More flights on my Phoenix

[KevinM]

...So I finally made some time to get out to the flying field this year eek with my Phoenix. I put three more flights in yesterday, the first on a BlackJack (F16J), then two White Lightnings (F23W). What a rush!

 

[daveyfire]

WOW, nice flights, and those are AWESOME photos! I love the one of the glider on final, it has a great sense of movement.

 

[cjl]

Very nice. I love the picture of the glider at the end of the long smoke trail.

 

[zog139]

I realy like your finish pattern. Any idea how long your flights were ? Were conditions good... any thermals ?

:clap:

 

[WillMarchant]

Excellent, thanks for sharing, Kevin!

How difficult is it to build a Phoenix?

 

[KevinM]

Thanks all, it was such a great outing I just had to share. The awesome shutter-work is all thanks to my buddy Gary A, and to Bernie for the use of his camera! As the guy at the sticks I'll just try to take credit for the straight smoke trail on the ride up.

Flight times were on the order of a minute or so but it's hard to say any more precisely than that. I clean forgot to set my timer on the first two flights, then forgot to stop it on the third. I was getting in the neighbourhood of 400 feet of altitude on boost, then spent all my time on the way back down getting a feel for how she grooves. (This was only flight numbers 3, 4, and 5.) Conditions were dead calm and pretty flat so I doubt there was much thermal activity to be had, but I really wasn't looking anyways.

As for building the Phoenix I found it to be very straight-forward. Even bagging the wings (which is generally considered the most difficult part of the build) was well documented and clearly explained - The manual even tells you how much epoxy you should be consuming in the process. Admittedly I made life for myself more difficult than necessary with the fancy colour scheme, but I'd rather invest the time on spicy colours than fly a *blah* looking plane. (What else was I going to do in November in Canada, anyways?)

Will - Are you thinking of building a Phoenix? As Ferris Bueller says: If you have the means I highly reccomend it!

 

[WillMarchant]

As for building the Phoenix I found it to be very straight-forward. Even bagging the wings (which is generally considered the most difficult part of the build) was well documented and clearly explained - The manual even tells you how much epoxy you should be consuming in the process. Admittedly I made life for myself more difficult than necessary with the fancy colour scheme, but I'd rather invest the time on spicy colours than fly a *blah* looking plane. (What else was I going to do in November in Canada, anyways?)

Will - Are you thinking of building a Phoenix? As Ferris Bueller says: If you have the means I highly reccomend it!

Yeah, I've got one of the Sky King re-issue kits but have been a little bit afraid of getting started on it. I need to just do it and stop whinging. :gavel:

Those great photos are a lot of encouragement, Kevin!

 

[KevinM]

Yup! The first launch photo was a BlackJack and the second was a White Lightning.

 

[MaxQ]

Very Nice.

 

[aerostadt]

Looks great! I have a feeling that flyers, who are good with R/C, can make many good rocket glider flights in rapid succession.

 

[mr_matt_II]

Hi Kevin,

Great looking plane and pictures, congrats.

I have an original Phoenix that I finished about a month ago.

I wanted to launch model rockets with my son and after starting with the small Estes stuff I remembered I had a Phoenix kit that I traded for almost 20 years ago! I have even been launching with reloads that old!

No launch pics as it is just my son and I, but we are getting some good flights in, I must have about 20 flights now.

If anyone has a spare kit I would love to pick it up.

Best regards,

Matt

 

[KevinM]

Hi Matt,

I'm glad to hear the reloads can last that long, although I don't think I'll allow mine to get that old. As for flight counts, after sneaking up to the flying field on my lunch break yesterday I'm up to 7.

Is that an air data probe I see peeking out of the nose of your Phoenix? If so, who'se electronics are behind it and what kind of numbers are you seeing? I have a HowHigh in mine- Apparently I'm getting on the order of 775 feet from a G12. (Which tells me I have much to learn on how to milk altitude off a launch. Any tips?)

 

[mr_matt_II]

I'm glad to hear the reloads can last that long, although I don't think I'll allow mine to get that old.

LOL well I did not intend for that to happen either! I was not into rocketry when I got the kit, I fly RC. I had the whole thing all during the ATF days and beyond. The only thing I did was to check that reloads were still available, and then I find out about Aerotech, the fire and the move to Utah! A lot of history.

Hi Matt,



Is that an air data probe I see peeking out of the nose of your Phoenix?

LOL no it is just nose weight. I figured early on that the plane would be tail heavy, so I talked to the designer Bob Parks (who gave me the kit) and talked about shortening the tail, but he said absolutely not. They had lengthened the nose just before production commenced, so this CG issue has always been tricky. I knew that the RC system airborne weight would be a lot less originally designed, so I knew I had to do something.

I moved the servos forward about 5 inches, went to CF pushrods, ran Hitech digital servos and a Futaba 7 channel FASST receiver and a 200 mAh 5 cell nicad. I used very light park flyer ultracote on everything except the bottom of the boom. My weight was 23.5 ounces and I needed to add 1 ounce of nose weight to balance (24.5 ounces total).

Hi Matt,

Apparently I'm getting on the order of 775 feet from a G12. (Which tells me I have much to learn on how to milk altitude off a launch. Any tips?)

Well I am not sure but that might be a great number, I remember you said you are carrying a lot of weight and that kills the performance in the vertical. I would say launch at 45 degrees and try to trim it such that it is as hands off as you can make it on the climb out. Keep it very flat for maybe a 4 count after launch and then do a maybe 4 G pull up. You are trying to get a good head of steam before the vertical pull up so you can zoom climb at the top. No idea if this will help.

I have about 20 flights and I just order more reloads yesterday.

Regards,

Matt

 

[KevinM]

I was not into rocketry when I got the kit, I fly RC.

As do I. I thought yours was a familiar looking handle. (Same Mr Matt as found on RC Universe I presume?)

I moved the servos forward about 5 inches, went to CF pushrods, ran Hitech digital servos and a Futaba 7 channel FASST receiver and a 200 mAh 5 cell nicad. I used very light park flyer ultracote on everything except the bottom of the boom. My weight was 23.5 ounces and I needed to add 1 ounce of nose weight to balance (24.5 ounces total).

Fantastic - I went the same route of using more moden radio equipment and tried paying careful attention to weight, but mine still came in at 26.5oz ready to fly. I looked at moving my servos forward but decided that it wouldn't affect the CG by enough to make it worth it, maybe at some point I'll have to revisit my radio bay layout. Carbon pushrods, eh... Do you see any trim change with temp change? What diameter are they?

I would say launch at 45 degrees and try to trim it such that it is as hands off as you can make it on the climb out. Keep it very flat for maybe a 4 count after launch and then do a maybe 4 G pull up. You are trying to get a good head of steam before the vertical pull up so you can zoom climb at the top. No idea if this will help.

I'm told that's the approach to gain the most altitude but I've been allowing my climb-out angle to get too steep... Need more flights!

 

[mr_matt_II]

Hi Kevin,

My CF rods are .156 diameter.

I would not carve the plane up now to move servos, just fly it.

And yes I am the same RC guy from RCU.

 

[mr_matt_II]

Matt, .156 RODS or tubes ?

Did you go to CF because or the 5 inches longer push rod run ? Or for weight ?

I'm not sure .156 pultruded CF rod is actualy lighter than a balsa push rod.

Hello,

These were tubes and I don't think they are pultruded, but I could be wrong.

I did not put them in for weight savings, just more rigidity, sorry if I gave the wrong impression.

 

[Clipper]

Hi Kevin,

Great looking plane and pictures, congrats.

I have an original Phoenix that I finished about a month ago.

I wanted to launch model rockets with my son and after starting with the small Estes stuff I remembered I had a Phoenix kit that I traded for almost 20 years ago! I have even been launching with reloads that old!

No launch pics as it is just my son and I, but we are getting some good flights in, I must have about 20 flights now.

If anyone has a spare kit I would love to pick it up.

Best regards,

Matt

Where are you launching the Phoenix? What motor are you using?

 

[mr_matt_II]

Hello,

I launch at Sante Fe Dam and a Lucerne Valley dry lake.

I might try DART next week if they have a Thursday launch (I need to contact them as I have never been)

Regards,

Matt