Software as a Service

[Blast it Tom!]

What is it you dislike so strongly about the registry?

It is so very cryptic that the average user of a "Personal Computer" isn't going to go anywhere near it - criminee, back in the day I've programmed in several languages, can do about anything I want to on a machine, have done hexidecimal here and there, even repairing files sometimes, and I avoid the thing like the plague. And a hiccup there can really screw up your machine. Most of the settings in there are just as easily kept in a place and format more understandable to the average user, i.e. in an ".ini" file or something. Now I can understand the need for anti-piracy stuff, but that usually isn't what the registry is about.

It just seems to me that the registry was the point at which we started down the path to the personal computer not being personal anymore. I won't be dogmatic about it, YMMV.

 

[Greg Furtman]

Best to be sure that you actually want Windows 11. My new PC came with Win11 and every day I wish I could go back to Win10. The new machine has a (supposed) faster processor, twice the RAM, twice the SSD space of my 3-year-old Win10 machine. The Win10 machine is still faster at routine tasks. Not to mention some of the 'features' of Win11 and of the newer version of Office.

Lots of little annoyances. I like having the menu-bar (or ribbon or whatever it's called) at the right side of the screen. Win11 omitted that option.

Okay, rant over.

Since Win 10 I have been using a Stardock program. Start10 for Win 10 and Start 11 for Win 11. It allows you to set up the desktop the way you want it. I'm very fond of the way Win 7 was designed. Start 11 is only $6.

https://www.stardock.com/products/start11/

 

[John Kemker]

It is so very cryptic that the average user of a "Personal Computer" isn't going to go anywhere near it - criminee, back in the day I've programmed in several languages, can do about anything I want to on a machine, have done hexidecimal here and there, even repairing files sometimes, and I avoid the thing like the plague. And a hiccup there can really screw up your machine. Most of the settings in there are just as easily kept in a place and format more understandable to the average user, i.e. in an ".ini" file or something. Now I can understand the need for anti-piracy stuff, but that usually isn't what the registry is about.

It just seems to me that the registry was the point at which we started down the path to the personal computer not being personal anymore. I won't be dogmatic about it, YMMV.

What was really bad was when IBM put a registry in AIX, a UNIX OS.

Really? Why the frack would they do something so completely braindead as that? I can *somewhat* understand it if you're on a M$ machine, but UNIX? Where everything is supposed to act like a file? WTFO?

 

[Blast it Tom!]

What was really bad was when IBM put a registry in AIX, a UNIX OS.

Really? Why the frack would they do something so completely braindead as that? I can *somewhat* understand it if you're on a M$ machine, but UNIX? Where everything is supposed to act like a file? WTFO?

Honest to Pete, if I could go Unix (some flavor) I would. I just don't have the time to put into it now. "Retirement"...

 

[John Kemker]

Honest to Pete, if I could go Unix (some flavor) I would. I just don't have the time to put into it now. "Retirement"...

As someone else mentioned, Linux Mint. Doesn't take much time to install and get familiar with pretty much off the bat.

 

[Blast it Tom!]

As someone else mentioned, Linux Mint. Doesn't take much time to install and get familiar with pretty much off the bat.

Naw, it's more complicated than that. Family users aren't nearly as profficient as I am, and it'd really throw a wrench in their works. Plus my time - I'm ready to take this thing down now as I get new carpet in the office tomorrow and I have to get this out of here! Among a lot of other things. Perhaps - just perhaps - I can try a dual boot on my new box - If I can ever get that figured out!

/derail off!

 

[shockie]

NT 4.0+ was the most stable version of Windows I ever worked on...

Well NT4SP6 was.

 

[Bowman]

What was really bad was when IBM put a registry in AIX, a UNIX OS.

Really? Why the frack would they do something so completely braindead as that? I can *somewhat* understand it if you're on a M$ machine, but UNIX? Where everything is supposed to act like a file? WTFO?

You are referring to the folly of pursuing development on a UNIX-based platform?
I'm with ya brother

As someone else mentioned, Linux Mint. Doesn't take much time to install and get familiar with pretty much off the bat.

I accept that Linux variants have improved substantially but that's only if you never have to open the hood to deal with something like a driver update. As soon as that comes up you'd better be comfortable with command-line UNIX.

 

[Bowman]

It is so very cryptic that the average user of a "Personal Computer" isn't going to go anywhere near it - criminee, back in the day I've programmed in several languages, can do about anything I want to on a machine, have done hexidecimal here and there, even repairing files sometimes, and I avoid the thing like the plague. And a hiccup there can really screw up your machine. Most of the settings in there are just as easily kept in a place and format more understandable to the average user, i.e. in an ".ini" file or something. Now I can understand the need for anti-piracy stuff, but that usually isn't what the registry is about.

It just seems to me that the registry was the point at which we started down the path to the personal computer not being personal anymore. I won't be dogmatic about it, YMMV.

I agree with the statement of complexity but it also simplifies things on the other hand.
As a developer you interact with the registry pretty much like a .ini file.
What you don't have to deal with is finding the ini file or insuring it is in the path or not. It's all stored (and protected) in one confusing location.
If I fault it for anything it is the seemingly redundant of some entries and the difficulty finding documentation for it.
But it is essentially a system-wide ini file with the advantages and drawbacks of that.

 

[Bowman]

Well NT4SP6 was.

I have to mark two just because there are really two different architectures.
For the older I like XP SP3.
In current arch. I say Win 7 was the most stable but now Win 10 has achieved roughly that level.

I do still miss my OS/2 Warp though...

 

[jqavins]

I have to mark two just because there are really two different architectures.
For the older I like XP SP3.
In current arch. I say Win 7 was the most stable but now Win 10 has achieved roughly that level.

Yes to both of those, though only from a user perspective. Retiring XP was, from my perspective, a terribly egregious case of fixing what wasn't broke. But then, so was retiring DOS 5.

 

[Bowman]

Yes to both of those, though only from a user perspective. Retiring XP was, from my perspective, a terribly egregious case of fixing what wasn't broke. But then, so was retiring DOS 5.

Wholeheartedly agree.
I wish I could still run XP because I have several games I like to waste time with that do not operate on the current OS offerings and Steam hasn't supported all the features I like.

 

[jbsommerfeldt]

Back to my OG SUS
If I wanted to, I could be, um say the owner of the database for a certain forum, interject a subject that I am interested in, I then compile the “likes” “" “laughs” etc... I then use that info to show a friend to invest in suszus company. I just used your incent web information to make money. What do I owe $ you?

 

[John Kemker]

You are referring to the folly of pursuing development on a UNIX-based platform?
I'm with ya brother

I accept that Linux variants have improved substantially but that's only if you never have to open the hood to deal with something like a driver update. As soon as that comes up you'd better be comfortable with command-line UNIX.

First comment: The 'registry' under AIX did not improve the OS whatsoever. It added unnecessary complexity to the OS from an administrative viewpoint. The objective of development should be to make the task of the humans who use and administer it less complex, not more so.

Second comment: Updating drivers for my Linux Mint desktop are simple as can be. The Update Manager handles it all. No command-line updates required. Admittedly, I avoid Nvidia proprietary drivers and stick with AMD/ATI Radeon devices, but I get good performance out of less-than-cutting-edge hardware.

Unless one needs cutting-edge performance and hardware for specific use cases, Linux works great as a daily driver. Old wives tend to tell tales about how "difficult" Linux is for the average person. Just ain't so.

 

[Bowman]

Old wives tend to tell tales about how "difficult" Linux is for the average person. Just ain't so.

Well I'm here to tell you us old husbands do as well. I'm not saying it's "fraught with peril" but it is not as easy to support for the average non-UNIX oriented user.

I have experienced UNIX (System 3) since 1981 and many, many of it's variants. Along with samplings from numerous other vendors.

One thing I will attribute as positive is that the UNIX base is largely responsible for the birth of Open Office and other MS Office competitors.
That, in returning to the OP topic, is a viable alternative to MS tyranny. Not perfect, but it works.

 

[jbsommerfeldt]

If they are not use to Ubuntu and, they are going from win, and PC vrs chromebook, smartphone gui, tablet, basic coding, ... its a learning curve. Application, Application, Application. win is $ but has lots of horsepower , open source has little horsepower but is LOW power, extremely flexible and isn't licensed.

 

[jqavins]

That, in returning to the OP topic, is a viable alternative to MS tyranny.

Well, no, MS tyranny was not the OP topic. It was an MS event that triggered the post, but the point was wider all along.

 

[cls]

The 'registry' under AIX did not improve the OS whatsoever. It added unnecessary complexity to the OS from an administrative viewpoint.

That's called "job security" in IBM speak.

 

[cls]

Old wives tend to tell tales about how "difficult" Linux is for the average person. Just ain't so.

Haven't heard that for many years. Recently I put Mint on a 2017 era laptop and let folks use it. My GF had no trouble, mom and her 80+ year old friends had no trouble.

Yeah the updater is really smooth.

 

[John Kemker]

Haven't heard that for many years. Recently I put Mint on a 2017 era laptop and let folks use it. My GF had no trouble, mom and her 80+ year old friends had no trouble.

Yeah the updater is really smooth.

Exactly!

My BIL's old laptop, before it was stolen, had stopped running reliably using Windoze. I wiped it and installed Mint and it ran great for what he wanted to use it for, which was watching movies when he travelled and browsing websites.

For most applications that people want to use a computer for, Linux isn't hard at all. It's the edge cases where it gets tricky.

If they are not use to Ubuntu and, they are going from win, and PC vrs chromebook, smartphone gui, tablet, basic coding, ... its a learning curve. Application, Application, Application. win is $ but has lots of horsepower , open source has little horsepower but is LOW power, extremely flexible and isn't licensed.

It's not the OS that has the horsepower. It's the hardware. Windows is a horsepower hog. It uses more horsepower (CPU, memory, storage) than Linux does. While you can overload a Linux box by turning on too many services, it's not the default. Under Windows, however, it's the default and it's very difficult to turn off CPU/memory hogging services without breaking Windows.

SAAS is yet another tool in the Microsoft arsenal to generate revenues for the company. While I fully support their right to try to make a profit, it doesn't mean that I have to support it with my wallet.

 

[jbsommerfeldt]

Exactly!

My BIL's old laptop, before it was stolen, had stopped running reliably using Windoze. I wiped it and installed Mint and it ran great for what he wanted to use it for, which was watching movies when he travelled and browsing websites.

For most applications that people want to use a computer for, Linux isn't hard at all. It's the edge cases where it gets tricky.


It's not the OS that has the horsepower. It's the hardware. Windows is a horsepower hog. It uses more horsepower (CPU, memory, storage) than Linux does. While you can overload a Linux box by turning on too many services, it's not the default. Under Windows, however, it's the default and it's very difficult to turn off CPU/memory hogging services without breaking Windows.

SAAS is yet another tool in the Microsoft arsenal to generate revenues for the company. While I fully support their right to try to make a profit, it doesn't mean that I have to support it with my wallet.

Agree. its the hardware and OS that go hand in hand. And the application really dictates what you need. High Schools are putting up cube stats. My thing goes back to SoftWareAsAService. What are you giving up?

 

[John Kemker]

Agree. its the hardware and OS that go hand in hand. And the application really dictates what you need. High Schools are putting up cube stats. My thing goes back to SoftWareAsAService. What are you giving up?

Nothing. All the games I'm interested can either be run under Linux using WINE or in a VM. I use CQRlog to control my ham radio instead of HRD (though, I *can* run HRD under WINE) and I use LibreOffice instead of M$ Office. My 3D slicing is done either with PrusaSlicer under LInux or ChituboxPro under Linux. OpenRocket even has a native Linux installer, now. Sweet!

SAAS is not for me.

 

[Bowman]

Well, no, MS tyranny was not the OP topic. It was an MS event that triggered the post, but the point was wider all along.

Sorry, I should have been specific, I did not think the connection would be that difficult to make.
Using MS model as an example; for Office, there is a alternate to the business model adopted by MS and other prominent, industry players. Tyranny was my view of the way MS implemented SAAS and their push approach.

So, if you're unhappy with SAAS and your point of contention is around Office Microsoft there is an alternative for the office product.
For other vendor products there is a high probability of a suitable Open Source option, at least for mainstream business apps.

Specific niche apps may not be as likely.

 

[Bowman]

BTW, I happen to like Microsoft, I am not anti MS, nor am I anti Linux.
I am opinionated having worked in the industry on and off for forty years.
Netware anyone?

 

[jqavins]

So, if you're unhappy with SAAS and your point of contention is around Office Microsoft there is an alternative for the office product.

Since I use MS Office products at work, no, there is not an alternative, since I don't get to choose. Nor do I get to choose any of the other rental software and cloud dependant software that I must use. The problem is at least as much with corporate IT departments buying into the model as with software companies pushing it.

 

[cautery]

First comment: The 'registry' under AIX did not improve the OS whatsoever. It added unnecessary complexity to the OS from an administrative viewpoint. The objective of development should be to make the task of the humans who use and administer it less complex, not more so.

Second comment: Updating drivers for my Linux Mint desktop are simple as can be. The Update Manager handles it all. No command-line updates required. Admittedly, I avoid Nvidia proprietary drivers and stick with AMD/ATI Radeon devices, but I get good performance out of less-than-cutting-edge hardware.

Unless one needs cutting-edge performance and hardware for specific use cases, Linux works great as a daily driver. Old wives tend to tell tales about how "difficult" Linux is for the average person. Just ain't so.

John, I took your suggestion and built a dual-boot with Mint. I like the distro.

Any suggestions how I get wi-fi to work? Works on Windows. Driver looks installed, just won't work.

I'm sure it's a simple thing I forgot over the years.

But Mint is a long way down the road from the first graphical attempts. Thanks!

 

[Bowman]

Since I use MS Office products at work, no, there is not an alternative, since I don't get to choose. Nor do I get to choose any of the other rental software and cloud dependant software that I must use. The problem is at least as much with corporate IT departments buying into the model as with software companies pushing it.

Yeah, I retired from a company that let IT drive the decision without input from the people they were actually supposed to support.
IT for IT's sake is as bad as HR for HR's sake.
Two support functions that often come to believe the rest of the company exists to enable them to pursue their objectives.
Cheers!

 

[cautery]

Yeah, I retired from a company that let IT drive the decision without input from the people they were actually supposed to support.
IT for IT's sake is as bad as HR for HR's sake.
Two support functions that often come to believe the rest of the company exists to enable them to pursue their objectives.
Cheers!

I was an IS/IT consultant from the time I left the service until I retired again last year.

I spent my entire second career trying to get company big-wigs to comprehend that IS/IT assets are to SUPPORT the company operations. Nothing more.

In the beginning, I offered Business Process Reengineering services as a pre-requisite adjunct to the IT consult. Stopped doing that after I realized that Presidents and CEOs were almost ALWAYS lying when they said they were on board with the plan... And BPR requires unwavering support from the top down until the employees figure out they are NOT going to lose their jobs.

People hate change. Even change that brings a 50+% productivity increase without firing anyone as "excess" labor.

Don't get me started on HR.

 

[Bowman]

And BPR requires unwavering support from the top down until the employees figure out they are NOT going to lose their jobs.

Similar experience with Agile software development. Leaders decided it was the solution to all our issues. I was one of the lucky fools selected to implement.
Leadership said they wanted it but balked at making any change in their role to make it work.
Agile requires a organization wide commitment, without it, no benefit. Kind of like Six Sigma.

 

[beeblebrox]

Well NT4SP6 was.

Dragged this out of the bat cave a couple months ago...Only maintenance was a new CMOS battery...
This BIOS was Y2K compliant...








Connected to network and on the Internet...Although basically useless as no modern browser works


With USB support that MS never had for NT. Thumb drive and mouse connected, running Winamp