Cattle-killing rockets?

[gldknght]

Why is it so easy to believe that someone screwed up causing this incident. "A gate was left open..." We have the official report, that a rocket landed near some cows and spooked them. I've seen what happens when cows spook and do the stampede dance. No, wasn't caused by a rocket, but was by a chainsaw start up, almost 100 ft from the cows. They all at the same time took off running in the same direction. I have no problem understanding that if there had been a fence in front of them, those 40 or so cows would have gone right through it. As it was, they were half way across the fairly large field when they stopped running.

It seems to me, this was an unpreventable incident NOT caused by any negligence. Why is that so hard to believe?

 

[boatgeek]

I interrupt this series of recriminations about recriminations to tell a story.

I went to high school in a building on a slope over a dairy cow pasture. Some bright student discovered that a well-made paper airplane thrown from the building could clear the trees at the bottom of the pasture and travel a few miles into the valley below. Many students tried to replicate this feat and due to the average student’s airplane construction standards, many paper airplanes landed in the pasture. Eventually the farmer called the school to ask the students to knock it off since the paper was making the milk taste funny.

Now back to pointless bickering.

 

[Banzai88]

Why is it so easy to believe that someone screwed up causing this incident. "A gate was left open..." We have the official report, that a rocket landed near some cows and spooked them. I've seen what happens when cows spook and do the stampede dance. No, wasn't caused by a rocket, but was by a chainsaw start up, almost 100 ft from the cows. They all at the same time took off running in the same direction. I have no problem understanding that if there had been a fence in front of them, those 40 or so cows would have gone right through it. As it was, they were half way across the fairly large field when they stopped running.

It seems to me, this was an unpreventable incident NOT caused by any negligence. Why is that so hard to believe?

Because lots and lots of us have spent lots of time around cows, with and without rocket activities, and usually one has to worry about cows stomping the rocket, not getting out of the way, eating the rocket, or licking the black powder residue.....never mind standing by the fenceline watching the rockets go up and down all.day.long.......all without spooking or stampeding.

Heck, the cows at my RC flying field have never spooked in over 2 DECADES of flying glow motor planes next to and over their pasture. In fact, they spend most of their time standing and watching us. THAT is spooky!

And in over 50 years of hunting, never....like....EVER....seen cows spook from us starting chain saws or using other power equipment to clear trails, nor from gunshots during turkey or deer season.

So, given that rather widespread experience, it seems more likely to more folks that someone screwed up and left a gate open (or not properly secured) than a rocket spooked cows, they stampeded, and knocked down a fence. If that's what happend, the fence was inadequate anyway, and anything could have spooked the cows at any time....didn't have to be rockets! Seems a little crazy coincidence that it happened to happen right when rocket activities were going on!

 

[Rob Campbell]

Why is it so easy to believe that someone screwed up causing this incident. "A gate was left open..." We have the official report, that a rocket landed near some cows and spooked them. I've seen what happens when cows spook and do the stampede dance. No, wasn't caused by a rocket, but was by a chainsaw start up, almost 100 ft from the cows. They all at the same time took off running in the same direction. I have no problem understanding that if there had been a fence in front of them, those 40 or so cows would have gone right through it. As it was, they were half way across the fairly large field when they stopped running.

It seems to me, this was an unpreventable incident NOT caused by any negligence. Why is that so hard to believe?

Perhaps the NAR decided it was best to have insurance pay out in order to assure future use of the site.

 

[loopy]

AMEN - stop beating around the bush and spit it out.

Spit what out? “Follow club rules and respect the location and neighboring areas?” Isn’t that common knowledge?

 

[gldknght]

Because lots and lots of us have spent lots of time around cows..

Ok. Good for you. I've lived most of my whole life (50+ years) in the midwest, around farms. I HAVE seen cows spooked a bunch of times, for little things, like chainsaws starting up. I saw cows spooked from a little kid (son of the owner) throwing dirt clods at them.

I saw a mama sow panic and run full bore right into the side of a bright red pickup truck. Can't say for sure if she saw the truck, but can say she probably didn't care that it was in her way. In a full bore linear panic, animals don't generally think about fence vs. open gate. They just run.

So really, your 'widespread' experience is kind of meaningless, when the things you say don't happen actually do happen. Frequently.

Again, my point is that given the statements from our president and the response from the NAR members forum, the most likely cause of this incident is an unpreventable accident. We can PREDICT (sort of) where our rockets will land using sim software, but we can not control the exact spot. Yes, we can and should make certain all gates are left as we find them.

Moderators, maybe its time to close this thread and end this pointless debate? Seems like there is nothing more to be learned.

 

[gldknght]

Perhaps the NAR decided it was best to have insurance pay out in order to assure future use of the site.

I don't think anyone disagrees with this.

 

[jsdemar]

AMEN - stop beating around the bush and spit it out.

Should have told the cows to spit it out and there wouldn't have been a problem.

 

[rfjustin]

Should have told the cows to spit it out and there wouldn't have been a problem.

Those cows don't spit, they have a propensity to swallow...

Lock this bitch down already!

 

[Handeman]

Not sure about cattle out west, but in Virginia, I attended a launch site in a large beef cattle pasture. They would wonder within 50 ft of J and K motors being launched and seldom even looked up from eating when they launched. Never saw any of them even seem to notice a rocket landing. The dairy cattle at our site didn't run from large rockets landing, they gathered around. Sometimes stepping on the rockets and chewing on the parachutes. When you retrieved the rocket, they would gather around and watch, and follow you to the edge of the field when you went out the gate or under the fence. They were curious like cats and playful like puppies. Some found it very disconcerting to be followed closely by 40 or 50 curious, playful, 900 lbs. cows.

 

[Banzai88]

Ok. Good for you. I've lived most of my whole life (50+ years) in the midwest, around farms. I HAVE seen cows spooked a bunch of times, for little things, like chainsaws starting up. I saw cows spooked from a little kid (son of the owner) throwing dirt clods at them.

I saw a mama sow panic and run full bore right into the side of a bright red pickup truck. Can't say for sure if she saw the truck, but can say she probably didn't care that it was in her way. In a full bore linear panic, animals don't generally think about fence vs. open gate. They just run.

So really, your 'widespread' experience is kind of meaningless, when the things you say don't happen actually do happen. Frequently.

Again, my point is that given the statements from our president and the response from the NAR members forum, the most likely cause of this incident is an unpreventable accident. We can PREDICT (sort of) where our rockets will land using sim software, but we can not control the exact spot. Yes, we can and should make certain all gates are left as we find them.

Moderators, maybe its time to close this thread and end this pointless debate? Seems like there is nothing more to be learned.

Ok, good for you.

Re-read my post again, I never said they don't happen. Comprehension is key.

So really, your experience is kind of meaningless, when the things you say happen frequently actually.....don't in lots of folks' experience.....hence the skepticism surrounding the 'official' story in juxtaposition with our experience AND one fellow here who says he WAS THERE.....and it was an open gate, not a stampede that blew through a fence.

And if they DID plow through a fence, and if they DO spook easily and often as you claim....it ALWAYS WAS an inadequate fence!

You must have cows that have watched one too many John Wayne movies.

Our cows up and down the East Coast and Ohio Valley where I spend most of my time, and launch rockets, and shoot guns, and use power equipment...don't spook at all like anything you describe.....and when they do, they usually meander away.....not stampede and break through fences.

And when they do moooooove fast, it's usually because of food being put out!

 

[Rschub]

Well East coast cows are hip, and they don't really seem to care.

And the Southern cows, they just stand and chew, and sometimes they just stare.

The Midwest farmers darlings really take it all in stride.

And the Northern cows, they don't have a fit, and they sure don't have a fright.

And then you've got those weird California cows......

 

[rcktnut]

I received a PM from an NAR board member and he stated that our NAR president John H. dealt directly with the farmer right after the incident and the board and insurance agent dealt with it afterwards and the result was as stated in my post #173. The cows were spooked by a rocket landing near them, ran through the fence and into the alfalfa field. Any other explanation of what happened is incorrect.

 

[Banzai88]

I received a PM from an NAR board member and he stated that our NAR president John H. dealt directly with the farmer right after the incident and the board and insurance agent dealt with it afterwards and the result was as stated in my post #173. The cows were spooked by a rocket landing near them, ran through the fence and into the alfalfa field. Any other explanation of what happened is incorrect.

Pity NAR decided to be coy in their official statement.

Truly a missed opportunity to build trust by speaking the plain truth and crafting a simple 'lessons learned to be added to best practices' moment.

Doesn't change my mind, however, in believing that the fence always was inadequate.

 

[jsdemar]

Many of us truly believe there was a second rocket on the grassy knoll.

 

[ShadowSpire48]

So the farmer failed to properly secure his cows and when they got spooked (and cows get spooked by anything, they're quite dumb), they broke through the fence. That's not really on the NAR, it's just coincidence that the rocket launch was the thing to spook the cows that day which caused them to eat something that looked fresh and juicy after busting through a fence the farmer failed to keep updated. If Mr president thinks launches shouldn't be around cows and other farm animals, perhaps he needs to go out into the country where most of his subjects NAR members fly. He'd have a field day in the Southeast. Wonder how tight his fingers/lips were regarding the incident at Airfest?

 

[MALBAR 70]

 

[Reinhard]

I'll just leave this here:



Reinhard

 

[cwbullet]

This thread has run its course - it waS locked.