Dr. Zooch Saturn I Blk II SA-6 to SA-10

[illini]

If its 1/16", round, and can be painted with Krylon, don't see why not. Gotta admit I've never worked with the materials you suggest

 

[Stymye]

yep , comes in all sizes including 1/16, glues well ,and paints well.

I used it for legs on my mini alien space probe , built the tower assembly for the 4" little joe 2 out of it,and used it for the struts on the motor assembly on the gemini titan I'm currently working on. very handy stuff!

 

[illini]

Sounds great! I'm gonna look for that stuff. Thanks!

 

[GuyNoir]

Originally posted by illini
I've been all over looking for 1/16" dowels and haven't found them yet - Michael's, Walmart, two different hobby shops. 1/8" is the smallest they sell. Verrry annoying. Would really like to finish this kit, but can't find the stinkin' dowels. Anyone know where I can get 1/16" dowels online without having to pay $6 shipping (e.g., Tower Hobbies has them, but I'm not about to pay their shipping charge for what I need)???

Others pointed out my first suggestion: Evergreen or Plastruct stuff.

Did you go over to the minatures section at Michael or Hobby Lobby? I've seen small diameter stuff there for building dollhouse furniture, etc.

What about round toothpicks from a grocery store?

 

[illini]

Originally posted by narprez
Others pointed out my first suggestion: Evergreen or Plastruct stuff.

Did you go over to the minatures section at Michael or Hobby Lobby? I've seen small diameter stuff there for building dollhouse furniture, etc.

What about round toothpicks from a grocery store?

Round toothpicks are a bit too short for some of the parts I need to cut, but actually might work well for the turbine exhaust manifolds when I make the engine bells on my Saturn IB. Basically, that's where this problem started. The 3 6" dowels are sufficient for all the detailing, except you need to cut 5 (4 + 1 spare) 3/8" lengths for the turbine exhaust manifolds. Once I did that...zap! Insufficient dowel left. Will use toothpicks for the IB in order to save my dowel.

Miniatures section at Michael's is a good idea. I'll go rootin' around there if I have any trouble finding evergreen or plastistruct.

 

[illini]

Well that was annoying. Had written up my concluding post and Firefox decided to crash right when I pushed submit. Must have been a really bad post.

Don't feel like re-writing the whole thing. Summary: White garbage bag parachute would be hard to see in overcast skies. I replaced it with orange mylar. Found the dowels I needed. Overall, like the kit but wish the instructions were a bit better and that it contained sufficient material to build all the parts.

Here's a picture. First flight next weekend (weather permitting).

 

[illini]

Here's a launch pic. Flew very well on a B6-4. 'twas a bit windy today, so wasn't up for putting a C in it. Maybe next time. Also flew my Dr. Zooch Saturn IB. Didn't get a launch pic of that one (twitchy finger snapped 3 seconds too soon ). The Saturn IB was a little more squirrely. It was stable, but had a pretty large oscillation coming off the rod...probably due to the wind.

 

[sandman]

The Saturn IB was a little more squirrely.

I do believe that the "squirrlyness" is inherant in the design.

What I think happens when it's too windy, the small fins on the Saturn 1B tend to "stall" when hit by a crosswing instead of turning horizontal like a model with larger less "stallable???" fins.

Both my BT-60 version and my 2.04" Saturn 1B's and a larger 1/70th scale did the same exact squirly tail wag when launched in winds over 10 mph.

Wasn't at all attractive.

Lets face it...a scale design sometimes just doesn't like a lot of crosswind.

Still my favorite design.

 

[illini]

That's good to know. First thought was that I needed more weight in the nose, but your explanation makes sense. Thanks!

 

[Dr.Zooch]

I've been reading this string closely and sweating out every message- since it's my kit being reviewed! I'm going to amend the instructions sheet to reflect the suggestions made here. Also, EVERY Saturn I kit (SA-5 and SA-6/10) will, from this moment on, be given one additional dowel for the chill-down ducting. I just opened every box and placed one more inside. BTW- you can't find such sized dowels in the hobby store because they don't come from a hobby store- they are medical applicator sticks and thus are far higher quality wood (as well as being odd sized). I get them 5,000 at a time and they are WAY less expensive than dowels from a hobby outlet. The instruction to paint the back of the LOX tanks prior to cutting is for folks who just hate to paint... yes there are some of those out there and they have green money just like everyone else. The engine "block" isn't really "missing" from the kit- because none was ever included in the first place. I figured good rocketeers would do as was done here and simply add their own if they liked. If, however, anyone reading this has ever purchased a Dr. Zooch rocket and found a component listed in the instructions to be missing from the kit- e-mail me and I'll send the missing part out right away at my expense! These are done by hand and I can make mistakes. I can not say how much I really appreciate the suggestions made in this review. The only way to make these kits better is to have expert rocket builders, like those here, build and review the kits. Will I make changes- YOU BET! The better the kit, the better the word that spreads and the better my sales. Lastly, the kit seen here came out better than the one I built from my test kit... must be because he has higher skills than mine.

 

[illini]

Originally posted by Dr.Zooch
I've been reading this string closely and sweating out every message- since it's my kit being reviewed!

Ah HAH!!! So *that's* why you didn't call me a moon hoaxing idiot when I asked about the fins!

Seriously, folks...don't hesitate to buy these kits if you're sitting on the fence. They really are fun building, great looking, and fly well too. Drew a *lot* of comments at the NOVAAR launch last weekend. I like 'em so much I went ahead and ordered the other two Saturns to complete the set. I'm confident Wes's changes will only make already great kits even better. Looking forward to seeing what he's got in store after the Saturns...

 

[Dr.Zooch]

The hard part about amending instructions is that we printed up a ton of copies- so I have to run the first batch out before changing them. Hey- can you e-mail me those RockSim files that you adjusted? You were correct- the ones I had sent were pre-production.

 

[illini]

Incoming!

I only messed with the SA-5 and SA-6/10 files, but will send these to you ASAP.

 

[Dr.Zooch]

Got the file! Thanks.

It took quite a while to designe the designs. I started out with the free version of Rocksim, but it was not good enough for what I wanted to do. Tim Van Milligan, who owns Apogee Rockets, helped me a ton with both RockSim and tech problems with the kits. Originally I was only working on the Saturn V- that kit took 8 months to fully design for public sale.

 

[mooser]

Great review. I am putting together the IB now. I found an "easy" way to glue the fuel tank tubes. After you got them as tight as tight can be around the dowel, making sure the edges are straight, use 2 spring type clothespins. You can postion them in a way that keeps the tube rolled tight to the dowel and have a small flap to insert white glue with a toothpick. Then press down on the flap, reposition the clothespins to seal the ends and no glue mess.

 

[illini]

Good idea! I'll try that on my SA-5 kit once it arrives.

By the way...welcome to TRF!

 

[Stymye]

Annother tip on the tower is to poke or pin-drill 4 small holes for the outer lattice legs to fit snugly into the balsa capsule , add some glue and press them in . It holds the 4 tower legs nice and straight and the shroud/tower can than simply be glued level on top.
it should also help make it a little stronger as well

 

[Dr.Zooch]

I'm sending all of my buyers here to read this entire thread.

 

[rstaff3]

illini, have you thought of submitting reviews of these to EMRR? How about a review submission drag race

https://www.rocketreviews.com/forms/rr_submit.shtml

 

[illini]

I know, I know...its on my "to do" list, but never seem to get to it. Now with the new "save draft" feature on EMRR, I have little excuse for not getting started.

 

[Dr.Zooch]

After reading this over again I went about amending the instructions of all the current kits and made a few drawings as well. Anyone out there who has a Dr. Zooch kit and wants this sent to them, just e-mail me at [email protected] and tell me which kits you have and I'll PDF you the changes. Of course this won't do you much good if you've already built your rocket, but will tease you until you rip yours apart, attempt to make the changes, wreck the rocket and then have to come to me and buy another kit... so you can make the changes. Compulsive people are worth a lot of money in this business.

 

[illini]

I wouldn't mind taking a look at the pdf's, although I'm not about to rip my kits apart! Will e-mail you to get them.

I finally submitted a greatly condensed version of this review to EMRR last weekend...hope it didn't lose too much in the translation. Picked the same nits, but also commented about Wes's responsiveness here.

 

[Dr.Zooch]

Haven't seen it yet- but they don't have anything about my kits on that site... I wonder if that's a good thing...?

 

[illini]

The review should be in the next EMRR update. Not sure if its a good thing or not!

 

[illini]

Wes, if you haven't seen it yet, the review is now on EMRR.

 

[Dr.Zooch]

Saw it, read it, thanks very much for the good words- best part is that you calls 'em like you sees 'em- so that's even more of an endorsement.