Must watch presentation on the replacement of fossil fuels.

[KC3KNM]

To be fair, unless you live in Montana, North Dakota or South Dakota you should be able to find a charger before you run out of battery power. And even in those states I suspect that in ten years that will drastically change. In Virginia, on average there is a charging station every 28.7 miles of roadway. So no different than a gas car. When your gauge starts going low you find a fuel stop. And do you drive the full 800 miles without stopping for food and a restroom break? During the half hour to recharge you could be downing grub and taking care of "necessities". My car is a midsize gas sedan that gets 20 mpg with a 15 gallon tank. So 300 miles range. Actually a little lower than most EVs on the market today.
https://electrek.co/2022/01/23/the-...ates-with-the-most-spread-out-charging-points

The data chart (sorted by state)​

STATE	REGISTERED EVs	TOTAL VEHICLE REGISTRATIONS	% OF VEHICLES THAT ARE EVs	PUBLIC CHARGER PORTS AVAILABLE	EVs PER CHARGER	MILES PER EV CHARGER
Alabama	2,890	2,065,223	0.14%	495	5.84	203.40
Alaska	940	174,496	0.54%	83	11.32	213.69
Arizona	28,770	2,387,462	1.21%	1,994	14.43	33.55
Arkansas	1,330	874,634	0.15%	412	3.23	249.07
California	425,300	14,654,371	2.90%	34,775	12.23	5.05
Colorado	24,670	1,724,841	1.43%	3,458	7.13	25.76
Connecticut	9,040	1,260,063	0.72%	1,248	7.24	17.29
Delaware	1,950	422,002	0.46%	277	7.04	23.46
Florida	58,160	7,732,491	0.75%	5,747	10.12	21.42
Georgia	23,530	3,445,471	0.68%	3,764	6.25	34.13
Hawaii	10,670	492,034	2.17%	743	14.36	6.06
Idaho	2,300	599,749	0.38%	260	8.85	202.00
Illinois	26,000	4,286,622	0.61%	2,287	11.37	63.83
Indiana	6,990	2,183,343	0.32%	834	8.38	116.19
Iowa	2,260	1,210,633	0.19%	534	4.23	214.99
Kansas	3,130	943,138	0.33%	942	3.32	149.02
Kentucky	2,650	1,638,625	0.16%	478	5.54	167.27
Lousiana	1,950	1,321,964	0.15%	339	5.75	188.69
Maine	1,920	370,051	0.52%	552	3.48	41.34
Maryland	17,970	1,841,711	0.98%	2,866	6.27	11.30
Massachusetts	21,010	2,085,100	1.01%	4,279	4.91	8.60
Michigan	10,620	2,810,414	0.38%	1,694	6.27	72.13
Minnesota	10,380	1,821,645	0.57%	1,239	8.38	114.09
Mississippi	780	803,827	0.10%	281	2.78	275.76
Missouri	6,740	2,035,762	0.33%	2,088	3.23	63.34
Montana	940	438,642	0.22%	205	4.59	359.25
Nebraska	1,810	647,411	0.28%	356	5.08	267.67
Nevada	11,040	1,052,571	1.05%	1,252	8.82	38.12
New Hampshire	2,690	486,514	0.55%	315	8.54	51.38
New Jersey	30,420	2,616,279	1.16%	1,638	18.57	23.79
New Mexico	2,620	635,272	0.41%	401	6.53	179.12
New York	32,590	4,425,722	0.74%	6,679	4.88	17.06
North Carolina	16,190	3,390,087	0.48%	2,365	6.85	45.51
North Dakota	220	224,952	0.10%	132	1.67	667.94
Ohio	14,530	4,380,516	0.33%	1,883	7.72	65.34
Oklahoma	3,410	1,249,360	0.27%	992	3.44	115.56
Oregon	22,850	1,399,619	1.63%	2,149	10.63	36.78
Pennsylvania	17,530	4,222,743	0.42%	2,453	7.15	49.21
Rhode Island	1,580	389,425	0.41%	533	2.96	11.27
South Carolina	4,390	1,724,396	0.26%	774	5.67	102.37
South Dakota	410	337,367	0.12%	148	2.77	553.85
Tennessee	7,810	2,137,154	0.37%	1,401	5.58	68.64
Texas	52,190	8,223,542	0.64%	5,054	10.33	62.42
Utah	11,230	910,430	1.23%	1,839	6.11	26.43
Vermont	2,230	202,897	1.10%	834	2.67	17.09
Virginia	20,510	3,145,500	0.65%	2,626	7.81	28.69
Washington	50,520	2,877,533	1.76%	3,789	13.33	21.30
Washington DC*	2,360	184,832	1.28%	684	3.45	2.22
West Virginia	600	525,159	0.11%	269	2.23	144.52
Wisconsin	6,310	1,973,948	0.32%	866	7.29	133.57
Wyoming	330	193,092	0.17%	171	1.93	175.97
US TOTAL/AVG.	1,019,260	107,180,635	0.95%	111,477	9.14	37.42

*District of Columbia is technically not a state

Looks like that is including Level 2 and not just DC charging stations. Also, if there’s only one plug available at each of these chargers (outside of Tesla superchargers and Electrify America installs most DC units I see are single stations… maybe two if you’re lucky), that’s less than ideal when they’re broken or busy half the time. Sure, it’s great that there’s a level 2 close enough for my route, but I’m not down to sit around for hours to make the next leg.

Even when I’m road-tripping in the northeast where there’s reasonable charger coverage it can be a pain to find a way through some areas. There’s still a long way to go before it’s what most people would consider convenient.

 

[Antares JS]

To be fair, unless you live in Montana, North Dakota or South Dakota you should be able to find a charger before you run out of battery power. And even in those states I suspect that in ten years that will drastically change. In Virginia, on average there is a charging station every 28.7 miles of roadway. So no different than a gas car. When your gauge starts going low you find a fuel stop. And do you drive the full 800 miles without stopping for food and a restroom break? During the half hour to recharge you could be downing grub and taking care of "necessities". My car is a midsize gas sedan that gets 20 mpg with a 15 gallon tank. So 300 miles range. Actually a little lower than most EVs on the market today.
https://electrek.co/2022/01/23/the-...ates-with-the-most-spread-out-charging-points

The data chart (sorted by state)​

STATE	REGISTERED EVs	TOTAL VEHICLE REGISTRATIONS	% OF VEHICLES THAT ARE EVs	PUBLIC CHARGER PORTS AVAILABLE	EVs PER CHARGER	MILES PER EV CHARGER
Alabama	2,890	2,065,223	0.14%	495	5.84	203.40
Alaska	940	174,496	0.54%	83	11.32	213.69
Arizona	28,770	2,387,462	1.21%	1,994	14.43	33.55
Arkansas	1,330	874,634	0.15%	412	3.23	249.07
California	425,300	14,654,371	2.90%	34,775	12.23	5.05
Colorado	24,670	1,724,841	1.43%	3,458	7.13	25.76
Connecticut	9,040	1,260,063	0.72%	1,248	7.24	17.29
Delaware	1,950	422,002	0.46%	277	7.04	23.46
Florida	58,160	7,732,491	0.75%	5,747	10.12	21.42
Georgia	23,530	3,445,471	0.68%	3,764	6.25	34.13
Hawaii	10,670	492,034	2.17%	743	14.36	6.06
Idaho	2,300	599,749	0.38%	260	8.85	202.00
Illinois	26,000	4,286,622	0.61%	2,287	11.37	63.83
Indiana	6,990	2,183,343	0.32%	834	8.38	116.19
Iowa	2,260	1,210,633	0.19%	534	4.23	214.99
Kansas	3,130	943,138	0.33%	942	3.32	149.02
Kentucky	2,650	1,638,625	0.16%	478	5.54	167.27
Lousiana	1,950	1,321,964	0.15%	339	5.75	188.69
Maine	1,920	370,051	0.52%	552	3.48	41.34
Maryland	17,970	1,841,711	0.98%	2,866	6.27	11.30
Massachusetts	21,010	2,085,100	1.01%	4,279	4.91	8.60
Michigan	10,620	2,810,414	0.38%	1,694	6.27	72.13
Minnesota	10,380	1,821,645	0.57%	1,239	8.38	114.09
Mississippi	780	803,827	0.10%	281	2.78	275.76
Missouri	6,740	2,035,762	0.33%	2,088	3.23	63.34
Montana	940	438,642	0.22%	205	4.59	359.25
Nebraska	1,810	647,411	0.28%	356	5.08	267.67
Nevada	11,040	1,052,571	1.05%	1,252	8.82	38.12
New Hampshire	2,690	486,514	0.55%	315	8.54	51.38
New Jersey	30,420	2,616,279	1.16%	1,638	18.57	23.79
New Mexico	2,620	635,272	0.41%	401	6.53	179.12
New York	32,590	4,425,722	0.74%	6,679	4.88	17.06
North Carolina	16,190	3,390,087	0.48%	2,365	6.85	45.51
North Dakota	220	224,952	0.10%	132	1.67	667.94
Ohio	14,530	4,380,516	0.33%	1,883	7.72	65.34
Oklahoma	3,410	1,249,360	0.27%	992	3.44	115.56
Oregon	22,850	1,399,619	1.63%	2,149	10.63	36.78
Pennsylvania	17,530	4,222,743	0.42%	2,453	7.15	49.21
Rhode Island	1,580	389,425	0.41%	533	2.96	11.27
South Carolina	4,390	1,724,396	0.26%	774	5.67	102.37
South Dakota	410	337,367	0.12%	148	2.77	553.85
Tennessee	7,810	2,137,154	0.37%	1,401	5.58	68.64
Texas	52,190	8,223,542	0.64%	5,054	10.33	62.42
Utah	11,230	910,430	1.23%	1,839	6.11	26.43
Vermont	2,230	202,897	1.10%	834	2.67	17.09
Virginia	20,510	3,145,500	0.65%	2,626	7.81	28.69
Washington	50,520	2,877,533	1.76%	3,789	13.33	21.30
Washington DC*	2,360	184,832	1.28%	684	3.45	2.22
West Virginia	600	525,159	0.11%	269	2.23	144.52
Wisconsin	6,310	1,973,948	0.32%	866	7.29	133.57
Wyoming	330	193,092	0.17%	171	1.93	175.97
US TOTAL/AVG.	1,019,260	107,180,635	0.95%	111,477	9.14	37.42

*District of Columbia is technically not a state

I get that, but my response was intended to be aimed against the assertion that people don't need to drive long distance at the drop of a hat. Some people do, myself included, and I will not budge on that point. However, I will be seriously considering an electric vehicle the next time I buy a car. I've seen a couple of charging stations pop up in Salisbury, perfectly positioned for a pit stop on my way to launches and back, and I know an electrician who can install an appropriate charging outlet in my garage for a decent price.

 

[Tyeeking]

I get that, but my response was intended to be aimed against the assertion that people don't need to drive long distance at the drop of a hat. Some people do, myself included, and I will not budge on that point.

It’s not just about need. Some people just want to be able to drive a long distance without a great deal of logistical planning on where to refuel. I have no interest in reverting to a society that is based on someone’s perception of what I “need”.

 

[Antares JS]

I have no interest in reverting to a society that is based on someone’s perception of what I “need”.

Well said. That perception is frequently wrong.

 

[cls]

Finally... Thanks. Exactly.

Need vs want. It's a trap!

 

[Funkworks]

I think... possibly, that you missed his point with this response. I'm actually fairly close to a "city" compared to some, but it's still over 30 miles to the nearest McDonalds. I'm also about 2-4 miles down a dusty dirst road with animals everywhere that love chewing on wires. I'm pretty sure Tesla was not designed to make it up my hill. (Think of 8 inches of ground clearance as my minimum in a vehicle). The point was that there's no one-size-fits-all solution for everyone.
Your argument would be similiar to me telling everyone in the us that they need to ditch their car and get a horse or a wagon pulled by Oxen. That's just not gonna work in NY city, for reasons people discovered in the late 1800's and early 1900's.

I'm certainly not one to say there's a one-size fits all vehicle. Did I say that? For an 8 inch ground clearance, you need a truck, not a car. Tesla hasn't released their truck yet, so you could look into Rivian, or the Ford Lightning. Or a PHEV like the Wrangler 4xe.

I don't know what argument I said that reminds you of a horse and wagon, but I would say that anyone shopping for a new car should try a new EV, and anyone shopping for used car should try a used EV, because the last 10 years have been incredible. There are about 6 million EVs worldwide, so no, the idea the "everyone in the US needs to ditch their car and get a horse and wagon" is not mine, but there's always someone out there who's on the fence and has the budget, and others who like me just like new tech but have no plan to buy the latest supersonic jet. Those are who I'm talking to.

It’s not just about need. Some people just want to be able to drive a long distance without a great deal of logistical planning on where to refuel. I have no interest in reverting to a society that is based on someone’s perception of what I “need”.

Reminds me of shopping mall stores selling "essential oils".

As for the thread's topic, I have no interest in reverting to a society that is based on someone’s perception of what I "must watch". Seriously, I might watch the presentation later, but it doesn't feel like an emergency so far.

 

[Off Grid Gecko]

yep, tbh I was hesitant to watch it at first mainly due to time constraints. If I'm going to invest an hour or more in something I prefer it's pertinent to my job of of special interest to myself. I know from 10 years in the oilpatch there are enormous reserves in the gulf of mexico that are untapped. I was on the ships that were drilling exploration wells for Chevron until the big oil spill. The maps that I used to make are the private property of Chevron but I can also tell you that we were required by law to report all of our findings to BOEM or whatever MMS is calling themselves these days.

The presentation as far as I can tell was pretty spot on though with his work. Power to my house is provided by 6PV panels, a battery bank, and a generator that runs on either gasoline or propane, and I spent years researching different technologies for my cabin that would meet my needs, my cost requirements, and my lifestyle. And I've been living here for 5 years, forgoing certain amenities that most consider necessities.

Truck vs car, that's a semantic argument. I consider the Outback I used to have more car than truck, but I guess there's a case to be made for SUVs, lol. Semantics and vehicle classes aside, there are people who are far more off the beaten path than I am, and I'm not sure where in the area there is a charging station at all. So that would prolly give me a radius from my house and the power draw would likely require firing up the generator because sometimes the solar array has trouble keeping up with the house needs, and that's without a fridge or a big tv.

I just think sometimes we get in a habbit of thinking there's an "average" life that everyone lives and we all eat the same soup. We don't. I'm in a rather poor area of the country where a lot of people struggle to keep a 20 year old car running well enough to get to work on their salary. Prolly half of the nearest town is on SNAP and government sponsored healthcare. And they struggle to hold down a job that pays prolly $10/hr. Oh, and if they work too much they lose some of their benefits, so it's the max they can without taking a giant hit to their income.

It's a broken system all the way around. From what that guy was saying in his talk to people trying to stay warm in the winter to fat cats enjoying the newest and best. I'm not complaining about it, but also there are maybe 5-6 car lots in the area. I think I've only ever seen a handful of hybrids, most of them Prius. I did see one of those trucks a while back but not sure if hybrid or electric.

I think sometimes I'm better off if I consider other people have a very different lifestyle than me (which almost everyone does, lol) and accept that fact. Just cause something is good for me it doesn't mean it's good for them. There's a lot involved also making batteries, PV cells, fiberglass wind turbine blades, etc. In the after notes someone mentioned concrete to pour as footings as well. The guy makes a good point that bulky batteries are not the answer. I know it wasn't just the batteries alone but I shudder to think what kind of battery banks you would need to go full renewable sources.

Not to mention the power for most of those electric cars is still coming from fossil fuels.

 

[bjphoenix]

I'd just point out that carrying solar panels in an EV truck would allow an infinite range, although probably less than 50 miles a day after the 1st charge has run out.

This sounds like the story in the book (and movie) "The Martian".

 

[jderimig]

OK, what would you suggest as a better alternative?

End tourism travel. It's not needed. Staycations will suffice. The tourism industry is a luxury we can't afford during a "climate emergency". Think of all the CO2 poison from all that jet-a burned going to and from Hawaii.

 

[Funkworks]

This sounds like the story in the book (and movie) "The Martian".

You'd think I'd want to watch that movie, but I'm still not over Wilson (Castaway?). I'll stick with following NASA's rovers.

End tourism travel. It's not needed. Staycations will suffice. The tourism industry is a luxury we can't afford during a "climate emergency". Think of all the CO2 poison from all that jet-a burned going to and from Hawaii.

CO2 absorbs heat, so adding CO2 to the atmosphere increases the amount of energy it contains, making it more agitated. It's that simple.

Here's a short one by Dr. Michaux I agree with.

 

[kuririn]

End tourism travel. It's not needed. Staycations will suffice. The tourism industry is a luxury we can't afford during a "climate emergency". Think of all the CO2 poison from all that jet-a burned going to and from Hawaii.

Or reallocate minerals from semiconductors and chipset production to batteries.
Priorities must be set.

 

[kuririn]

While the focus is on transportation and energy production, I was curious to see which uses contribute the most carbon emissions to the environment. Even if we obtain carbon neutrality with transportation and energy production, there are a host of other uses which also are contributing. I wonder if they are being addressed?
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2011/apr/28/industries-sectors-carbon-emissions
"Energy
– Electricity & heat (24.9%)
– Industry (14.7%)
– Transportation (14.3%)
– Other fuel combustion (8.6%)
– Fugitive emissions (4%)
Agriculture (13.8%)
Land use change (12.2%)
Industrial processes (4.3%)
Waste (3.2%)

These sectors are then assigned to various end uses, giving the following results (nicely visualised here):

Road transport (10.5%)
Air transport (excluding additional warming impacts) (1.7% )
Other transport (2.5%)
Fuel and power for residential buildings (10.2%)
Fuel and power for commercial buildings (6.3%)
Unallocated fuel combustion (3.8%)
Iron and steel production (4%)
Aluminium and non-ferrous metals production (1.2%)
Machinery production (1%)
Pulp, paper and printing (1.1%)
Food and tobacco industries (1.0%)
Chemicals production (4.1%)
Cement production (5.0%)
Other industry (7.0%)
Transmission and distribution losses (2.2%)
Coal mining (1.3%)
Oil and gas production (6.4%)
Deforestation (11.3%)
Reforestation (-0.4%)
Harvest and land management (1.3%)
Agricultural energy use (1.4%)
Agricultural soils (5.2%)
Livestock and manure (5.4%)
Rice cultivation (1.5%)
Other cultivation (1.7%)
Landfill of waste (1.7%)
Wastewater and other waste (1.5%)"

 

[kuririn]

While my post about chips and semiconductors was tongue in cheek, this article is really surprising. I didn't know that chip production was so energy intensive:
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/11/03/tsmc-samsung-and-intel-have-a-huge-carbon-footprint.html

 

[jderimig]

While my post about chips and semiconductors was tongue in cheek, this article is really surprising. I didn't know that chip production was so energy intensive:
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/11/03/tsmc-samsung-and-intel-have-a-huge-carbon-footprint.html

Yes it takes more energy to make a smartphone than a heat pump.

 

[jderimig]

Or reallocate minerals from semiconductors and chipset production to batteries.
Priorities must be set.

But not rocket flight computers.....

 

[kuririn]

But not rocket flight computers.....

Definitely not.

 

[dhbarr]

While the focus is on transportation and energy production, I was curious to see which uses contribute the most carbon emissions to the environment. Even if we obtain carbon neutrality with transportation and energy production, there are a host of other uses which also are contributing. I wonder if they are being addressed?
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2011/apr/28/industries-sectors-carbon-emissions
"Energy
– Electricity & heat (24.9%)
– Industry (14.7%)
– Transportation (14.3%)
– Other fuel combustion (8.6%)
– Fugitive emissions (4%)
Agriculture (13.8%)
Land use change (12.2%)
Industrial processes (4.3%)
Waste (3.2%)

These sectors are then assigned to various end uses, giving the following results (nicely visualised here):

Road transport (10.5%)
Air transport (excluding additional warming impacts) (1.7% )
Other transport (2.5%)
Fuel and power for residential buildings (10.2%)
Fuel and power for commercial buildings (6.3%)
Unallocated fuel combustion (3.8%)
Iron and steel production (4%)
Aluminium and non-ferrous metals production (1.2%)
Machinery production (1%)
Pulp, paper and printing (1.1%)
Food and tobacco industries (1.0%)
Chemicals production (4.1%)
Cement production (5.0%)
Other industry (7.0%)
Transmission and distribution losses (2.2%)
Coal mining (1.3%)
Oil and gas production (6.4%)
Deforestation (11.3%)
Reforestation (-0.4%)
Harvest and land management (1.3%)
Agricultural energy use (1.4%)
Agricultural soils (5.2%)
Livestock and manure (5.4%)
Rice cultivation (1.5%)
Other cultivation (1.7%)
Landfill of waste (1.7%)
Wastewater and other waste (1.5%)"

So the number one thing any person can do would be to live close to where we work and play; ideally with both of those things NOT being somewhere very cold, very hot, or very disaster prone.

 

[Off Grid Gecko]

While my post about chips and semiconductors was tongue in cheek, this article is really surprising. I didn't know that chip production was so energy intensive:
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/11/03/tsmc-samsung-and-intel-have-a-huge-carbon-footprint.html

PV panels take quite a bit of energy as well, and historically (not sure how things have evolved in the last 15 years) a lot of chemical waste as well. Hopefully next-gen crystals will be better on this front. Heck smelting any kind of metal is not exactly an efficient process in terms of the amount of energy that needs to go into it.

 

[Mushtang]

I don't see how an empty fuel tank would be any better. Maybe you carry jerry cans, but that's not a issue of propulsion, it's an issue of where you choose to drive. Many people have little interest to go that far away from civilization.

An empty fuel tank isn't better, but you provided the solution while pretending not to know how it works. The fact is that gas powered cars have a range FAR longer than any EV can hope to have. So far I've not been on a trail where I've needed gas from a Jerry can, nor one where an EV would have lasted the entire time.

Many people have little interest in driving home from the airport in winter months in their EV and not being able to turn on the heater for fear that it will keep them from getting all the way home. This is a real life example that someone here at my office dealt with a couple of years ago. His EV was a few years old and his battery didn't have the range it did when brand new. He drove most of the way home without a heater and still had to pull over for a couple of hours to charge so that he could get home. No thanks!

As an aside, he contacted the company he bought his EV from to ask about a replacement battery. It turns out that it would have been hugely expensive and wouldn't have solved the problem at all because the replacement was just as old as the one he was using, and apparently their peak charge reduces with age and not with usage. That was eye opening. It still didn't keep him from buying his wife a Tesla recently but I don't know what he does during the colder months when he's going to the airport. Maybe he takes Uber?

 

[Mushtang]

Of course, if you insist on going just beyond the range of any car, and far from fueling and charging stations, you're going to have issues.

Not beyond the range of any ICE car. Not beyond the range of my Jeep. Definitely beyond the range of an EV.

 

[kuririn]

An empty fuel tank isn't better, but you provided the solution while pretending not to know how it works. The fact is that gas powered cars have a range FAR longer than any EV can hope to have. So far I've not been on a trail where I've needed gas from a Jerry can, nor one where an EV would have lasted the entire time.

Many people have little interest in driving home from the airport in winter months in their EV and not being able to turn on the heater for fear that it will keep them from getting all the way home. This is a real life example that someone here at my office dealt with a couple of years ago. His EV was a few years old and his battery didn't have the range it did when brand new. He drove most of the way home without a heater and still had to pull over for a couple of hours to charge so that he could get home. No thanks!

As an aside, he contacted the company he bought his EV from to ask about a replacement battery. It turns out that it would have been hugely expensive and wouldn't have solved the problem at all because the replacement was just as old as the one he was using, and apparently their peak charge reduces with age and not with usage. That was eye opening. It still didn't keep him from buying his wife a Tesla recently but I don't know what he does during the colder months when he's going to the airport. Maybe he takes Uber?

Your concerns are valid. At this point EVs are not for everyone, depending on the type of driving you do. Battery technology is rapidly developing, and issues like range, cold weather performance, charging time, materials scarcity will be mitigated over time. Historically science and technology has always solved these kinds of problems. So I'm not losing sleep over it.
BTW Jeep has a Wrangler hybrid 4W drive model. No worries about being stranded on the trail. They are also installing solar powered battery chargers on trails:
https://www.jeep.com/wrangler/wrangler-4xe.htmlBack on topic, aluminum ion battery research is promising.
https://startup-energy.org/aluminum...s of safety, cycle stability and charge rate."Aluminum-ion batteries have a high potential in terms of safety, cycle stability and charge rate. Aluminum-ion technology also offers advantages in terms of production costs, raw material availability and recycling."
" Particularly relevant here is the avoidance of critical raw materials, such as lithium, nickel or cobalt."
A lot of other research being done as well.
Not worried, technology and the free market will find a way.

 

[kuririn]

Regarding materials scarcity.
I saw an interesting video a couple of days ago. It said that at one time in the past the US was the world's largest producer of lithium. Much of that came from the Great Salt Lake in Utah. The mining operation was abandoned because there wasn't enough demand for the mineral.
My, how times have changed!
There are companies that want to start mining lithium again at the Great Salt Lake and also the Salton Sea in California. An article says the Salton Sea could provide 100% of the US and 40% of the world's requirement of lithium.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/05/04/the-salton-sea-could-produce-the-worlds-greenest-lithium.htmlAnd since there are geothermal power plants close by it would be green lithium.
Best of both worlds.

 

[lakeroadster]

I'd just point out that carrying solar panels in an EV truck would allow an infinite range, although probably less than 50 miles a day after the 1st charge has run out.

Folks in California, Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, Utah, Nevada etc. would likely agree. But it really depends on where you live. Curious, where do you live?

I remember living on Ohio for over 4 decades and the sun would pretty much disappear from October until March. Not actually, it was up there, behind clouds. But the actual real-world use of renewables was discussed in the video also.

Once again, such "solutions" as you mentioned, are not universal.

Might not work to good in the heavily forested Northeast either, unless they clear cut all the forests to allow the sunshine to reach all the roadways.

 

[Off Grid Gecko]

Folks in California, Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, Utah, Nevada etc. would likely agree. But it really depends on where you live. Curious, where do you live?

I remember living on Ohio for over 4 decades and the sun would pretty much disappear from October until March. Not actually, it was up there, behind clouds. But the actual real-world use of renewables was discussed in the video also.

Once again, such "solutions" as you mentioned, are not universal.

Might not work to good in the heavily forested Northeast either, unless they clear cut all the forests to allow the sunshine to reach all the roadways.

Personally, I wouldn't agree with the solution in any case. "Stick solar panels all over it" is not the solution. If you're powering a laptop or something, fine, but it takes a lot of PV panels to make a decent amount of power. When mine ore optimized and in full sun they're cranking about 1.8kW. It's more weight than I would want to add to my truck and I doubt that 1.8kW if you Could get it is going to keep that car running for very long.

I'm trying to be modest with a lot of my comments cause I don't want to sound like Debbie Downer but if you don't have actual experience with PV panels and large battery banks you might be let down by how much they produce.

Someone said also about in the wintertime. Most batteries are far less efficient if they are too hot or too cold. These new LiFePO4 batts that I replaced my Pb-acid's with quote some pretty nice numbers (-20C - 60C discharge, 0-50C charge) but if it's frosty outside that's going to kill your performance with most batteries.

Can these problems be overcome with time? Sure, probably. But the market for battery tech at the moment doesn't seem too concerned with making "all weather" batteries, at least not as much as you would think. Cause most large storage banks are in protected environments.

Personally, I think a car that ran off a nuclear RTG or similar would be pretty sweet, but somehow I don't think that's ever going to catch on, lol.

 

[lakeroadster]

Personally, I wouldn't agree with the solution in any case. "Stick solar panels all over it" is not the solution. If you're powering a laptop or something, fine, but it takes a lot of PV panels to make a decent amount of power. When mine ore optimized and in full sun they're cranking about 1.8kW. It's more weight than I would want to add to my truck and I doubt that 1.8kW if you Could get it is going to keep that car running for very long.

I'm trying to be modest with a lot of my comments cause I don't want to sound like Debbie Downer but if you don't have actual experience with PV panels and large battery banks you might be let down by how much they produce.

Someone said also about in the wintertime. Most batteries are far less efficient if they are too hot or too cold. These new LiFePO4 batts that I replaced my Pb-acid's with quote some pretty nice numbers (-20C - 60C discharge, 0-50C charge) but if it's frosty outside that's going to kill your performance with most batteries.

Can these problems be overcome with time? Sure, probably. But the market for battery tech at the moment doesn't seem too concerned with making "all weather" batteries, at least not as much as you would think. Cause most large storage banks are in protected environments.

Personally, I think a car that ran off a nuclear RTG or similar would be pretty sweet, but somehow I don't think that's ever going to catch on, lol.

Yeah, some ideas are better than others..

 

[Off Grid Gecko]

not sure about my RTG idea, I never have bothered to see how those things work,, so I guess that's my version of "stick solar panels all over it" hehe

 

[rharshberger]

not sure about my RTG idea, I never have bothered to see how those things work,, so I guess that's my version of "stick solar panels all over it" hehe

Problem with RTG's is that there is a finite amount of Pu238 left in the world currently (it happens to be one of the best RTG fuels), even NASA is sparing in its use these days. RTG's are also pretty limited to very low power useage items requiring a constant source of power.

 

[bjphoenix]

Your concerns are valid. At this point EVs are not for everyone, depending on the type of driving you do. Battery technology is rapidly developing, and issues like range, cold weather performance, charging time, materials scarcity will be mitigated over time. Historically science and technology has always solved these kinds of problems. So I'm not losing sleep over it.
BTW Jeep has a Wrangler hybrid 4W drive model. No worries about being stranded on the trail. They are also installing solar powered battery chargers on trails

These days I think a lot of people would be better served by a plug-in hybrid than a full EV- it will have range if you need it but for most driving it would operate from the battery. My wife and I could get by with them pretty well.
The Wrangler 4XE is actually a plug-in hybrid and can operate from battery, ICO, or both. IIRC the battery has around 25 miles range.
I could have a Wrangler 4XE except for the same problem that will hinder EV adoption by most US drivers- cost. I recently bought a used Wrangler, a new 4XE would cost about twice what my used Wrangler cost, and my used Wrangler already exceeded my budget.

 

[KC3KNM]

These days I think a lot of people would be better served by a plug-in hybrid than a full EV- it will have range if you need it but for most driving it would operate from the battery. My wife and I could get by with them pretty well.
The Wrangler 4XE is actually a plug-in hybrid and can operate from battery, ICO, or both. IIRC the battery has around 25 miles range.
I could have a Wrangler 4XE except for the same problem that will hinder EV adoption by most US drivers- cost. I recently bought a used Wrangler, a new 4XE would cost about twice what my used Wrangler cost, and my used Wrangler already exceeded my budget.

Eh, I think it varies widely based on location, family size and your commute. I bought a 2015 eGolf for pretty cheap (under 10k after trading in my old beater), and the battery is in great condition. We’ve got my girlfriend’s Mini for longer trips or emergencies, but carpool to work with the Golf. I typically charge twice a week at work with our ~20 mile daily commute. Outside of the very little maintenance the car requires (pretty sure it still has the OG brakes on it), we now effectively get to work for free. We’ve taken it on longer road trips and it’s worked out to be cheaper than my Fit was, but definitely less convenient. I have to charge more frequently in the winter but it’s not a big deal for our daily commute.

Obviously, everyone’s personal requirements are different, but if an EV fits the bill you can stand to save quite a bit of money.

 

[Cape Byron]

At this point EVs are not for everyone, depending on the type of driving you do.

Agreed. I like the idea of an EV, but it's totally impractical for me and many others as well.

Oh, and until your electricity is generated from a 'carbon neutral' source you're not really solving any problem: just passing it on.