Quick Question: Level 1 and 2 Cert. Flights for NAR on same day?

[watermelonman]

Hello,

I turned 18 this past Saturday (finally!) and would love to obtain certification to launch bigger motors and rockets!
However, I was planning on trying to Certify for Level 1 and Level 2 on the same launch day, February 7th. I have already built my Level 1 rocket, a LOC Vulcanite, and will finish building my Level 2 Giant Leap Vertical Assault 3.0.
I plan on doing both flights on lower impulse motors of their respective categories, and motor ejection for both flights as well. This is due to cost and simplicity for me.

This presents my question, which is in the title: Is this realistically possible? Of course it requires the the passing of the first flight, and then taking the written test before proceeding with the L2 flight, but considering my circumstances and experience with rocketry, does it seem do-able?

Some quick background info: I have been launching rockets for 10+ years, including designing, simulating (Rocksim), building, and launching custom rockets. I have also assisted in several high power launches at monthly launches of the club I participate in, which has a 15,000 feet ceiling. I also assisted in a N5800 project to 20,000 feet this past summer at my first time at Black Rock Desert.

Thank you for any and all advice, I greatly appreciate it!

caruolo

I am not sure about NAR rules, but Tripoli does not require L1 to take the L2 test, so that made it a little easier. I took the test weeks before flying then ran an H120 followed by a J290 in a Nuke Pro. Time can definitely be a concern, as is availability to equipment. Mike at Bay Area Rocketry knew what I was up to and kept my two orders ready to rock for when I first showed up in the morning, and the gap between flights. Of course if you have someone that can buy your motors and lighters beforehand that will not be a concern. I was not able to obtain lighters or test my tracker much beforehand, so I used my L1 flight to "ground" test both, using a full parachute at apogee and firing the second at low altitude. This way in case of failure, all I had to do was abort the L2 attempt and reevaluate rather than recover a core sample. Then for L2, I removed the full size apogee parachute and let it rip.

Of course, as others ask, why? Simply burning through certification levels as fast as possible is not the best goal. Heck you will be out of them soon! Myself, I am primarily into rockets for electronics, and needed unrestricted access to long burn motors. Heck if someone made H and I motors with 8 second burns I probably would not have bothered. Definitely keep safety in mind at all times, especially while building, and especially when making judgement calls on the range. We only get to keep doing this because we have such a great track record.

 

[taiwanluthiers]

A H with a 8 second burn would have an average thrust of around 30 newtons... maybe it will work for minimum diameter rockets that weights very little but not much else.

 

[watermelonman]

A H with a 8 second burn would have an average thrust of around 30 newtons... maybe it will work for minimum diameter rockets that weights very little but not much else.

Well sure, but both the H42 and I55 would have been near ideal for my current smaller and larger rockets if only they were closer to full H and I total impulse. If I could design my own I it would probably be perfect and cost a fraction of the J94s and K260s I am looking at now, not to mention less expensive building materials and techniques due to the difference in forces.

In any case this is all unimportant, the point was that my reason for rushing was to get my hands on specific long burn motors for current projects, not speeding to the biggest and most dangerous motors at the next level.

 

[chadrog]

Dang, I forgot the EZI 65 came with a payload section... it was in 2001 so I guess I forget some things too.

Yes, comes with payload section - kit does not include AV bay.

 

[taiwanluthiers]

I read from one of Apogee's newsletter that ISP (the company that owns Aerotech) will build you a custom motor for a fee... not sure how much though.

 

[AlnessW]

Of course, as others ask, why? Simply burning through certification levels as fast as possible is not the best goal. Heck you will be out of them soon! Myself, I am primarily into rockets for electronics, and needed unrestricted access to long burn motors. Heck if someone made H and I motors with 8 second burns I probably would not have bothered. Definitely keep safety in mind at all times, especially while building, and especially when making judgement calls on the range. We only get to keep doing this because we have such a great track record.

Why not? Everyone has different goals in this hobby. Some of us just want to move on to bigger and better things.

 

[loopy]

Why not? Everyone has different goals in this hobby. Some of us just want to move on to bigger and better things.

Along those lines, he's been launching for 10+ years now, and assisting others with HPR flights in all ranges. Now that he's old enough, he wants to do on his own what he's been doing with others for years now. seems reasonable to me. It's not like this is his first rodeo, and he's starting from square one as far as knowledge base of these motors and their capabilities are concerned.

 

[watermelonman]

Why not? Everyone has different goals in this hobby. Some of us just want to move on to bigger and better things.

Absolutely! Me of all people, with my rushed certifications, did not mean to detract at all. Honest curiosity, was all.

 

[caruolo]

Thanks against for all the support and advice, and those of you who helped explain my POV, I greatly appreciate it!

A quick update on my L1 flight can be seen here, with a precursor to whats to come for my L2!: https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?123500-My-L1-Flight-Snow-Ranch!

 

[Bat-mite]

Check out post #22.

If you like your club, I wouldn't go behind his back and ask someone else to administer it. But it might be worthwhile to call him and tell him how much you have prepared, how sure you are that you can do it, how disappointed you will be if you can't, and then ask him his rationale for not doing it. Maybe the two of you can come to terms.

 

[caruolo]

If you like your club, I wouldn't go behind his back and ask someone else to administer it. But it might be worthwhile to call him and tell him how much you have prepared, how sure you are that you can do it, how disappointed you will be if you can't, and then ask him his rationale for not doing it. Maybe the two of you can come to terms.

Thank you for bringing this up, and it is a point that I'm glad I didn't do.

I ended up coming into agreement with him to do the L2 in April after launching a few H's this Saturday. I'm also going to ask him if I can take the written test anyways this Saturday.