with students and sample the new PS II E2X line and the new 29mm black powder Es and Fs as well.

At first blush, it looks like the Estes Altimeter could be used for NAR competition, once it approved, but not for record attempts. Here are the relalent parts of the Pink Book

For Contest use: "Only commercially available altimeters approved by the NAR Contest Board and publicly announced as approved at least 60 days before any contest where they are used may be used in competition. These altimeters may not be altered or modified in any manner, including use of power sources which are outside the voltage range published by the altimeter manufacturer. An altimeter must meet the following requirements to be approved by the Contest Board: Uses barometric measurement techniques to record relative flight apogee altitude above launch pad altitude. Resolution of 2 meters or better in readout. Accuracy 2 percent of recorded altitude or 2 meters, whichever is greater. Sampling rate of 10 per second or greater. Audio or visual readout directly from the altimeter. Capable of being automatically or manually placed in a state of readiness to record new flight data. This state must be audibly or visibly verifiable. "

for Record attempts: "The altitude reported for performance records with altimeters is subject to additional requirements and review. An altitude record may be set only using a recording altimeter. Altitude records may not be set using a reporting-only altimeter. After the flight, the altimeter data will be downloaded by the contestant and reviewed by a contest official (RSO, CD, or member of the contest jury). If it is shown that a sudden peak in altitude is attributable to the ejection event or a flight anomaly, that peak will not be used to determine the recorded altitude. The maximum altitude excluding the anomalous peaks will be reported. "

So it still looks like the PerfectFlite Pnut is still the cheapest and lightest altimeter available for setting NAR records.

Art Applewhite

 

[BEC]

Yes..... agreed. The Estes Altimeter won't ever be able to be used for records. But for contests - yes - it should be approvable. It does meet all the criteria.

<other product mention> I'm hoping the Altus Metrum microPeak will get approved soon. It can record data for the first 45 seconds or so of flight - which should be enough for most rockets to reach apogee. So it should be usable for record flights. It's almost as small and is as light as an Adrel.</other product mention>

 

[John Beans]

Hey, gang.

I received my Estes Altimeter in the mail today. I ordered it from the Estes website, and it arrived right on time. I'm always interested in new rocketry products. Something about this one really struck a chord with me, so I ordered it.

Here is one sitting next to the AltimeterOne, which I dreamed up four years ago:



They both have four-digit LCDs, but the Estes altimeter uses an alkaline battery, which I know was the direction they were interested in when they were discussing having me design an altimeter for them after the AltimeterOne came out. Using a replaceable battery has some advantages, but I'm not a fan of buying and throwing away odd-shaped batteries.

The Estes altimeter arrived in a similar sort of packaging as the AltimeterOne, a plastic clamshell that is hangable.



As you can see, they are different: the Estes altimeter sits horizontal, while the AltimeterOne is at a slight angle.

Coincidentally, inside both books is a Ziploc bag with an attachment hook. Estes includes one hook, which may have the advantage of being a bit easier to snap and is larger, but I don't think there's a weight penalty because it's constructed of rather thin gauge wire. The AltimeterOne now includes two attachment aids (a hook and a split-ring), though the ring is a recent addition, and wasn't on the market when Mike was perhaps designing the Estes version.



One *very* similar aspect of the Estes Altimeter and the Jolly Logic AltimeterOne is the choice of microcontroller. It turns out that both Mike and I chose the same processor! You are looking at the only two altimeters in the world which use the Microchip PIC16F1936.

If you've used an AltimeterOne, the controls for the Estes Altimeter will be pretty familiar: press and hold the button until you see "0000," then let go. You'll see "0" when it's ready to fly. Therefore many people will be able to use it right out of the box. Seeing the 10 stored flights is a little more involved: you press the button until you see "reco" (which stands for recordings, I think, not record), then press it more times to see the various flights, counting backwards to keep track of which flight you're looking at. I think you are supposed to pull the menu up again and then choose "reco" to get out of that mode. If you lose track of what you're doing and you're not sure which flight is showing, an easy way to make sure it's showing the latest flight is to get a sharp object and cycle the power switch on the side. This is probably a good procedure for contests, if it gets approved.

In keeping with Estes prevailing manufacturing practices, the Estes Altimeter is made in China.



Jolly Logic's altimeters are designed and assembled here in the USA. Right now we do it in California, but our next product has to be assembled in an Apple-approved location, and will be in the Boston area. While we have to buy some components overseas, we try to keep the work here when we can.

My overall impression is that the Estes Altimeter is probably priced about right, especially if you can use a Hobby Lobby or other discount.

 

[sunward]

Hey, gang.

I received my Estes Altimeter in the mail today. ....

finally some product knowledge.

John, thanks.

 

[Fred Garvin]

.... the Estes Altimeter is probably priced about right, especially if you can use a Hobby Lobby or other discount.

This is how I hope to acquire one....