Three Awesome New CTI Motors :)

[n3tjm]

Wanted to post a review of three CTI motors I flew this weekend .

First Up is the CTI G54 Red Lightning. (159G54-12A) It uses the Pro29 3G case and features a single moon burning grain. I was going use it in my Aerotech Sumo, but I noticed some fin damage, so I decided to use my MR-1 instead. I was jipped an igniter, so I used a magnelite. With the combined BP pellet and Magnelite, the motor ignited instantly. The MR-1 seemed to boost forever, with a loud roar, nice red flame, and plenty of white smoke. Very unusual to see a long burning Red motor. Very nice .

Unfortunately there was a memory card error so I did not get a video of the flight

 

[n3tjm]

Next up is the CTI I175 White (411I175-14A). It uses the Pro38 3G case. I found this motor appealing because I felt it is a good alternative to the Aerotech I161, which was my favorite Aerotech I load. The I174 has a total impulse of 411n (compared to an Aerotech I161which has a TI of 328.7n) and a burn time of 2.36 seconds (I161 was 1.8s).

The feel of the propellant grains, and the look of the flame reminds me of Loki White.

Here's a vid of the flight. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8yxb3dYwLg

 

[n3tjm]

Finally I want mention the CTI J354 White (819J354-16A) which uses the Pro38 6G case. No need to mention what Aerotech motor this reminds me of; the J350, which I used to get my L2. The J354 has a TI of 819n and burns for 2.3s. For comparison sake, the current Aerotech J350 is 670n with a burn of 1.5s. The feel of the propellant grains, and the look of the flame reminds me of Loki White.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=we8xZL-2-i8e

 

[stickershock23]

Doug,

Nice shots. the long burn reds are AWESOME.. I was pleasantly surprised.

 

[madsen]

I want mention the CTI J354 White (819J354-16A) which uses the Pro38 6G case. No need to mention what Aerotech motor this reminds me of; the J350, which I used to get my L2. The J354 has a TI of 819n and burns for 2.3s. For comparison sake, the current Aerotech J350 is 670n with a burn of 1.5s.

If you want to compare the J354 to an equivalent Aerotech product--may I suggest that you not use the J350--that is a mid-size motor. May I suggest that you compare the J354 to the Aerotech J570 and the Aerotech J510W--a true monster!. Even the old J570 beats the CTI motor with 1060NS vs.819 for the CTI J354. When you move up to the J510W--the Aerotech motor is a monster with 1,162NS vs. 819NS for CTI.

Also, the Aerotech J510W has a peak thrust of 250 lbs vs. 117lbs for the J354(taken off the CTI website).

P.S. Accoring to the Aerotech website--the J350 has a total impulse of 700NS--not 670.

 

[Rocketman248]

While I don't disagree that the J570 and J510 are awesome motors (J570 is still one of my all time favorite motors), it's unfair to compare them to CTI's 6-grain loads. A better comparison for them would be their 6GXL loads. The J420 Classic has 1,008NS and the J530 Imax packs 1,115 into the 19 inch case. The J510W is 23 inches long and only about 50NS more.

I think Doug is spot on with his comparison. They are both 6 grain motors, but the J354 outperforms the J350 by a good amount.

Please don't take this as a CTI vs AT argument. I assure you I'm not partial to either. I fly both manufacturers all the time!

 

[COrocket]

If you want to compare the J354 to an equivalent Aerotech product--may I suggest that you not use the J350--that is a mid-size motor.

Seems like a fair comparison - The J354 and the J350 both use 6 grain cases.
It isn't fair to compare a 6 grain CTI to a 9 grain Aerotech, much less a J510. The J510 (1162 Ns) could be compared to the CTI J530 (1115 Ns).

I have a feeling you like Aerotech more than CTI

 

[cjl]

Seems like a fair comparison - The J354 and the J350 both use 6 grain cases.
It isn't fair to compare a 6 grain CTI to a 9 grain Aerotech, much less a J510. The J510 (1162 Ns) could be compared to the CTI J530 (1115 Ns).

I have a feeling you like Aerotech more than CTI

To be fair, the J510 is a 6 grain motor...


(Admittedly, the grains are enormous...)

 

[madsen]

Seems like a fair comparison - The J354 and the J350 both use 6 grain cases.
It isn't fair to compare a 6 grain CTI to a 9 grain Aerotech, much less a J510. The J510 (1162 Ns) could be compared to the CTI J530 (1115 Ns).

The J510W is a 6 grain White Lightning motor. If you want to compare it to the CTI J530--that works for me. The Aerotech J510 has more total impulse, and over 60 pounds more of peak thrust.

They are both fine motors.

 

[Rocketman248]

The J510 really is in a class of it's own. The case is close to 2 feet long, and it uses 6 very long grains. I really want to try one!

A much better comparison would be the J570 vs the J530. They both use similar grain configurations and are both about the same size. The J530 has a larger total impulse and a little bit longer burn, but the J570 is quite a bit more aggressive. The initial thrust is just over 250lbs! :y:

 

[Viperfixr]

The J510 really is in a class of it's own. The case is close to 2 feet long, and it uses 6 very long grains. I really want to try one!

I have one (AT J510) at home waiting to fly...it hurts seeing the liner just laying there. It would have flown it in my dual-deploy BSD 38 Special last weekend had Oktoberfest not been rained out! The motor does look brutish-long, good thing my 38 Special is an over-built tank.

 

[madsen]

The J510 really is in a class of it's own. The case is close to 2 feet long, and it uses 6 very long grains. I really want to try one!

I recently acquired access to a 4th 38/1320 case. I am slowly--very slowly--building an RDS Centaurs (7.5" X 10'--RDS has had at least 3 spellings for this rocket over the years--often at the same time). I'm thinking two J510's will get it off the ground--and two J510's to keep it moving. The fins are 3/8" Baltic Birch, huge, and very heavy. The nosecone weighs a ton--even so, I am not willing to light all 4 J510's at the same time. I have a special 25" tool box to carry the motors. It is a really great motor.

 

[n3tjm]

P.S. Accoring to the Aerotech website--the J350 has a total impulse of 700NS--not 670.

The Aerotech website, catalog, and instructions Total Impulse's are always rounded. Also, the 700ns is closer to the classic J350 load which if my memory serves me well used a 3/8" core (697n with an average thrust of 394n).
(https://www.thrustcurve.org/motorsearch.jsp?id=270)'

After the fire and Ellis started making Propellant for Aerotech, the core was enlarged to .5" to prevent catos, and the motors had to be recertified. The new and current "J350" has a total impulse of 670.1n and average thrust of 445n (https://www.thrustcurve.org/motorsearch.jsp?id=269)

Most motor manufactures past and present round these numbers, and in the case of average thrust, choose a number which makes sense marketing wise and may not reflect the actual average thrust. Other examples of this include the Estes A10, Flight Systems F100, Quest C6.

CTI is one of the few companies that decided to name their motors with their actual values. For caparison sake, I will list the two J350's using CTI's labeling scheme.

697J394-XX <- post recert and technically not currently certified.
670J445-XX <- Current J350 with 1/2" Core

Comparing the J354 to the J570 or J550 is not a fair fight .

 

[n3tjm]

I think Doug is spot on with his comparison. They are both 6 grain motors, but the J354 outperforms the J350 by a good amount.

Please don't take this as a CTI vs AT argument.

Thanks Rocketman. I also do not want this thread to become a flame-war

 

[UPscaler]

Thanks Rocketman. I also do not want this thread to become a flame-war

I agree, both CTI and Aerotech make fine motors, it's just a matter or preference.


besides, aren't we all just flying rockets?

 

[Rocketjunkie]

I agree, both CTI and Aerotech make fine motors, it's just a matter or preference.

Or what hardware you have