iPhone for Telemetry

MotionX makes a GPS program that automatically sends updates via text message on the iPhone and other phones. This is pretty decent program to get real time telemetry information.

Anyone tried to launch an iPhone into the air? If you have, what case did you use to protect it?


My wife thinks I'm crazy.


Sapan

OverlordvI said:

Anyone tried to launch an iPhone into the air? If you have, what case did you use to protect it?


My wife thinks I'm crazy.


Sapan

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I have seen a movie of someone putting an iPhone on a helium balloon, and that got to the stratosphere.. Launching it in a rocket is much less scary, I think..
I've bought a mockup iPhone 4 to launch, I'll tell you what happened once I got it into the air

Seriously, it's a possibility, but the new altimeter two would be a better choice if you want accelleration and height data. And a small GPS device too.
iphones are heavy and bulky. Not impossible, but not practical either, and expensive in case of CATO or other disaster.

although I like the way you're thinking

There is a blog story about someone that did:

https://mobileorchard.com/the-iphone-rocket/

FYI

Not that it seems to stop anyone from doing it, but using a cell phone from an air vehicle is illegal.

Bob

bobkrech said:

FYI

Not that it seems to stop anyone from doing it, but using a cell phone from an air vehicle is illegal.

Bob

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interesting comment.

Why would it be?

Beyond the possibility of interference with avionics (the primary reason why cell phones can't be used on commercial flights), my understanding is that it can play havoc with the cellular network itself.

Supposedly, the cellular network switching systems operate on the assumption that a person's phone is only establishing contact with 2-3 cell sites at a time, generally adjacent ones. If you take a cell phone to a high altitude, you could potentially "illuminate" many more towers at once, perhaps slowing the entire network down.

Any cellular/mobile engineers out there who can confirm/deny this issue?

If you don't want to shell out for a dedicated tracking app, you could always use Pandora's app - though it might confuse their advertisers a bit if you put it in a rocket.

SCE to AUX said:

..the cellular network switching systems operate on the assumption that a person's phone is only establishing contact with 2-3 cell sites at a time, generally adjacent ones. If you take a cell phone to a high altitude, you could potentially "illuminate" many more towers at once, perhaps slowing the entire network down.Any cellular/mobile engineers out there who can confirm/deny this issue?

Click to expand...

Not a cellular/mobile engineer, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express one night!

You've got it exactly, Bob. Each time a cell relay system hears a cell phone and logs it into the system, it takes up a slot in the system's capabilities, regardless of whether the cell site is the one "selected" to talk with the phone or not. That's how you can instantly switch from one cell site to the other without dropping a call.

But, like Bob Krech also said - it may be illegal, but rarely stops anyone from doing it.

I would assume that to use an I-phone to track a rocket, you must have cell service at the site and over the whole landing area. Definately not a certainty considering the size and isolation of a lot of launch sites.

If you do happen to have cell service and have 3G service as well, this <$80 device might work. Zoombak GPS locator
That one or one similar was used a few week ago to track a rocket at Battlepark. It was windy, about 15mph winds. The rocket was a 38mm minimum diameter with a J570W motor. It reached an altitude of 11,000+ feet. A laptop with a cellular data access card was used to access the website to determine the location. The owner walked right to the rocket about a mile away. He got his L2 cert when he showed up with the recovered rocket. There were a few surprised people around.

It worked, it cost a lot less then a rocket specific GPS tracking system and less then an I-Phone and the monthly access charge for the web site is $9.99 so it's cost is less then a 3G plan for an I-Phone.

I would assume there are other makes of GPS locators out there also.

I saw that zoombak device awhile ago. Terrible reviews on Amazon but a nice size overall.

Where can i find the legal code that restricts cell phone use in the air? I thought it was only planes.

§ 22.925 Prohibition on airborne operation of cellular telephones.

Cellular telephones installed in or carried aboard airplanes, balloons or any other type of aircraft must not be operated while such aircraft are airborne (not touching the ground). When any aircraft leaves the ground, all cellular telephones on board that aircraft must be turned off. The following notice must be posted on or near each cellular telephone installed in any aircraft:

“The use of cellular telephones while this aircraft is airborne is prohibited by FCC rules, and the violation of this rule could result in suspension of service and/or a fine. The use of cellular telephones while this aircraft is on the ground is subject to FAA regulations.”

-- Greg

Hi,

Would it actually be legal to put a cell phone in a balloon / rocket in offline mode, and a software that monitors the GPS location and when the device has landed it would switch to online mode and send the location information?

This would of course preclude any real-time telemetry during the flight. I'm also not sure whether software has permission to change the online / offline status of the phone.

Cheers,
Sampo N.

Looks like I'll be stuck with the ham radio transmitter.

My dad has an iPad. It's not going in a rocket, but it is useful for tracking. There are several apps that decode GPS packets and puts points on a map. The coolest one that I've found listens to a regular radio reciever and puts the points in google earth or APRS. I'm sure that some of the apps are available on the iPhone as well.

BsSmith,
Could you tell me more about these apps you are talking about? That looks interesting! I have an iPhone and would love to use it to track my rockets.

Sampo said:

Would it actually be legal to put a cell phone in a balloon / rocket in offline mode, and a software that monitors the GPS location and when the device has landed it would switch to online mode and send the location information?

This would of course preclude any real-time telemetry during the flight. I'm also not sure whether software has permission to change the online / offline status of the phone.

Click to expand...

IIRR, the IOs API says that it takes human intervention to move from Normal mode to Airplane mode and back (which is basically what you're thinking about) but I could be wrong.

The apps are called Coordcalc, PocketPacket, and Gaia GPS. I think the Gaia is the most advanced, but they all work in their own way. What you do is you set up a GPS transmitter in the rocket, and you use a regular HAM reciever to pick up the transmission. Then, you let the iPhone/iPad listen to the radio, which sounds like random nonsense. The iPhone/iPad will then decode the GPS transmission and turn in into a coordinate, which is then displayed on a map (if you have 3G).

They don't do anything really special, they just make it so you don't have to buy a special GPS reciever.

During our latest launch we had a real-time telemetry feed of (among others) two GPS chipsets, and we were able to get a real-time 3D plot of the flight in Google Earth. We also streamed the data real-time to the Internet so others could follow the flight also in real-time.

Here's the KML file which we saw drawn in real-time: https://eetu.tunk.org/haisunaata/data/realtime-flight-track.kmz

It's interesting to see that the Skytraq GPS chipset produced the real flight track all the way, but the SiRF chipset (red line) went completely haywire. The SiRF algorithms were thrown off by the sudden vertical movement it does not expect. Wonder what the iPhone has...

More info on the flight: https://eetu.tunk.org/haisunaata/

Cheers,
Sampo N.

Sampo said:

During our latest launch we had a real-time telemetry feed of (among others) two GPS chipsets, and we were able to get a real-time 3D plot of the flight in Google Earth. We also streamed the data real-time to the Internet so others could follow the flight also in real-time.

Here's the KML file which we saw drawn in real-time: https://eetu.tunk.org/haisunaata/data/realtime-flight-track.kmz

It's interesting to see that the Skytraq GPS chipset produced the real flight track all the way, but the SiRF chipset (red line) went completely haywire. The SiRF algorithms were thrown off by the sudden vertical movement it does not expect. Wonder what the iPhone has...

More info on the flight: https://eetu.tunk.org/haisunaata/

Cheers,
Sampo N.

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Excellent. The Skytraq data looks good. Which chipset did your GPS receiver have?

Bob

bobkrech said:

Excellent. The Skytraq data looks good. Which chipset did your GPS receiver have?

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The Skytraq was a Ventus G730 logger that was modified to get the serial NMEA data out of it - not sure about the exact chipset model. We've used the Skytraq successfully earlier as well, and had some problems with a third chipset type (can't remember which, quite an old one).

Cheers,
Sampo N.

Sampo said:

The Skytraq was a Ventus G730 logger that was modified to get the serial NMEA data out of it - not sure about the exact chipset model. We've used the Skytraq successfully earlier as well, and had some problems with a third chipset type (can't remember which, quite an old one).

Cheers,
Sampo N.

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Very nice data, and has a fair price as well.

Bob

On a somewhat related note, there's a great little device made by Immersion RC, which allows telemetry to be sent TO your Iphone, so you can view your trajectory and flight on the phone in real time, or record it and view it later.

Though this does require a downlink, tuned 2.4 antennas on the TX and yagi's on the RX have provided up to 45km range. See teamblacksheep.com for details on long range capabilities.

Check out the EZ OSD system, Tiny telemetry, Antenna Tracker and iTelemetry at immersionRC.com, or NGhobbies.com.

.... and it's legal....

Cheers,

Pat

Hey that's pretty cool!

The whole telemetry to your iphone / iPad concept is what is neat. No reason why rockets can't be connected in this day and age...

OMG the video of the thing in action as it tracks a plane in real time is amazing: https://www.vimeo.com/5263889