V-2 to Wasserfall conversion

[BARX2]

Although the Wasserfall was much smaller than the V-2, the dimensions were very similar. I created a composite image of a V-2 and a Wasserfall side by side to show the similarities. You can print out the larger image and, if you like, cut out the pictures to overlay one over the other to see what modifications are necessary to go from the V-2 tailfins to the Wasserfall's. I'll post pictures of the Wasserfall when it's completed.



Credit: Pictures from https://www.astronautix.com/

 

[Stymye]

you can post some construction pics as well, If you like

 

[adrian]

Originally posted by BARX2
I created a composite image of a V-2 and a Wasserfall side by side to show the similarities. You can print out the larger image and, if you like, cut out the pictures to overlay one over the other to see what modifications are necessary to go from the V-2 tailfins to the Wasserfall's.

Basically, you need extra tabs on the fins, and an extra set of fins part way up the body. Those extra fins are going to move the CP well forward and the tabs won't be enough to compensate. You will need to add a good deal of nose weight. If you don't, the model will be unstable. If you don't add enough, the model may be almost stable, in which case it will tip over soon after clearing the launch rod, become stable because some of the propellant isn't there any more so the CG has moved forward, then continue on a straight line in whichever direction it's pointing. I speak from personal experience with my A9. After more nose weight was added, the A9 flew perfectly, and has been doing so ever since. The CG of the fully loaded A9 is now about half way up the body.

 

[BARX2]

Adrian, thanks very much for the advice. Your explanation is very clear. I'll definitely be adding nose weight, swing testing and profiling the design using VCP. I've always been one to over-build and so I'm used to adding nose weight to my rockets. My usual method has been to pour epoxy into the nose cone followed by lead shot. Very nice looking rocket. Thanks for sharing the picture.

 

[Pem Tech]

Originally posted by BARX2
to see what modifications are necessary to go from the V-2 tailfins to the Wasserfall's. I'll post pictures of the Wasserfall when it's completed.

Bravo!

Excellent choice in historical rocketry, a scale Wasserfall has been on my "To Build" list for years.
Please post construction pics as you go along.

 

[zog43editor]

I've built 2 Wasserfall models, one was bt-60 based with an 18mm motor mount, and the other a bt-50 based with 13mm mount.

I used the plans from Peter Alway's Scale Bash book, and somewhere have some RockSim files. I can look for them when i get home tonight if that will help.

I used the bt-60 version for my first ever NARAM sport scale model back in 2001.

Another source for info about the Wasserfall is the book Secret Wonder Weapons of the Third Reich which also has line drawingings and descriptions of several other German WWII missiles.

kj

 

[BARX2]

zog43editor, I've ordered Scale Bash but haven't received it yet. I'd be very interested in seeing your RockSim data. I haven't purchased RockSim, but maybe I can install it in the trial mode and convert the data to VCP. Can you attach the RockSim file(s) here? Thanks.

 

[adrian]

Here are a couple of web pages about Wasserfall, with photos:

Luft46:
https://www.luft46.com/missile/wasserfl.html

Luftarchiv.de: (requires you to click on a disclaimer that says any depiction of the swastika on the site is for historical, not political reasons)
https://www.luftarchiv.de/flugkorper/c2.htm

Now, take a look at the Luft46 one, scroll about 3/4 of the way down, and find the photo "Various windtunnel models of the V-2 and Wasserfall missiles". That should give you plenty of V-2 variants to play with.

BT-60 is nice for V-2's because it is about 1.6" diameter and the real V-2 was about 1.6m diameter. So if you can find plans dimensioned in metres, then where they say metres, you read inches.

If you can find it, Pete Alway's "In The Shadow Of The V-2" is another good source. As well as German variants such as Wasserfall and A9/A10, it has several post-war American and Russian developments. And so I built the Russian V-2-A.

 

[MetMan]

Here are a couple of related threads.

First to the the very valuable "Secret Weapons of the Luftwaffe" thread:

https://rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9647&highlight=luftwaffe

And to my Wasserfall bash thread:

https://rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=22149&highlight=luftwaffe

Still waiting to paint...

 

[zog43editor]

Originally posted by BARX2
zog43editor, I've ordered Scale Bash but haven't received it yet. I'd be very interested in seeing your RockSim data. I haven't purchased RockSim, but maybe I can install it in the trial mode and convert the data to VCP. Can you attach the RockSim file(s) here? Thanks.

I found the files, they are on my non-networked pc. I've got my thumbdrive tonight and I'll post them later on tonight when I get home.

kj

 

[zog43editor]

I had a bear getting these off my old pc.

Here's the bt50 version.

kj

 

[zog43editor]

And here's the bt60 version. This makes a nice sized model.

kj

 

[BARX2]

Originally posted by zog43editor
I had a bear getting these off my old pc.

Here's the bt50 version.

kj

I really do appreciate it, zog43editor! I'm getting closer to building the Wasserfall. I am very methodical and have to build a project in my head before I begin the actual work. I did a little experiment over the weekend that went horribly wrong, but forturnately, nothing valuable was lost. I haven't done any epoxy laminating in years and I wanted to do a nice job. I bought some heavy pressboad - very fine grain and heavy! - some lexan sheets and 20-minute marine epoxy. I haven't got my fiberglass yet, so I thought I'd do a test piece by laminating balsa with silk span paper. I waxed the lexan sheets with carnauba wax and went to work. Long story short, I have some interesting, permanently bonded composite material now: a sheet of balsa surrounded by silk span surrounded by the lexan sheets!! Umm, where did I get the idea that epoxy wouldn't stick to lexan?? Anyway, back to the drawing board. One positive result of the failed experiment is that as I sat there looking at the mess I thought "Why go through all that trouble. Why not just make the fins out of lexan?" So I think that's what I'll do for at least the upper fins on the Wasserfall. Thanks again.

 

[WillMarchant]

Originally posted by zog43editor
And here's the bt60 version. This makes a nice sized model.

kj

Looks nice! Thanks for posting that!

The tail cone is marked as "custom". Is it a chopped PNC-60MS nosecone?

 

[zog43editor]

Yes, the tailcone on the 60 verson is the same as the nose- PNC60MS.

Peter's instructions in scale bash gave me the length. He also gives patterns for the fins and tabs which are 2 parts. I think I had a photo on the old machine, I'll check for that tonight.

K

 

[zog43editor]

Here is the picture of my bt60 version.

 

[WillMarchant]

Originally posted by zog43editor
Here is the picture of my bt60 version.

Very nice! I managed to score an AstroX kit for the Wasserfall last year. I've attached a photo. But I think that is such a cool subject that I'll need to bash another one. Thanks very much for the information!

 

[zog43editor]

All this digging around for my old Wasserfall stuff has made me want to convert my Canadian Arrow kit. It's gonna have to wait until after the WSMC though. Most of my build time for the forseeable future is devoted to that.

kj

 

[rokitflite]

Originally posted by zog43editor
All this digging around for my old Wasserfall stuff has made me want to convert my Canadian Arrow kit. It's gonna have to wait until after the WSMC though. Most of my build time for the forseeable future is devoted to that.

kj

OOOOOO! Make it R/C Kevin!!! That's always fun!

 

[BARX2]

Here's the first look at my Wasserfall based on the Estes Canadian Arrow. As I said above, I'm slow. I'm also working on about three other projects at the same time. The upper fins are held in place by the fin alignment guide. I'll glue them on tomorrow. I was just doing a test fit and thought I'd take a picture. Wish I had used the flash! You will also notice some putty on the tip of the nose cone. I'll take more pictures at it progresses. It should go a lot quicker after all the fins are in place.

 

[lessgravity]

Looking good!
I gotta be there when you fly it

 

[BARX2]

I hope so, Wayne. We need to get together one of these days.

 

[Race58]

Did you ever fly this baby??

Here's the first look at my Wasserfall based on the Estes Canadian Arrow. As I said above, I'm slow. I'm also working on about three other projects at the same time. The upper fins are held in place by the fin alignment guide. I'll glue them on tomorrow. I was just doing a test fit and thought I'd take a picture. Wish I had used the flash! You will also notice some putty on the tip of the nose cone. I'll take more pictures at it progresses. It should go a lot quicker after all the fins are in place.