air started R/C rocket glider

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Clipper

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Dose anybody have any input on a bunge launched, air started rc rocket glider?
I could use the throttle and a brushed ESC, but found the brushed ESC I have goes into motor lock out if the throttle is not all the down when powering up. I Would like some Ideas on an interlock to prevent premature ignition while handling and launching. Such as a dual input switch.
 
I am using the Quest Q2G2 motor lighters for all my glider launches using end burners from Estes D's to Aerotech G12's with very reliable ignition.

This would allow for a simple micro switch to a battery of your choosing with a safety switch in line to disconnect the igniter during radio power up. Then you can use a small HS55 servo or equivalent to operate the micro switch from the throttle stick or even a switch on the transmitter. Very light, uncomplicated and inexpensive and you don't risk an igniter short across your receiver battery during ignition.

Just an idea.
 
John Kallend gave presented his design for the LadyHawk in the 1993 RC Modeler magazine. He used two 50mAh batteries with an Estes solar igniter with a Jomar electronic switch on the throttle. It weighs 1/2 oz. and is electrically isolated from the receiver battery. It is arranged to turn on only at full throttle with full trim.
 
Will,

Thanks for information. I bought the Jomar switch parts years ago and they worked on a bench test, but I never tried them in flight. Rather than tear everything out of my Lady Hawk, which I flew only once years ago, I am tempted to buy the switch that you suggested. Will that switch work with a 9-volt battery for ignition.

Bob
 
The "BattleSwitch" series are just mechanical relays. As long as your battery is up to the task then you should be OK. A 9V cell would probably work for one or two Estes igniters. Haven't tried it myself. It would be fine for the Quest igniters.
 
Well, I ordered the switch from Dimensional last night for about $20. With some luck I might try it within a month or two, but sometimes my projects take much longer.
 
With all this information, I may have to rethink what I'm going to do!;)
 
I am using the Quest Q2G2 motor lighters for all my glider launches using end burners from Estes D's to Aerotech G12's with very reliable ignition.

This would allow for a simple micro switch to a battery of your choosing with a safety switch in line to disconnect the igniter during radio power up. Then you can use a small HS55 servo or equivalent to operate the micro switch from the throttle stick or even a switch on the transmitter. Very light, uncomplicated and inexpensive and you don't risk an igniter short across your receiver battery during ignition.

Just an idea.

So the Quest Q2g2 ignitor should work with the RMS R/C 32mm motors without mod?:gavel:

By the way, any one know of a source of 32mm Motor Mount Tubes. The BT-55 tubes are pretty light duty.
 
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Sorry to resurrect an old thread but has anyone tried an air launch RC rocket glider?

I am thinking about it as something new to try. My thoughts are an Aerotech F-13 RC, Blue Thunder propellant.

Ideally I want to ignite it with a 8v battery with very low internal impedance battery (LiPo).

EDIT: I would either bungee launch (ugh) or piggy back the glider up on another RC plane, probably a radian ( https://www.horizonhobby.com/products/radian-rtf-PKZ4700 )


Thanks,

Matt
 
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I have been trying over the past several years to ignite my Orbiter/glider on the 4xOT model without success. It should be possible. I will try again this year. I tried the Dimensional device mentioned earlier in this thread and I did not like it. It seemed to me that in bench tests that it had about a one-in-four chance of firing as soon as it was armed. So, I went back to the Jomar switch. I am using the Q2G2 igniters to ignite the long-burning Apogee E or F motors. Maybe on one or two occasions I have dipped them in Quick Burst pryogen, but I usually don't bother anymore. When I do dip them, they usually became too large to fit through the nozzle. These igniters have worked on two occasions, so I know that they work. One time there was an on-pad ignition as soon as the glider was armed. I cannot remember if this was the Dimensional switch or the Jomar switch (If it was the Jomar switch, it was my fault. It should be written up in my records.) On another occasion the glider ignited after booster separation, but one wing was severely damaged, etc. and the motor fired inadvertently.

In 2012 there were two failed attempts to fire the glider, but no damage of any kind. The first was at Hellfire in late July. On the bench test both glider no. 1 and back-up glider no. 2 failed the bench test on the Salt Flats to show positive ignition capability, so I launched the glider with no in-flight ignition attempt. As I recall when I got home and tried the bench test things worked fine. There is a screw adjustment on the Jomar switch that may be affecting things. In September I tried again and when I pushed the throttle nothing happened. For that attempt the pre-flight bench test with adjustment was probably one or two weeks before the launch. It seems that I need to re-visit this adjustment more thoroughly. It would be good in the coming year to do the adjustment and testing within one day of launching.
 
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I've done this in the past and just used a simple dc speed control on the flap or gear switch. I just hook up the igniter after rx power up and binding and have not had any glitches in flight. For a non end burner if you are using a copperhead you probably want a 3s battery, if using something lower current then 2s is fine.

For the question of 32mm tubes, I just use 29mm tubes, slit them, slide them over my motor tube (covered) in plastic, then glue a 1/2" piece of tube over the joint with ca glue, works fine.

Frank
 
I cannot remember if this was the Dimensional switch or the Jomar switch (If it was the Jomar switch, it was my fault. It should be written up in my records.)

What do you think the difference between the 2 switches is (was)? Dimension and Jomar?I have used products from both places BTW but not for this application.

Thanks for taking the time to write.
 
What do you think the difference between the 2 switches is (was)? Dimension and Jomar?I have used products from both places BTW but not for this application.

Thanks for taking the time to write.

I went back and looked at my records for September 2010. It was the Dimensional (electromechanical) that ignited on the pad when the glider was first armed. I have two switches for the glider. One is for the Receiver and one is for the igniter circuit. Evidently, there is a power surge when things are first turned on. As I recall the vendor for Dimensional did not mention anything about the power surge when I pressed him. The Jomar vendor did. I was disappointed and took the Dimensional out. The Dimensional has the advantage of being very small and easy to mount right next to the application, but I decided that I did not want to mess with it anymore. As I recall I must turn the Receiver on first with the igniter circuit closed. The power surge is over instantly on this first power up. I can then turn on the arming circuit.
 
Mr Matt,

I am presently using a 35amp brushed esc from GWS for the igniter in my funjet. This continues to work happily, I do recommend powering up your TX then Rx then when control checks are done then hook up the igniter. I did try and figure out a way I needed two switches on the Tx to use as a safety but I'm not as smart as my radio.

I have used a Q2G2 igniter when a copperhead let me down and that was just fine. My on board power supply is a 450Mah 3s Lipo battery which pokes out the required 12v for the copperhead. If you are going to use F13 reloads in the 32mm motor, as the fuel grain is deeper in the casing, I suggest using the longer Q2G2 igniters as these will give you a bit longer tail to work with.

My intention was to airstart the Funjet but have too many other projects to arrange building a mother ship. A dual Radian(a la White Knight One) or one of the many look alikes was what I had in mind.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.

PLanecrazy
 
To fire a pyro from an RC receiver, it seems like the simplest way would be a little PIC/AVR watching the pulse train from the receiver for a 100% signal that stays for a second or so, then triggering a FET inline with the battery. Something like this would work as well, though it seems pricey for what it is, IMO.

https://www.apogeerockets.com/Electronics_Payloads/Dual-Deployment/TripleFire?cPath=52_191&

I'd offer to hack something up, but a quick google found this little guy: https://www.pololu.com/catalog/product/1211

One of those should be able to fire just about any ignitor you might have around, and looks to have some safety margin, like detecting a valid RC pulse train before allowing a trigger...
 
I tried a Hansen Hobbies unit and it lit a copperhead on 2s lipo no problem.

I now just have to find a way to get the glider up >100 feet.
 
Is your intent to fly it as a rocket powered R/C plane, in which case you need to see if AMA covers this or if it is otherwise legal, or is your intent to fly it as a manually guided rocket, in which case other questions come up? It is a cool thing to do, but I'm not sure it lands under what we are allowed to do.

Gerald
 
With regard to NAR as I recall for an R/C plane in-flight ignition the flyer needs to ignite the plane 100 feet or higher off the ground and he needs to call out an audible countdown.
 
Is your intent to fly it as a rocket powered R/C plane, in which case you need to see if AMA covers this or if it is otherwise legal, or is your intent to fly it as a manually guided rocket, in which case other questions come up? It is a cool thing to do, but I'm not sure it lands under what we are allowed to do.

Gerald

In addition to the NAR rules posted, rocket powered aircraft are fine with the AMA as well (up to G power), launch them any way you like.
 
By the way, any one know of a source of 32mm Motor Mount Tubes. The BT-55 tubes are pretty light duty.

The Aerotech casting tube (for 38mm motors) is what I use on the Delta Star models 32mm motor mount:

https://www.rocketmotorparts.com/38mm_Casting_Tube,_1308__OD/p1577809_7781888.aspx

1.308" OD, 1.274" ID, 22.75" long, cost is $3.75 each.

Not sure why Aerotech simply doesn't make an exact tube for their casing??

If unsure of strength, wick thin CA on the protruding edges....

David
 
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