Grumblings of a curmudgeon....

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T-Rex

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I'm sure I'll be ostracized for this, but here ya go anyway....

Why do people post questions in threads that have already been answered?????? READ the posts people!!!!

How can L1 & L2 flyers not know the basics?????? (CP/CG relationships, what reloads will fit in my case??, can I stuff a big motor in my estes kit, take it trans-sonic and expect it to survive???, etc) Engage brain before engaging mouth (or fingers in this case)!!!! Do a little research on your own, you might learn something!!

OK, I'll shut up and take whatever beating is coming to me.....

y'all have fun
Terry
 
"Name my rocket" "What color should I paint my rocket?" "What rocket should I build next?" "Should I change my underwear?"

I think you get my drift....
 
Something to remember, especially for new users, is that they don't necessarily realize it's a common question -- to them, it's brand new. The other thing is search can be a very frustrating thing -- what makes sense to you, as a way to phrase the question, may not make sense to someone else, and may or may not give the results they desire.

It's also possible to get a firehose response to a search, which is overwhelming, and if the results they need aren't in the first few responses, users will often assume they're not going to get what they want.

-Kevin
 
what makes sense to you, as a way to phrase the question, may not make sense to someone else

It would be nice if people read far enough to keep all the basic questions in the beginners section. But I can see why these questions get asked over and over. The search, particularly on this board can be very difficult, since 90% of our threads have virtually ALL the keywords like "motor, igniter, lug, battery, launch, parachute, wadding, etc.

So, in order to phrase a search to find the right results, you would have to use phrases and combinations that are only known to more knowledgeable rocketeers. It's a catch-22.
 
No beatings in the schedule today. Yes, it is frustrating to see the same old questions and you have to wonder what some of the folks here are even attempting based on thier questions and obvious lack of experience. I can't say honestly that I take every inquiry seriously, but I do try to 'mentor' in some small way to encourage new blood and keep them from straying too far into deep waters just for safety's sake. A lot of times I just won't reply,especially if this is along the lines of "Where does the ignitor go?" There are a thousand nuances that make up our experience and some have not had the chance to experience or experiment with our hobby, beyond a random Christmas present Grandma thought would be "cool" because "Junior is soo smart, I'll bet he'll love this." I am not an expert by any means. I built 'real' rockets for a living and was always being teased about my 'toys', but there is real math, physics, design engineering and construction techniques required for success just like the big boys. LIke any hobby, there are 'checkbook' guys ot there that will just write a check for the biggest, best, or just plain most impressive in that hobby. Ready to fly radio control aircraft come to mind first and the perfect little brass locomotives all hand assembled in Asia second. Used to be most of the love of a hobby was the hours (or literally man-years) it took to create your dream as you envisioned it. Now it seems with all the labour saving devices we have, less time is available to develope the craftman-like approach and the market responds in kind to 'instant gratification' and provides the product right off the shelf-plug and play. This robs the background experience out of finding the rules that govern the performance or even inner workings of a lot of common things our parents or even grandparents could disassemble and fix if something broke. They 'understood' it. You see on a daily basis the erosion of skill sets required to survive and thrive in our previous agrarian society and the lack of those skills holds no penalty for an urbanite who will never need to know how to weld, build a house or fix an engine. The craftman that has retained or even gone to the extreme of preserving those abilities are a little like us. Hobby kinda guys who need to know how and why things work for thier own satisfaction and success. If you never had a role model to learn from, maybe you don't know how to research your own questions. Certainly the 'video' age has decimated reading skills to the point where a book is almost to be sneered at: "It's all on line anyway" mentality. We have becme a goal driven society where the objective is defined and expected to be achieved quickly, whereas our parents or grandparents age has a pride of workmanship and if you look at some of the antiques ( example-Sterling Tea sets) you realize you literally could not afford to use someone with that level of skill to make something you could sell for a profit. How many fathers have taken to time to build 'anything' with a son or daughter? Could be they had no need to learn that skill or found any enjoyment themselves with it and there is nothing to pass down. We ARE the 'keepers of the flame' and so with our knowledge gained thru sheer dint of patience and (usually) at considerable cost-we need to pass our skills onto the new generations coming up. My father was a SAC pilot and Squadron leader, but built museum quality ship models to exact scale from scratch. I treasure his leavings and am going to build similar items specifically to leave to my boys. You may have been lucky to have parent swho had hobbies, but chances are now the younger generation is coming from a set of parents where both have to work and either have had little disposable income or complete lack of time to 'waste' on a hobby. We have become the surrogates for those just coming into our world with little preparation or know how. Just take a deep breath-pick and choose you beneficiary and if you can-remember the rush, the tingling, the absolute thrill it sent thru your soul-when you first pushed the button and your very own space program lifted off the pad. We owe them that thrill-to keep our eyes towards the stars and our hearts still capable of wonder.
 
Just take a deep breath-pick and choose you beneficiary and if you can-remember the rush, the tingling, the absolute thrill it sent thru your soul-when you first pushed the button and your very own space program lifted off the pad. We owe them that thrill-to keep our eyes towards the stars and our hearts still capable of wonder.

Post of the week (at the very least).

thanks for this, s6
 
Why do people post questions in threads that have already been answered?????? READ the posts people!!!!

I admin a combat flight simulator board, and we tend to get the same problem. We even have one entire section of the forum built as a 'Knowledge Base' (which plenty of people have spent some serious time putting together) for new guys to reference. Roughly 90% of the questions we get could have been answered had they read the Knowledge Base.

There was consideration at one point to make it so that before you could post in the forum for the very first time, you would be required to answer a 5 question 'test'. The test would require you to use the search function and the Knowledge Base to answer the questions correctly and pass the test. This suggestion by some of us on staff was rejected...which I was bummed about.

One thing I have noticed though, is that with a demographics around here, there are a lot of 'analog' people...folks that are 'hunt and peck' with the keyboard, and would rather poke their eyes out then troubleshoot a minor issue with their computer. Those people (of which there are a lot in our demographic - no, don't say there aren't) usually are the ones who have problems with 'google-fu' and find it hard to use search functions in the best manner. I can sympathize to an extent...there is a certain way of thinking that needs to be applied to get the best results you want in search, and some folks just aren't wired to think like that. I'm not saying it's wrong, just that it is.

With the 'Wikipedia' generation, it's more of an issue in that there is a lot of information out there, and can be overwhelming if one doesn't have initial guidance. The tough part is trying to help them build an initial 'framework' that they can then build upon when learning about the hobby.

How can L1 & L2 flyers not know the basics?????? (CP/CG relationships, what reloads will fit in my case??, can I stuff a big motor in my estes kit, take it trans-sonic and expect it to survive???, etc) Engage brain before engaging mouth (or fingers in this case)!!!! Do a little research on your own, you might learn something!!

This I find troubling. If you have an L1/L2, you should not be asking any of these kinds of questions. Or, if you do have these questions, you should already have the ability to know where to get the answer on your own. Noobs have an excuse...an L1/L2 guy does not.

"Name my rocket" "What color should I paint my rocket?" "What rocket should I build next?"

These questions I find somewhat amusing.

One of the best things about rocketry, especially once you start kit bashing/scratch building, is to develop your own 'personality' as it were. To make and name custom designs, paint jobs. To explore doing new things (staging, boost gliding, etc) on your own verses having your hand held all the way. As a young person especially, living under a ton of rules growing up, rocketry was one of the ways to be able to express yourself, to learn, to have fun learning, while staying safe. To experience the highs and lows on your own.

It saddens me a little when I see folks who do this all the time. Take some initiative! Learn by doing! Take off the training wheels and go for it! You can do all of that, and still be smart and stay within the safety boundaries. There are so many more tools available now to allow you to do that then there ever was when our generation was doing this.

Now you kids stay off my lawn!

FC
 
My comment about answers to questions already existing was referring to questions or comments already discussed within the thread. for example. "I used Rusto Gloss white.", then a few posts later, "What kind of paint did you use?"

I fully understand that noobs don't necessarily know things, that is the way it is in any situation. I have done searches for information, and yes there is a plethora of data to sift through, this is NOT what I am talking about...
 
Just pass over those questions and leave them for someone else. There are folks on every board that love to help the inexperienced, some for altruistic reasons, and others for self absorbing reasons, but both get the job done.
 
My comment about answers to questions already existing was referring to questions or comments already discussed within the thread. for example. "I used Rusto Gloss white.", then a few posts later, "What kind of paint did you use?"

I fully understand that noobs don't necessarily know things, that is the way it is in any situation. I have done searches for information, and yes there is a plethora of data to sift through, this is NOT what I am talking about...
Yes, that can be annoying. Occasionally they may post before refreshing a page and don't see the existing answer, or it's on the previous page. Other times, they may be too lazy to use the scroll wheel.
 
"Name my rocket" "What color should I paint my rocket?" "What rocket should I build next?" "Should I change my underwear?"

A good name for a rocket is Dale,
rockets should always be painted red, it flys higher ( Howard Kuhn, circa 1971)
the next rocket to build is an upscale of the last rocket you built,
and YES FOR GOD'S SAKE CHANGE YOUR UNDERWEAR
 
I just bought an Estes Saturn V.....what color should I paint it ? I was thinking of calling it a V-2 or or maybe a Mean Machine ,but not sure if maybe the name Rokit would be better.I plan on using 54mm reloads ,should I go with a D12-5 or D12-0 ? I have access to 1515 rails ,but was wondering where to buy 3/16" rods ?Can i really use Cabbage leaves for wadding if all i have is Iceberg lettuce ?I like clouds shaped like bunnies.

Thanks for your input.

Paul t
 
I also wonder why people don't search the forum or at least google how to do some of the simple tasks. I wonder if anyone even reads the spray can on how to apply the paint. This is the beauty of the internet where we now have this ability to research information about products and techniques. There is no need to go to a forum and just start asking questions without doing at least a minimum of research.

I like to do my own auto repairs so, when I need to fix something I google the problem and I always find multiple resources on how to make the repair. I don't need to jump into a forum and start asking questions, they have already been answered.

What I would like to see in this forum is a wiki or something similar where common information and techniques could stored. It could even link to some of the better posts in this forum or other forums that have good diy's on a topic. An excellent example is the bimmerfest site, click on the wiki tab. It might be more complex than what is needed here but it is worth taking a peek.

I have asked this to other business owners and managers on how do their younger employees do at their job? The kids (in their twenties) I manage need to be told exactly what to do and when they are done with that task they stop and wait for the next set of instructions. Very few of them automatically go to the next step in the process. The other day we got a shipment of plexiglass. When it came time to unpack it, I told the guys to off load the truck and put the plexiglass in a specific area. They did that perfectly except, they did not finish by throwing away the packing material or storing the pallet. It was just left on the back of the truck in a pile. So, I had to tell them to clean up the truck, what to throw away, and where to store the pallet.

Other managers and owners have had similar experiences with their younger employee's as well. So, maybe this is just how it is with this generation.

Good luck.
 
I just bought an Estes Saturn V.....what color should I paint it ? I was thinking of calling it a V-2 or or maybe a Mean Machine ,but not sure if maybe the name Rokit would be better.I plan on using 54mm reloads ,should I go with a D12-5 or D12-0 ? I have access to 1515 rails ,but was wondering where to buy 3/16" rods ?Can i really use Cabbage leaves for wadding if all i have is Iceberg lettuce ?I like clouds shaped like bunnies.

Thanks for your input.

Paul t

Hi Paul, Welcome to the zoo... to answer your questions, yes, go for it. It is your rocket after all, build & fly it the way YOU want to!! ;)
 
Hi Paul, Welcome to the zoo... to answer your questions, yes, go for it. It is your rocket after all, build & fly it the way YOU want to!! ;)

Screw it......I`m taking up knitting !

....wool or polyester ?

Paul T
 
I've looked high and low-does anybody make a decent plaid paint? The rocket is called the "Caber Toss" and I want it to match my kilt....
 
I've looked high and low-does anybody make a decent plaid paint? The rocket is called the "Caber Toss" and I want it to match my kilt....

Trying to find a decent plaid paint is like finding a true chrome finish......it`s out there ,but very expensive and of course ,preperation and the right primer are key !

....you in a kilt..."au naturel".....oy vey !


Paul t
 
Well, thank God you don't want it to match what's under the kilt :y: :y:

Adrian


Hey, Ya know at the ACE hardware, they have one of those paint match machines.
Just stick a sample in the scanner and there ya go.......oh wait a minute........
 
Hey, Ya know at the ACE hardware, they have one of those paint match machines.
Just stick a sample in the scanner and there ya go.......oh wait a minute........

Ack! Who knew they made a "fish-belly white"!?!

G.D.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner
 
"Name my rocket" "What color should I paint my rocket?" "What rocket should I build next?" "Should I change my underwear?"

I think you get my drift....

I resnet this statement... lol im eventually going to build all the rockets i ask about building next...
 
I am new here and have spent quite a lot of time searching for answers. Some of the time what you guys think of as common knowledge is new to us and in a lot of threads you guys use abbreviations for these(common things) and I am unable to figure out what you are talking about.
I still have yet to fully understand what is required to be level one or two and why it is even necessary.
I have been on a few forums and this one seems to have a lot of knowledge on hand but it is hard to extract it,the threads seem to go off on tangents unrelated to the original post.
 
The aggravation it causes when people start threads to ask questions that have been answered over and over (as opposed to repeat questions within the same thread by people who were too lazy to actually read the thread through before posting, as the OP clarified) is exactly why I spend months lurking and reading on a forum before I actually sign up and chime in. I belong to half a dozen different forums, but this same thing happens everywhere.

Great post by fyrwrxz, I got a little misty-eyed. Anyone interested/inspired by those thoughts should check out the book "Shop Class as Soulcraft." You'll love it.
 
I am new here and have spent quite a lot of time searching for answers. Some of the time what you guys think of as common knowledge is new to us and in a lot of threads you guys use abbreviations for these(common things) and I am unable to figure out what you are talking about.
I still have yet to fully understand what is required to be level one or two and why it is even necessary.
I have been on a few forums and this one seems to have a lot of knowledge on hand but it is hard to extract it,the threads seem to go off on tangents unrelated to the original post.

First, welcome to TRF!

Second, did you start here, right on the front page of the Forum?

https://www.rocketryforum.com/forumdisplay.php?41-Beginners-amp-Educational-Programs

And this subsection: https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?936-Beginning-Model-Rocketry-FAQ-s

The FAQ section is probably where you need to start...even includes things like acronym definitions.

FC
 

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