Has the lawsuit been settled or even litigated? If Baldwin is "not guilty" wouldn't that affect the lawsuit.
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Firearms Safety In The Entertainment Industry
- Thread starter K'Tesh
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I saw an interview where he said that he did not pull the trigger. He had to have pulled it. See below.
The gun just went off.
Ahem.. liar liar pants on fire. I've been shooting firearms of various kinds for decades and I've never had one just go off. I accidentally (that's how I remember it) put a live .22 round in the burn barrel when I was a kid and it went off. There was that time when I lit the burn barrel with gasoline but that's a story for another time (it was spectacular and a lot of work afterwards).
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Ah. You made me remember something. The correct term is transfer bar system and on my Colt King Cobra it looks the photo below. When the hammer is cocked the bar COVERS the firing pin. Why? The hammer is shaped such that when it is down there's a "tab" at the top of the hammer that hits the frame before the hammer can strike the firing pin (it's for drop safety). If I pull the hammer back and DON'T have the trigger pulled, the bar doesn't come up so the hammer can't strike the bar which then strikes the firing pin. I can post a photo of the side view if anyone is interested. As you said he had to have pulled the trigger. If he held the trigger down when he thumbed the hammer back, when he released the hammer on a live round. the pistol would fire.
Remember the old westerns when they would fan the pistol. ie slap their hand on the hammer and hold the trigger down? I don't know about all revolvers but if you tried that with my King Cobra the cylinder won't advance. Even if it did work recoil and fanning would likely make for a stack of dead innocent bystanders.
I have a very old .38 Police Special. The firing pin for this pistol is part of the trigger. Ie when the hammer falls, even from the half cocked position (the expression going off half cocked comes from this)
Let me know of you want to see side views of the different trigger styles. Nevermind. I'll post it below
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Titan II
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Carrying on a conversation during or shortly after discharges in confined areas is not going to happen.
didn't matter for OJ.
I shoot some calibers suppressed and those aren't too bad. A pellet gun makes more noise than my .22. The .223 and .308 aren't what I would call quiet, just quiet-er. NONE of my handguns are quiet (yet, I have a can ordered for the G21). They'll all give you hearing problems if you shoot them without hearing protection. My .338 Edge would likely give you permanent hearing loss if you weren't wearing hearing protection and standing 10 yards away. It makes the shade cover at the range ring. Typical comments from people 50 yards away when I shoot it start with mother (I have electronic muffs that blank the sound of the shot then amplify the sounds around me after the shot.
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The concussion on my .44 actually broke the glass on the control panel for the carrier.
ThirstyBarbarian
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My shotgun is extremely obnoxious at the indoor range. Every time I’ve shot it there, I’ve turned around, and there’s someone standing there covering their ears and looking at me with an expression that says, “Are you going to be doing that the whole time?”
That’s when you grin and thumb-up excitedly.
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Not much stops all shooting at a range other the punishment of a small black rifle shooting .458 SOCOM! Puts a shotgun blast to shame, and is right up there with the obnoxious pistol cartridges like 454 Casul and such.
As to indoor pistol, I have several suppressed 9mms that are very quiet, but the only thing out there that I've ever had in 35 years of owning suppresors that was Hollywood quiet is a .22 sub sonic purpose built suppressor round with a really good can. You can cough louder than a set up like that! I have several.
As to indoor pistol, I have several suppressed 9mms that are very quiet, but the only thing out there that I've ever had in 35 years of owning suppresors that was Hollywood quiet is a .22 sub sonic purpose built suppressor round with a really good can. You can cough louder than a set up like that! I have several.
Yup. I've got a CZ457 with a Dead Air Mask. When I shoot subs in it the bullet impact at 50 yards makes more noise than the shot. I am almost done building an 8.6 Blackout but it'll be a while before I can shoot it suppressed.
Wow, all you guys and your fancy suppressor's, I have a 1944 Remmington Target Master 22LR, with shorts in it, it makes no noise
I have always been taught never to assume a weapon is not loaded. That being said, the directors and producers must ensure they follow that standard.
???? Not sure what you are trying to say... I'm 6th gen Canadian from 1837.I chose to hear a Canadian/British accent when I read it. Was the momma Canadian or the daddy?just curious
Hey, I've got no problem with the rant.
I'm still curious though, for a professional, although a rookie armourer, how is it that 1 of the 5 rounds in the revolver were live? And how is it that 5 live rounds were found in Baldwin's gunbelt? And additional live rounds were found stored mixed in with the dummy rounds? If live vs dummy rounds can be verified by a small hole in the cartridge and the sound of BB's rattling then how on earth were they not identified and removed from the set if she was at all competent? Either she didn't do her job properly and didn't have complete security of the firearms/ammo (probable) or (extremely unlikely) somebody purposely planted live rounds in which case they would be a murder investigation instead of involuntary manslaughter. Even if her supplier mixed live and dummy rounds together and sent them to her as she contends, it would be her responsibility to verify each round.
From what I read about the armourer, she had been around firearms all her life and her Dad was an armourer and the supplier was well known to her. But this was her 2nd time as the armourer on a movie set. She had complained that the safety protocols were not up to standard and more training for the staff/talent needed to occur. Being young she may not have been respected or have had the clout to convince the producers of the need. Then there are the rumours about other crew members taking shooting practise with live ammo, and that the crew was rebellious, and other strange stories, blah blah blah.
Settled. Baldwin paid out an unknown amount to the family.
Now he just has to buy off Ms Carmack-Altwies who stated, "On my watch, no one is above the law, and everyone deserves justice."
If he gets off without being charged you may as well give up on the Justice system.
boatgeek
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He’s been charged, now it’s up to how well the defense and prosecution can influence 12 jurors. I haven’t checked yet, but it would be interesting to know if Baldwin and the armorer are going to be tried in the same trial. If they are, it’s somewhat harder for both people to get acquitted by blaming the other.
pvduke
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Long story short, read my posts again. (sorry, but it proves the Protocol points of order)Hey, I've got no problem with the rant.
I'm still curious though, for a professional, although a rookie armourer, how is it that 1 of the 5 rounds in the revolver were live? And how is it that 5 live rounds were found in Baldwin's gunbelt? And additional live rounds were found stored mixed in with the dummy rounds? If live vs dummy rounds can be verified by a small hole in the cartridge and the sound of BB's rattling then how on earth were they not identified and removed from the set if she was at all competent? Either she didn't do her job properly and didn't have complete security of the firearms/ammo (probable) or (extremely unlikely) somebody purposely planted live rounds in which case they would be a murder investigation instead of involuntary manslaughter. Even if her supplier mixed live and dummy rounds together and sent them to her as she contends, it would be her responsibility to verify each round.
From what I read about the armourer, she had been around firearms all her life and her Dad was an armourer and the supplier was well known to her. But this was her 2nd time as the armourer on a movie set. She had complained that the safety protocols were not up to standard and more training for the staff/talent needed to occur. Being young she may not have been respected or have had the clout to convince the producers of the need. Then there are the rumours about other crew members taking shooting practise with live ammo, and that the crew was rebellious, and other strange stories, blah blah blah.
Your first point? Excellent question, that not enough are asking. Again, said Pro does not know the difference between whole, loaded ammo and a squib. Stuff got mixed up cuz they broke SO many protocols and were partying. And someone paid the ultimate price.
Expanding- one can call themselves an 'expert', having been around FA all their life, but unless you have the actual experience/chops? Yer just a nobody with a gun flxing muscles you don't have and are a danger to yourself and others.
If you/LCO/RSO/ANYONE sees something WRONG, you toss the flag and everyone FREEZES. It is simply that simple. No one move. No one breathe. Stop and drop- re-assess.
There's a few shooters here that know what I mean. They save lives doing that.
My point is many fold. And, Live rounds should have NEVER gotten on that set (literally NO reason in the scripts WHY they should have been anywhere around there) with SO many unqualified idiots. No where near it. Sht went sideways, Negligent Discharges happed (no such thing as an Accidental Discharge- there simply is no such thing as FA's do NOT go off until someone picks one up) before the Big One, the union help left, and the so-called Armorer was still employed. How THAT is possible is beyond me.
Ms. Dinglebeery is an 'amorer' about as much as I am a brain surgeon. But somehow she got the billet and was Bonded and Approved. Which is to say, it's easier to do that than get an L1 motor when yer L0.
The gun went pew. Baldwin is way liable because of his "title and position" on that set, and, the Prior ND's, he KNEW the difference. And knew better. But didn't care, someone else is posed to take care of that for him. 20 years in the cooler- minimum. Screw him and his parties and anti-2A crew.
Ms. Dingleberry is looking at 15-20 years in the pen, NO PAROLE, if she really is bonded (LOL, right...). We'll see, Mr. B will prolly flex and bail her out. When more facts come to light in other trials, my hope is she NEVER sees daylight again. Ever.
Big comfort for the families affected, so far. Hollywood- 1, Friendlies- 0
That whole set at Rust met all 3 standards for the Triad of Failure, more than once, more than several times. The facts are out there. The courts refused to acknowledge any of it. Because> Well, I've addressed that.
I've seen it too much. Idiots partying, taking photos, the whole nine yards, El Jefe says: "it be OK homies, we got this". And.....WTH just happened?!
When Protocol is busted? People die. Don't matter if it's FA's, rockets, race cars or nuclear power plants. Unqualified People are the problem when they get loose. And that's EXCACTLY what happened at the Rust set. Been there, patched holes. It aint cool because almost every single time some friendly gets it, not the offender.
The union help split when it got loose, said fk this, we gone, there was no protocol afterwards, then the REAL party started cuz "no one was watching", and it was a snowball downhill after that.
And that's why HPR has LCO and RSO.... you must must be be able to show you are capable of not hurting yourself or others. They know their stuff, they got their billet the old fashioned way, by knowing the drill and through experience. And they WILL shut you down if you jack around. If I screw up? I expect to be ejected. I take my rocket, my gear, my dog and truck and go home and think about what I did.
That way?
I and my fellow shooters are safe and can shoot again. In safety.
Safety isn't hard. It's common sense. (yeh, I know, short supply).
But/And that's why We (rocketeers) are lucky to have the Safety Standards and Protocols that we do. Our Range Officers look out for US and Ours, not just the Rules. They REALLY care. Don't you agree?
Safety Protocol is KISS, no matter what one does. If one does it?
No one dies.
It's that simple.
My Grandma's colt single action was so worn, that it would randomly fire at times. But, being a single-action pistol, You had to cock it first.
You'd hope the firearms on set were well maintained, but who knows with this sh1tsh0w.
Probably can't hear because you shot that .44 without hearing protection too many times.Wow, all you guys and your fancy suppressor's, I have a 1944 Remmington Target Master 22LR, with shorts in it, it makes no noise
My .22 makes less noise than a pellet gun with the can and subsonic ammo. Using "full power" ammo and the can is about like a .22 short. Typing "full power" as it relates to a .22 cracks me up. However, the lowly .22 will kill schtuff and fairly long range...
A 2021 Newsweek article on the armorer with a screen grab excerpt...
https://www.newsweek.com/alec-baldwin-prop-gun-rust-hannah-gutierrez-reed-armorer-1643386
https://www.newsweek.com/alec-baldwin-prop-gun-rust-hannah-gutierrez-reed-armorer-1643386
pvduke
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Yep those are the facts.
If you drill down past all the cover up and the BS you find the facts.
If you drill down past all the cover up and the BS you find the facts.
ThirstyBarbarian
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Probably can't hear because you shot that .44 without hearing protection too many times.
My .22 makes less noise than a pellet gun with the can and subsonic ammo. Using "full power" ammo and the can is about like a .22 short. Typing "full power" as it relates to a .22 cracks me up. However, the lowly .22 will kill schtuff and fairly long range...
My new 22 was delivered to the FFL on Friday and I should be able to take possession in less than 2 weeks. I’m looking forward to it! That should be less obnoxious than the 12 gauge.
I just read that Bruce Willis has permanent hearing damage from filming the first Die Hard movie. The director had the armorer increase the load of the blanks, for a bigger flash and bang. Obviously he could wear hearing protection like the rest of the crew. Heck of a thing to lose part of your senses for a movie. Even worse to lose your life !
I have a lot of fun with mine. Especially the quiet version. I live outside of town (6 miles) and I have a little steel plate that I can easily hang up on a 2x4 screwed to a fence post. It's 45 yards from the back door according to my Leica rangefinder. The magazine only holds five rounds. In the photo below the FTCF, freeway traffic compliment finger, is pointing at a flier (ie I screwed up and pulled the shot somehow. The pointing finger is the 4 shot group. The group is about thumb sized. Not terrible. The CZ is capable of better but the subs and can affect accuracy a little.
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