Tenergy 9 volt batteries

terryg · Jul 25, 2021

https://www.amazon.com/Tenergy-Lithium-Batteries-1200mah-Non-Rechargeable/dp/B0887W4985
I am considering using these on a night launch rocket I am working on. It is going to be for a class 1 night launch so so I am trying to save as much weight as possible. Does anyone have any experience with these?

Thanks!

VernK · Jul 25, 2021

terryg said:
https://www.amazon.com/Tenergy-Lithium-Batteries-1200mah-Non-Rechargeable/dp/B0887W4985I am considering using these on a night launch rocket I am working on. It is going to be for a class 1 night launch so so I am trying to save as much weight as possible. Does anyone have any experience with these?

I have experience with these batteries. I was evaluating them for a future project. They seem to have a built-in PTC current limiter. If you are using them to power the lights on your night launch rocket then I have no concerns. If you are using them to power an altimeter for deployments then I would be a little concerned that the current limit might come into play. Ground testing should definitely be done. One concern is that if the altimeter tries to fire a deployment charge that is defective (shorted) then the battery will try to deliver a lot of current. That will heat up the PTC sensor and limit the current. All that is fine. However, if the altimeter then tries to fire a backup charge right after firing the shorted primary charge, then the PTC may not have had enough time to cool down and will still be limiting the current. That means the battery will not be delivering the expected current for firing the backup charge. The net result being the primary charge did not work due to the short and the backup charge did not work due to insufficient current.

mtnmanak · Jul 26, 2021

I have been using the Energizer Ultimate Lithium 9V batteries for deployment charges for quite a while. I have some of them that have 20 launches on them and they still meter out above 9V. I have not had one fail me yet using RRC3s, RRC2s, SLCFs, Ravens, Eggtimers, etc.

I would not use them for applications that require a lot of power, especially for WiFi enabled devices, but they work great for flight computers, deployment charges and I have used them for LED lights on a rockets. They are easy to find at Walmart, Lowes, Home Depot, etc, so no need to order them and hope. Just go over to your local big box store, buy one and try it out for your application.

VernK · Jul 26, 2021

mtnmanak said:
I have been using the Energizer Ultimate Lithium 9V batteries for deployment charges for quite a while. I have some of them that have 20 launches on them and they still meter out above 9V. I have not had one fail me yet using RRC3s, RRC2s, SLCFs, Ravens, Eggtimers, etc.

I agree. I use them for firing deployment charges too. My testing has shown that the Energizer Ultimate Lithium 9V works a lot better than the Tenergy 9V Lithium.

Rocketjunkie · Jul 26, 2021

mtnmanak said:
I have been using the Energizer Ultimate Lithium 9V batteries for deployment charges for quite a while. I have some of them that have 20 launches on them and they still meter out above 9V. I have not had one fail me yet using RRC3s, RRC2s, SLCFs, Ravens, Eggtimers, etc.

I would not use them for applications that require a lot of power, especially for WiFi enabled devices, but they work great for flight computers, deployment charges and I have used them for LED lights on a rockets. They are easy to find at Walmart, Lowes, Home Depot, etc, so no need to order them and hope. Just go over to your local big box store, buy one and try it out for your application.

View attachment 474576

I disassembled one recently. They contain 3 1/2AA lithium cells. It does raise the cost to $10 per battery. The cells are welded together. Short circuit current 5A and it holds for at least 10 seconds. Old cylindrical cell Duracell would provide 5.5A and hold for at least 5 seconds. New Duracell only provides 2.1A and fades quickly

. With my tiny starters, I get only 1 firing out of a new Duracell and get at least 30 firings with the old one. I haven't tried the lithium batteries with starters yet. I would not try to fire more than 1 ematch with the new cell, no problem with up to 3 parallel matches off the old Duracell. I also haven't used them in altimeters yet. It will be interesting to see how many flights I get before they reach my limit of 9.2V. (I don't trust the new Duracells to fire both charges.) I may have to go to LiPos with all the aggravations of infrequently used Li batteries

BEC · Jan 13, 2024

Popping this up again for two reasons:

First, I can say I have experience with the Tenergy batteries as I've been working on an R&D report that I've submitted to vNARCON 2024 that involves testing 9V batteries. The Tenergy batteries — and the very-similarly-constructed Amazon Basics Lithiums — do indeed have a PTC current limiter inside as @VernK suspected. Interestingly enough, that PTC device lets just enough energy through before it activates to get an Estes starter very brightly glowing (and good enough to actually launch a model), but not enough (most of the time) to burn it out — when used in a 9V launch controller.

This is what's inside. These are actually pictures of an Amazon Basics Lithium, but the Tenergys are the same inside, except that they have the PTC device in the other output lead. I had never heard of pouch-style primary cells until I opened this battery up. But that's what they are.

Second, those Energizer Lithiums are getting crazy expensive. Today if I walk into Target or Walmart to buy them they it will set me back around $16 for one. Fortunately, there is a brand you can get from Amazon, called Voniko, that is made the same way as the Energizers with 3 1/2AA lithium cells inside and no apparent PTC limiter. In fact if you take the wrapper off, you can't tell them apart. These are two for $14.

I know this thread is a few years old....I found it looking for other 9V battery stuff. But since I could directly answer the question, I thought I'd do so anyway.

mtnmanak · Jan 14, 2024

BEC said:
Popping this up again for two reasons:

First, I can say I have experience with the Tenergy batteries as I've been working on an R&D report that I've submitted to vNARCON 2024 that involves testing 9V batteries. The Tenergy batteries — and the very-similarly-constructed Amazon Basics Lithiums — do indeed have a PTC current limiter inside as @VernK suspected. Interestingly enough, that PTC device lets just enough energy through before it activates to get an Estes starter very brightly glowing (and good enough to actually launch a model), but not enough (most of the time) to burn it out — when used in a 9V launch controller.

This is what's inside. These are actually pictures of an Amazon Basics Lithium, but the Tenergys are the same inside, except that they have the PTC device in the other output lead. I had never heard of pouch-style primary cells until I opened this battery up. But that's what they are.

View attachment 624213 View attachment 624214

Second, those Energizer Lithiums are getting crazy expensive. Today if I walk into Target or Walmart to buy them they it will set me back around $16 for one. Fortunately, there is a brand you can get from Amazon, called Voniko, that is made the same way as the Energizers with 3 1/2AA lithium cells inside and no apparent PTC limiter. In fact if you take the wrapper off, you can't tell them apart. These are two for $14.

I know this thread is a few years old....I found it looking for other 9V battery stuff. But since I could directly answer the question, I thought I'd do so anyway.

Thanks for the heads up on the Vonikos - I just ordered a pack to give them a try. If they last even half as long as the Energizers, they will be a good deal!

Grog6 · Jan 14, 2024

Since battery current is a function of plate area, I'd expect a cylindrical battery to be much better than a pouch. (it's a roll of the same type cells as the pouches.

BEC · Jan 14, 2024

mtnmanak said:
Thanks for the heads up on the Vonikos - I just ordered a pack to give them a try. If they last even half as long as the Energizers, they will be a good deal!

In comparing my test data for the two, I'd say the Voniko is ~80% as good as the Energizer in my simulated igniter firings. At two for less than the price of one Energizer they are a deal.

Grog6 said:
Since battery current is a function of plate area, I'd expect a cylindrical battery to be much better than a pouch. (it's a roll of the same type cells as the pouches.

Well, in attempting to simulate periodic igniter firings in my testing, and allowing for the action of the protection device in the Tenergy and Amazon Basics batteries, I'd say for launch controller use the pouch-cell-based batteries are actually better in that you'll get more actual firings out of them. This is a very narrow use case, though. For deployment computers I'd be worried about both the initial action of the protection circuit and how fast it recovers after it trips. Unless the deployment events are far apart, that aspect will make them unsuitable for use there.

But from a pure "how much energy is in battery" situation the difference, again in my tests, are not great between the types.

I'll have more to say about this — what the tests actually were and what I found — in my R&D presentation at vNARCON on the 27th.

Rocketjunkie · Jan 15, 2024

Are those LiPos used as single use? It is definitely cheaper to use a 2S LiPo and discard it than use the Energizer Ultimate Lithium. They do contain 3 1/2 AA cells. They are a different chemistry that limits current without a protection circuit and are truly not rechargeable.

BEC · Jan 15, 2024

Rocketjunkie said:
Are those LiPos used as single use? It is definitely cheaper to use a 2S LiPo and discard it than use the Energizer Ultimate Lithium. They do contain 3 1/2 AA cells. They are a different chemistry that limits current without a protection circuit and are truly not rechargeable.

That was my first thought when I opened one of those batteries up. But since Amazon was kind enough to leave the battery vendor's name on the cells, I found they're not. They are lithium manganese dioxide primary cells just like the cylindrical ones. https://huiderui.com/Porduct/content/html/456.html

Both batteries (Amazon and Tenergy) use the same PTC "resettable fuse" — even the same part number. Scroll to the bottom of this page for the data sheet: https://item.szlcsc.com/3273794.html

Because of this protection device, I would STRONGLY recommend ground testing your setup, including the interval between charge firings, if you're thinking of using a Tenergy or Amazon Basics lithium in a dual deploy setup.

Rocketjunkie · Jan 16, 2024

I use the Amazon Basics alkaline batteries. Even better than the original Duracells and under $2 each with free shipping (if you buy the lot of 24).

BEC · Jan 16, 2024

The Amazon Basics alkalines tested well in my little project — as good as any other alkaline battery.

It’s really about what your use case is what the correct choice is.

Art Upton · Jan 16, 2024

A dollar and 65 cents in an 8 pack for $12.99

https://www.amazon.com/Amazon-Basics-Performance-All-Purpose-Batteries/dp/B00MH4QM1S

Art Upton · Jan 16, 2024

BEC said:
The Amazon Basics alkalines tested well in my little project — as good as any other alkaline battery.

It’s really about what your use case is what the correct choice is.

I don't want to worry about tripping Li battery control or fuses in a dual deploy setup, even though I mostly do JLCR now with motor deploy; once in a while I may have to do a standard dual deploy in the future if I get more mobile.

Edit: Or like my last Altimeter fired deploy, I had a plugged I65-P and a Sratto Logger in the payload compartment to fire the Apogee charge and the chute release open the chute that was kicked out by the Apogee charge. The Payload also carried an RDF tracker on 440MHZ, Big Red Bee.

Rocket was 3" LOC Caliber - ISP I dressed up in paint and decals to be a D-Region ISP

Rocketjunkie · Jan 16, 2024

9V alkaline batteries that use the cylindrical (AAAA size) last 10-20 flights and produce >5 amps. The stacked rectangular cell versions only last 1-2 flights and produce about 2 amps. A lot of people put 2 ematches in parallel and the the rectangular cells will not fire them. The Amazon Basics contain cylindrical cells and are cheap. Duracell used to contain cylindrical cells but the redesigned them to rectangular cells and denied it when called out on it. (Sent pictures proving it.) It is critical for our use but doesn't matter for most uses (low current).
Old, new.

BEC · Jan 16, 2024

And this basically brings us back to the thread posted by QFactor from a year ago that started me down this 9V battery testing road....

user 30299 · Jan 17, 2024

Here is a quick review of the three typical constructions for 9-volt batteries that I came across in my testing.
I'm listing them from "Best" to "Worst".

BEC has done some additional testing and teardowns on a whole other assortment of batteries "listed"
as 9-volts by their manufacturers. He'll be presenting them at vNARCON.

9-Volt / 5-amp : Product Code is 6LR61 (Best)