jackiboi_11
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Are you able to get the motor for the cert flight from a vendor at the launch site? Or do you need to do something different?
Jr HPR Cert Questions
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boatgeek
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You are allowed to buy a motor for a certification flight. The vendors will know what to do. You should have an adult with you since you're not technically allowed to handle the motor yourself. Very worst case, you can hand your mentor some cash and they can buy it.
jackiboi_11
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Can all of that happen in one day including finding a mentor?
It can but it’s best to find the mentor before hand. You are going to be taking time away from your mentor’s own flying time and with basically no advanced warning. Come to a launch first and see what it’s all about. The vendor on site might not even have the motor you are looking for.
jackiboi_11
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Oh ok, looking forward to this!
boatgeek
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Technically? Yes. Realistically, no.
At a bare minimum, the mentor needs to assemble the motor and adjust the delay, review the simulation, review construction and assembly of the rocket, and make sure that it's all up to their standards. Their name is on the flight card, so they need to be satisfied that it's safe to fly. That's at least an hour of time away from their projects and flights. You will benefit more from a mentor's advice if you are able to ask questions during construction and make adjustments to the kit build instructions along the way. I think many people are happy to do that kind of work, but they'll want advance warning so that they can really help you. That will also make you more likely to succeed.
I feel like it's less of an imposition to ask for a witness on site, but even then I would let the club know ahead of time that you'll be there and need a witness. A lot of launches have a semi-designated person who handles witnessing certification flights for a period of time during the launch.
Although an adult is allowed to obtain a motor for certification a person under 18 isn’t allowed to buy a high power motor. It’s a CPSC rule, not NFPA. The worst case you describe is the only legal way.
jackiboi_11
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Yeah I got it. Thanks for the help!
jackiboi_11
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Coming back to this thread, it is us (the person that built the rocket) that has to answer the RSO correct? And what kind of questions or what kind of info does the RSO need?
waltr
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Yes, the person that built the rocket should be able to answer the RSO's questions.
Where is the CP loctated?
What glue was used? On fins, MMT and motor retainer?
What is the expected altitude (not to break the club FAA waver)?
What is the TTW ratio?
What size chute?
There could be other questions ending on what the RSO sees looking at the rocket.
Where is the CP loctated?
What glue was used? On fins, MMT and motor retainer?
What is the expected altitude (not to break the club FAA waver)?
What is the TTW ratio?
What size chute?
There could be other questions ending on what the RSO sees looking at the rocket.
jackiboi_11
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Ah so basically stability questions and how it simmed?
cbrarick
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golly, waltr, that's a lot of questions! I bet I could do them all, but you'd probably not like the fact that I'd tell you the Cp is on the rocket, somewhere between the NC and Fins. (I mostly build kits)
I'm not much concerned about thrust to weight: Just shove the biggest, baddest motor in and let it fly! Low thrust motors are for odd-rocs and super rocs....
22 pound rocket, M4800. Not a problem with thrust to weight. Maybe for keeping the fins on, however!
:>
Seriously, if your mentor doesn't know about your rocket, then they probably won't fly it. The best thing is to involve your mentor in the construction process, so they won't say no.
I'm not much concerned about thrust to weight: Just shove the biggest, baddest motor in and let it fly! Low thrust motors are for odd-rocs and super rocs....
22 pound rocket, M4800. Not a problem with thrust to weight. Maybe for keeping the fins on, however!
:>
Seriously, if your mentor doesn't know about your rocket, then they probably won't fly it. The best thing is to involve your mentor in the construction process, so they won't say no.
jackiboi_11
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I’m still debating whether or not going the NAR Jr. or TMP. TMP sounds better because i’ll learn much more and i can fly to whatever my mentor is certified too. I have a walrlock and ultimate buzz coming for christmas so i’ll attend a club launch in Jan and find a mentor than build the warlock (most likely) for my L1
jackiboi_11
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Since my rocket that I was supposed to use got destroyed in an unplanned disassembly.
And construction questions.
Remember, RSO is Range Safety Officer. You need to have adequate information to assure him your flight will be a safe one.
Great plan!
cbrarick
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well, that's one way of thinking about it. However..... do you have the cash to play with the big boys? Large rockets tend to cost 1,000 and up, with a M motor costing 400 and up. So that's 1400 or more just for the first flight. After all, HPR stands for high priced rocketry.....
jackiboi_11
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I plan on flying HPR as a run my own little business basically just to help pay for the motors and such but not to much to the point of flying 4 HPR rockets a month. More like 1 or 2 in the range of H-I motors a month and maybe a level 2 motor here and there.
jackiboi_11
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But I don’t see me flying anything like a L3 motor in the foreseeable future (although I would like too 
)
)
boatgeek
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Just curious, how do you plan to make money off of HPR? Or is that asking for trade secrets?
I once ran some numbers on a small business launching cremains of pets or people, but it more or less needed a dedicated launch site.
-Slick-Ice
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Yes, the 3" IRIS is a tank. It goes GREAT on the I357 and G80
jackiboi_11
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How fast does it come off a 6ft rail on a g80? Might ask for that for christmas too if that’s the case.
-Slick-Ice
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These are from my Iris-3 at 44 oz. It has a lot of flights on it.
kramer714
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Um... I think you really need to understand what the mentor is for the Tripoli Mentor Program, the Mentor Program (Tripoli) is very different than the Jr. Level 1 (NAR).
Tripoli - The mentor is responsible for WHAT YOU DO, it is really set up as a one on one kind of program, where you fly with the mentors oversight. When you say you can launch anything the mentor can, yes but..... You are assuming that the mentor will sign on as the flyer of record for that flight. Remember anything goes wrong with the flight it is on the Mentor, legally it is his rocket, his flight.
I was my kids mentor when he was younger. Any challenging projects he did, I saw how he built them, how he ensured stability, and how the planning would lead to a safe, and likely successful flight. I would be reluctant to sign off as the mentor for someone I dont know well (hey not all teens are responsible), and would be reluctant to sign off any anything i couldn't inspect, either during the build or if it is visual (looking at the rocket or looking at an ejection charge test for example). I am a level 3, my kid built and flew dual deploy scratch built rockets on L motors... under my 'observation'. Great program but understand what the Mentor is signing up for before you ask them to do it for you.
NAR Jr Level 1 - it is just that, a level one cert... but with additional restrictions. As a Jr. Level 1, you can only do single deploy rockets, electronics can be used BUT ONLY FOR NON PYRO ejection. Each time you launch you will need to find a certified flyer. FOr JR Level 1 you are not supposed to handle the motor, just the adult flyer of record. From NAR Due to regulations, the JrHPP Candidate MUST NOT HANDLE THE MOTOR. The motor must be handled by the certified Flier of Record at all times.
The assumption is, you can go to a launch, find a helpful certifed adult, make them feel comfortable that the rocket is built well and has proper planning to be safe, have them build / adjust / instll the motor, and sign off as the flyer of record. This sint too hard for a single deploy limited to an H or I motor.
Mike K
jackiboi_11
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Yeah totally get it. That’s why I want to do the mentor program because of how much more i could learn
jackiboi_11
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Nice seems like a tank indeed!!
-Slick-Ice
Well-Known Member
Yeah, it survived hitting the road with with the parachute tangled in the jolly logic, it hit the launch tower in a 15 mph wind, a giant thorny bush, a mud puddle... There isn't any good landing spot at our field.
jackiboi_11
Well-Known Member
Here in florida there isn’t an abundant of fields like the lucky people with the dry lake beds got in nevada and such. Most of the time it’s muddy!
They will ask you all kinds of questions, and of they don't feel your answers are adequate. You won't be flying, I've read down below this, Kramer714 had the best advice.
It depends how old you are, but most of things you want or that are talked about are probably not going to happen until you're 18. You can go to a launch day, but running around and asking guys to be your L1 mentor when they don't know you may be the wrong idea especially you being a jr. I would go to the club and just ask questions for a time or two, then start flying with them with the adult supervision.
Thats another thing, someone of age will need to be with you the entire time if you're flying. You may not even be allowed to spectate without a parent or legal guardian im not sure. I would email the club you have in mind, contact the club President and tell him your L1 goals, that would probably be the best start. Are you a member of any clubs?
jackiboi_11
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Alright, I have a mentor. I'm taking the TMP exam today and will be certifying in February, I'll still fly my mid power birds today.
jackiboi_11
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Well today went a lot different than expected. I actually ended up certifying for the TMP L1 on my MDRM clone. The mentor and one of the TAPS there said it was built good enough and I flew it on a AT H195 Blue Thunder trimmed down to a 10 second delay with a JLCR set to 400 feet. It was really windy hence why we used the JLCR but i’m certified now and right after I flew the MDRM again but this time on an G72 DM trimmed to a 6 second delay.
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