History of the Estes Bull Pup 12D

[mh9162013]

The Estes Bull Pup 12D from circa the early 1990s was the first model rocket kit I ever had. I plan building another one, but would like to have some more background information about the various kits Estes released at some point. Here’s what I know about the model so far.

- There were two model numbers for the kits, #1972 and #7000. I still have yet to determine what the differences between these kits were besides different packaging and /or facecards.
- There are at least 2 different versions of the decals for this model; one is water slide and the other is peel-and-stick.
- This model has had at least 2 different versions of the tail fins; I believe the older kit(s) had smaller tail fins
- The balsa parts were initially die cut, but are now laser cut.
- The parachute changed as well (initially having to be assembled and now coming fully assembled as well as the parachute design changing)
- At least one older version of the kit used red-colored clay/weight for the nose cone.

Based on my gut feeling, this was the first release of the kit:



But I’m not 100% sure, and it’s possible this was the first release of the kit (which seems to have been sold with or without shrink wrap over the cardboard box):



Or maybe it was this one:





It’s my understanding that this is now the current version of the kit:







But before this “black facecard” version, Estes released this:




And at some point before this “orange and blue facecard,” Estes released these versions:





Any insight as to the years of sale, order of release, which versions had the water slide decals and which ones had the peel-and-stick would be appreciated – especially which type of decal is currently included in the currently-for-sale version of the model.

 

[CoolRockets]

The Estes Bull Pup 12D from circa the early 1990s was the first model rocket kit I ever had. I plan building another one, but would like to have some more background information about the various kits Estes released at some point. Here’s what I know about the model so far.

- There were two model numbers for the kits, #1972 and #7000. I still have yet to determine what the differences between these kits were besides different packaging and /or facecards.
- There are at least 2 different versions of the decals for this model; one is water slide and the other is peel-and-stick.
- This model has had at least 2 different versions of the tail fins; I believe the older kit(s) had smaller tail fins
- The balsa parts were initially die cut, but are now laser cut.
- The parachute changed as well (initially having to be assembled and now coming fully assembled as well as the parachute design changing)
- At least one older version of the kit used red-colored clay/weight for the nose cone.

Based on my gut feeling, this was the first release of the kit:
View attachment 587762


But I’m not 100% sure, and it’s possible this was the first release of the kit (which seems to have been sold with or without shrink wrap over the cardboard box):
View attachment 587763


Or maybe it was this one:
View attachment 587764




It’s my understanding that this is now the current version of the kit:
View attachment 587765






But before this “black facecard” version, Estes released this:
View attachment 587766



And at some point before this “orange and blue facecard,” Estes released these versions:
View attachment 587767

View attachment 587768


Any insight as to the years of sale, order of release, which versions had the water slide decals and which ones had the peel-and-stick would be appreciated – especially which type of decal is currently included in the currently-for-sale version of the model.

This gets the CoolRockets stamp of approval

 

[cls]

Glad you got the launchables version, those were short time only. I have one unbuilt in storage, somewhere...

 

[mh9162013]

Glad you got the launchables version, those were short time only. I have one unbuilt in storage, somewhere...

Oh, I only have the "Explorer, Purple Box" version, which is still sealed in the package. Probably will keep that sealed, but not sure which "modern" version kit to buy.

 

[mh9162013]

I realized I missed one kit version:


I got this from @CameronMakesRockets Bull Pup build thread. I believe this version comes after the blue and orange facecard version, but I'm not sure if it comes before or after the black facecard kit version. My guess is that this is the current version (not the black facecard, like I thought earlier), because this has a manufacture date from June 2022.

EDIT: This version of the kit comes with water-slide decals.

 

[mh9162013]

Another question that it doesn't seem like anyone will know, but it's worth a shot: does the black box version of the Bull Pup 12D kit come with red clay?

I have the Explorer, purple-box kit still sealed. I assumed this was the version of my first Bull Pup kit, but after reviewing unboxing pics online, I don't think it was because my kit from childhood had red clay to add weight to the nose and the Explorer, purple-box kit has the more "modern" off-white clay (at least in the 2 or 3 pictures I've seen so far).

My memory also says the main picture of the Bull Pup on the box I had was in a landscape format, so that's another reason to think my first kit was the black box version. I know that my dad purchased the kit from Wal-Mart some time before 1994, but I'm not sure how far before 1994 it was.

 

[Art Upton]

Glad you got the launchables version, those were short time only. I have one unbuilt in storage, somewhere...

When closed out they were like at $4.95 at Wally World.

 

[rharshberger]

Another question that it doesn't seem like anyone will know, but it's worth a shot: does the black box version of the Bull Pup 12D kit come with red clay?

I have the Explorer, purple-box kit still sealed. I assumed this was the version of my first Bull Pup kit, but after reviewing unboxing pics online, I don't think it was because my kit from childhood had red clay to add weight to the nose and the Explorer, purple-box kit has the more "modern" off-white clay (at least in the 2 or 3 pictures I've seen so far).

My memory also says the main picture of the Bull Pup on the box I had was in a landscape format, so that's another reason to think my first kit was the black box version. I know that my dad purchased the kit from Wal-Mart some time before 1994, but I'm not sure how far before 1994 it was.

The color of the plasticene clay has more to do with what was available/cheaper when Estes bought it than probably anything else, though whitish and red are all I have ever seen in the many Estes kits I have built over the last 40 years.

 

[mh9162013]

Note: If you're buying these kits:


You will be getting laser cut fins, but peel-and-stick decals. Thanks to @86mustang408w for providing this information.

 

[86mustang408w]

I got to mine yesterday, I'll post a pic in a bit, from 2013. Has the peel and stick decals over the waterslide.

 

[86mustang408w]

Bought in 2013.

 

[Astrobuf]

The Estes Bull Pup 12D from circa the early 1990s was the first model rocket kit I ever had. I plan building another one, but would like to have some more background information about the various kits Estes released at some point. Here’s what I know about the model so far.

- There were two model numbers for the kits, #1972 and #7000. I still have yet to determine what the differences between these kits were besides different packaging and /or facecards.
- There are at least 2 different versions of the decals for this model; one is water slide and the other is peel-and-stick.
- This model has had at least 2 different versions of the tail fins; I believe the older kit(s) had smaller tail fins
- The balsa parts were initially die cut, but are now laser cut.
- The parachute changed as well (initially having to be assembled and now coming fully assembled as well as the parachute design changing)
- At least one older version of the kit used red-colored clay/weight for the nose cone.

Based on my gut feeling, this was the first release of the kit:
View attachment 587762


But I’m not 100% sure, and it’s possible this was the first release of the kit (which seems to have been sold with or without shrink wrap over the cardboard box):
View attachment 587763


Or maybe it was this one:
View attachment 587764




It’s my understanding that this is now the current version of the kit:
View attachment 587765






But before this “black facecard” version, Estes released this:
View attachment 587766



And at some point before this “orange and blue facecard,” Estes released these versions:
View attachment 587767

View attachment 587768


Any insight as to the years of sale, order of release, which versions had the water slide decals and which ones had the peel-and-stick would be appreciated – especially which type of decal is currently included in the currently-for-sale version of the model.

I recently built the orange and blue face card version of the bull pup. The nose cone clay was gray. It came with water slide decals. The fins were laser cut.

I'm not certain what year this build was made, but will check the literature for copyright dates and edit this post.

 

[mh9162013]

I recently built the orange and blue face card version of the bull pup. The nose cone clay was gray. It came with water slide decals. The fins were laser cut.

I'm not certain what year this build was made, but will check the literature for copyright dates and edit this post.

Thanks for the info.

I think you will see the production date embossed/stamped on the kit facecard and the decals.

 

[Ronz Rocketz]

 

[mh9162013]

View attachment 618762

Bet the person/computer program listing that meant to sell it for $19.95 + shipping.

 

[mh9162013]

Update:

I purchased the Bull Pup 12D and Patriot direct from Estes last week. This is what I got:





The Bull Pup 12D came with waterslide decals and the usual creme-colored nose weight clay.

What's interesting is that the Bull Pup 12D has a manufacture date from 2022 while the Patriot's is from 2023. I wonder why they stopped using the black facecards with the Bull Pup, but kept them with the Patriot. I figured the black facecards, if still being used, would be used with all scale/military rocket kits. Maybe Estes is just using the facecards they have printed and when they run out, they'll use the newer version (whatever version that might be).

 

[Ronz Rocketz]

Update:

I purchased the Bull Pup 12D and Patriot direct from Estes last week. This is what I got:

View attachment 620379

View attachment 620380

The Bull Pup 12D came with waterslide decals and the usual creme-colored nose weight clay.

What's interesting is that the Bull Pup 12D has a manufacture date from 2022 while the Patriot's is from 2023. I wonder why they stopped using the black facecards with the Bull Pup, but kept them with the Patriot. I figured the black facecards, if still being used, would be used with all scale/military rocket kits. Maybe Estes is just using the facecards they have printed and when they run out, they'll use the newer version (whatever version that might be).

I think it depends on who they can contract in China to put together the kit and at what price point. It's probably designed in Penrose and printed in China, probably. Whoever made the kits for the recent PSII kits didn't have the ability to print the face cards at the desired price point.

 

[GlenP]

Bet the person/computer program listing that meant to sell it for $19.95 + shipping.