Redshift- 38mm Minimum Diameter Rocket

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Alright, how about a little update. Redshift is now officially 100% finished. WooHoo!

I masked for the yellow fin tips with 3M scotch blue tape, then sprayed grey primer, and then 2 lightish coats of Rusto yellow. Turned out pretty well, but I should have used white primer. Yellow over grey over black doesn't cover all that well...

Tada! It's not a great picture, I'll see if I can get a better one soon.
View attachment 258487


Shock cord attachment point:View attachment 258488View attachment 258489

I mounted it by measuring where the ring would sit, smeared epoxy about 1/4" inside of that. Then I placed the ring in the tube, and used a carefully marked coupler to push it into position. (and then quickly pulled it out!). It worked very very well.

I did some sanding for the coupler fit, and this thing is done. I've decided on a 15" chute for the first flight, but I'm guessing I'll decide to step it up to 18" for subsequent flights, especially those to mid-range altitudes with heavier motor cases. I'll also be using a 4X40 streamer for the drogue, which I'll be getting soon. If need be I'll use a smaller one though. Test packing the chute, nomex, and a tracker stand-in was all very easy, and with all the newfound room in the NC, I've get room to spare in the payload section.



And, the all important weight......

..........19.5oz ready to go, parachute and all! Not bad, I think. That's only about 3-4oz heavier than my Shape Shifter mini without the recovery gear.
First flight will be on Sunday with the previously planned G339N. I will be using Bill Cook's "Mayhem Rocketry" Fly Away Rail Guides. I have very high hopes, and a full flight report will be here Sunday or Monday. OR is saying about 2300ft, but I don't think It'll be quite that high. It'll be off the rail in .09s, traveling at 85mph, and pulling 50Gs :grin: I'm very eager to fly this thing.

Two question; Has anyone had any issues flying the RRC2+ in rather high acceleration flights? Any tips to ensure my charges don't disassemble themselves prematurely?

Nate

Looks awesome ;) It should be a great launch, we haven't flown in what seems like forever! For the charges, I would maybe just use a bit of duct tape rather than masking tape to hold the BP and igniter in as it has no chance of unsticking under high acceleration. 19.5oz is pretty darn light, my BH38 weighs in at ~34oz!
 
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Alright, how about a little update. Redshift is now officially 100% finished. WooHoo!

I masked for the yellow fin tips with 3M scotch blue tape, then sprayed grey primer, and then 2 lightish coats of Rusto yellow. Turned out pretty well, but I should have used white primer. Yellow over grey over black doesn't cover all that well...

Tada! It's not a great picture, I'll see if I can get a better one soon.
View attachment 258487


Shock cord attachment point:View attachment 258488View attachment 258489

I mounted it by measuring where the ring would sit, smeared epoxy about 1/4" inside of that. Then I placed the ring in the tube, and used a carefully marked coupler to push it into position. (and then quickly pulled it out!). It worked very very well.

I did some sanding for the coupler fit, and this thing is done. I've decided on a 15" chute for the first flight, but I'm guessing I'll decide to step it up to 18" for subsequent flights, especially those to mid-range altitudes with heavier motor cases. I'll also be using a 4X40 streamer for the drogue, which I'll be getting soon. If need be I'll use a smaller one though. Test packing the chute, nomex, and a tracker stand-in was all very easy, and with all the newfound room in the NC, I've get room to spare in the payload section.



And, the all important weight......

..........19.5oz ready to go, parachute and all! Not bad, I think. That's only about 3-4oz heavier than my Shape Shifter mini without the recovery gear.
First flight will be on Sunday with the previously planned G339N. I will be using Bill Cook's "Mayhem Rocketry" Fly Away Rail Guides. I have very high hopes, and a full flight report will be here Sunday or Monday. OR is saying about 2300ft, but I don't think It'll be quite that high. It'll be off the rail in .09s, traveling at 85mph, and pulling 50Gs :grin: I'm very eager to fly this thing.

Two question; Has anyone had any issues flying the RRC2+ in rather high acceleration flights? Any tips to ensure my charges don't disassemble themselves prematurely?

Nate


Hmmmmm will a 38mm 1200 case fit in this?..... I think a J1000 is in order for ldrs :)
 
Looks awesome ;) It should be a great launch, we haven't flown in what seems like forever! For the charges, I would maybe just use a bit of duct tape rather than masking tape to hold the BP and igniter in as it has no chance of unsticking under high acceleration. 19.5oz is pretty darn light, my BH38 weighs in at ~34oz!
Thanks!
I'll try the duct tape- That's a very good idea. You BH38 may be heavier, but the good side of that is that you can fly bigger motors in it. Anything larger than a 240 motor puts it to well over 5k, and even an H123 goes to 4700 ft!


Hmmmmm will a 38mm 1200 case fit in this?..... I think a J1000 is in order for ldrs :)

Sadly not :( I mean it would, but it would stick out by 5.5"........ theoretically it's still stable......
I'm thinking a CTI pro38 6GXL. Still goes to 15k and M2 :)

Nate
 
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Thanks!
I'll try the duct tape- That's a very good idea. You BH38 may be heavier, but the good side of that is that you can fly bigger motors in it. Anything larger than a 240 motor puts it to well over 5k, and even an H123 goes to 4700 ft!




Sadly not :( I mean it would, but it would stick out by 5.5"........ theoretically it's still stable......
I'm thinking a CTI pro38 6GXL. Still goes to 15k and M2 :)

Nate

Since its so lightweight, I'm thinking the CTI 6GXL J150-Mellow would be perfect for this rocket... I'll have my L2 by LDRS, so I'd be more than willing to fly it for/with you :D
 
Since its so lightweight, I'm thinking the CTI 6GXL J150-Mellow would be perfect for this rocket... I'll have my L2 by LDRS, so I'd be more than willing to fly it for/with you :D


You know, I was thinking about that. It would be really cool to have the 6s burn, but it just doesn't get quite as much altitude or speed. About 1800 ft less than the J530 Imax, and just barely over mach 1.3. Still awesome, but I'm thinking it would be fun to really push the speed and altitude limits on this thing. I'll have to see how I'm feeling in May/June :) Oh, and about LDRS, I'm still figuring out all the details about who can fly what with who watching over their shoulder, etc. Thanks for the backing/offer! I joined tripoli last week, so that's one hurdle out of the way. Now to get TMP certified...

Nate
 
Sadly not I mean it would, but it would stick out by 5.5"........ theoretically it's still stable......
I'm thinking a CTI pro38 6GXL. Still goes to 15k and M2

Nate

You defiantly need to fly that at LDRS!! Ive got tons of trackers if you need one ;)
 
You defiantly need to fly that at LDRS!! Ive got tons of trackers if you need one ;)


I can see the look on the RSO's face right now...

"Son, you know the motor is supposed to be inside the rocket...... Right??"

Nate
 
I can see the look on the RSO's face right now...

"Son, you know the motor is supposed to be inside the rocket...... Right??"

Nate


haha i can't even imagine his face... But seriously the 6GXL case would be sweet and I've got all your tracking needs if you need them.
 
Well, after a quick ground test some of my fears are confirmed. The streamer in a nomex blanket is a tight fit through the SC attachment point, and it doesn't like to (won't) pull back through when the charge fires. This means I'll have to fly drogueless, or with a sacrificial mylar streamer. Not ideal, but it should work. I was using .6g and it was more than enough to separate the rocket, the streamer just won't come out. In fact when I went to disassemble it, I had to push it out the back of the rocket, even me pulling, something was going to rip before it came out. Oh well. I burnt my streamer too...

Nate
 
I think you'll be fine going drogue less. At only 19.5 oz it'll fall at well below the speed threshold to worry about any problems with the main parachute deployment being too hard, the only possible problem you may have is that the payload may fall below the fincan, though since your payload section is pretty light I don't think that'll really be a problem either.
 
I think you'll be fine going drogue less. At only 19.5 oz it'll fall at well below the speed threshold to worry about any problems with the main parachute deployment being too hard, the only possible problem you may have is that the payload may fall below the fincan, though since your payload section is pretty light I don't think that'll really be a problem either.

I'm with RH. I go drouge less with my BH38 and that weighs almost 2X Redshift.. I will be going drugless in aurora to from 20,000ft.
 
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I think you'll be fine going drogue less. At only 19.5 oz it'll fall at well below the speed threshold to worry about any problems with the main parachute deployment being too hard, the only possible problem you may have is that the payload may fall below the fincan, though since your payload section is pretty light I don't think that'll really be a problem either.

That's kind of what I figured. It kind of reminds me of the BH24, which tends to fall in a flat spin. It would've been nice to have a consistent drogue device, but I guess we'll find out how much of a problem it might be on Sunday. :)

Nate
 
You should go drug less Connor,,,
drugs are very bad for you...
Nate,,
Who is that package for,,
YOU are not the listed recipient of that package...
I would know ,,
because ---
I know your home address
and now,, so does the rest of the planet...........

Remove please................

(Before your father kills you)............

Teddy
 
You should go drug less Connor,,,
drugs are very bad for you...

Autocorrect strikes again..... Im going to have to go through and add all of the rocketry terms....
 
No you're not,,,
not at all,,,,
that's a fact,,,
Ya just got a little excited is all....lol...

Teddy
 
no, stupid is my friend who posted a picture of his driver's license on FB.

I know how to ---- lol,, lol,, lol..

And my buddy Troy taught me that -- hahahahahahahahahahah

is much easier then -- lol,, lol,, lol..

But how do you snicker in type.............

Dats a good one.....

Teddy
 
Well, I had an AWESOME flight with Redshift on Sunday with the Radrocketeers! The motor was a G339N in the 38/360 casing using two spacers + the floating forward closure. The Flyaway Rail Guides worked exactly as they should have, and granted Redshift a near perfect vertical flight, even while pulling 50 Gs off the rail. I highly recommend them! Unfortunately, I don't have a video... my dad's phone memory ran out at T-2 seconds... Anyway, the flight was just about straight up, accelerating at a blistering pace off the rail. There was a flash as the motor came up to pressure, and the next time I saw clearly was at about 1800 ft. Right on queue, at 2100 ft. the altimeter fired the drogue charge, and it tumbled down to 500 ft. where the main charge fired, as it recovered gently on the 18" chute. There was no damage, and although it wasn't particularly far away, all our little bridges over the drainage ditches had been pulled up, so it was a bit challenging getting to the rocket. But once I did I found everything perfectly intact, and barely a scratch on the paint. What a flight! holding the rocket before the flight, and then looking at the single fuel grain, it really really shocked me just how fast and how high the thing went! 60g of propellant pushed a 600g rocket to 50 Gs! Awesome stuff. The friction fit on the motor worked perfectly, as it was just a bit tricky to install, but didn't budge once it was in. I actually had to tap it out with a wooden dowel, but I'm willing to do that to make sure I don't lose my motor hardware out the back of a rocket.

I'm debating the next flight, which will be at our May launch, since I won't be able to make the April launch. It'll either be an H123W or an H242T. It would be a nice change to have a slightly longer burning motor that has a little smoke and fire with it (H123) but it would be a better test of the rail guides to fly faster with the H242T, and that extra speed and acceleration is always cool. If I get the chance, an H669 (or H999 if I fly with a higher waiver) is most certainly in this rocket's future. Either motor will put Redshift to well over 4500, and very close to 5000, so I'll be flying a tracker onboard. I'm waiting for my callsign to show up with the FCC, then I'll be placing an order for a BRB 70cm Beeline transmitter.

Here are some pics of the rocket on the rail:








Nate
 
Very impressive Nate, a flawless flight on your first try, great job! :clap: Wish I could have been there to see it! Personally I'd love to see the H123-W for the second flight, the G339 was probably a better test of the rail guides than the H242 will be, so I would just go for the motor with more smoke and effect!
 
Great job, Nate! Just keep having fun with this rocket, it's a beauty!
 
Nate,,
That was such a cool flight...
On the first shot too..
Good for you Nate...
Well done..

Teddy
 
Congrats! Sounds like it was a great flight! If you're looking for something to REALLY test the rail guides I'd suggest the AT H550. ~120 pounds of thrust for around .5 seconds. It took one of my 2.6" rockets to around 2500 ft. and pulled 35 G's. I'm sure it would no doubt bring some awesome off the rail velocity! :D
 
Alright, time for an update. I flew this rocket twice at RadRocks on Saturday. I didn't think I'd be able to, since my tracker and altimeter are hanging in a tree, but some awesomely fast shipping from Missileworks and Bigredbee got them to me just in the nick of time :)


So, early Saturday morning there was a really low ceiling at the field- right about 1500 ft. So, I figured, it would be a nice chance to pop some MPR flights up to play around with the tracker. Unfortunately, no such luck- two 1200 ft. flights landed right on our same field! Then, getting a bit frustrated, a stuck a G76 in a formula 38, for a nice 2600 ft. flight, now that the ceiling was a bit higher. As it turns out, one of the shroud lines ripped through, which meant even that landed no more than about 120 ft. away! The tracker helped a bit, as it did land in a little ditch, but I was a bit nervous going into a 4k+ with Redshift flight after minimal tracking experience.
Anywho, I packed the chute, and got the tracker loaded in. I had the H123W ready to go, friction fitted with a wrap of masking tape for a nice tight fit. It was originally simming to about 4700 ft, but after adjusting the file with data from the G339 flight, it was looking closer to about 4100. I got the rail guides ready to go, (which worked flawlessly on the G76 flight I might add) and loaded it up on the rail. When the motor lit, it was most certainly different from the G339 flight, with the motor burning almost 8 times longer! The rail guides guided it on a beautiful, vertical trajectory. The coast was for almost 15s, and it really did just keep going, and going, and going. We heard the apogee deployment, but didn't see anything, and then finally, at 500 ft. the main deployed and was visible. It landed a couple fields over, and I set out with the tracker. As it turns out, the parachute had snagged on top of a stalk, and the bright orange was visible from quite a ways away. The tracker helped, though, when it fell down with the wind. The RRC2+ beeped out a whopping 4901 ft! It just about kissed our 5000 ft. waiver! Feeling good, I re-prepped it with an H669N I'd picked up at METRA the previous weekend. I decided to stick with the sliding guides, as I had no reason to believe they couldn't handle it, and, once again, set off to the pads with the tracker. The rocket was simulating to 100 Gs off the pad, and it looked like it easily reached that. One second it was on the pad, there was a flash of light, and it was gone. There was a smoke trail at apogee, and we heard the apogee deployment, but that was the last we heard from it. I honestly didn't know if the main came out. We didn't hear or see it, and I didn't know the rocket was even down until I saw the tracking signal jump down. So, wondering in earnest where the thing went, Jim Z and I set off with the radio and yagi in hand. We trekked our way across the farm, zig zagging ever further, and in ever narrower directions. Between Teddy's awesome gear, and Jimmy's great knowledge of foxhunting skills, it really was an enjoyable experience tracking down the rocket, eventually zeroing in on it, sitting in a field of corn, with the main deployed, and the altimeter happily beeping out 4794. The rail guides could not have worked better, even under the immense stress of a motor like this. This was the highest thrust motor these guides took, and they really, really did perform flawlessly. There was minimal or no wear on the guides, and they sprung apart quickly, landing just a couple dozen feet from the pad.

It was a great day, with some great people, and I had a great time flying Redshift, and doing some more flights with the rail guides. Thanks Bill!!

Here's a video of the H123W liftoff, you can see the rail guides coming down to the right of the pad. Coleman (RocketHunter) has some GoPro video of the liftoff with the rail guides, which I'm sure we'll be seeing soon, so that should be really cool!
[video=youtube;36L7M1RQAuE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36L7M1RQAuE&feature=youtu.be[/video]

Nate
 
Those were some very awesome and impressive flights Nate! I hate to say it, but you're managing to get similar flight altitudes as my BH38, by using half the impulse :facepalm: If I still got 11K+ on a J570, I'd bet you could break 15K with one! LDRS? :wink:

I'll try to get the videos downloaded, edited and put on youtube. I'm still in the middle of AP testing (school, not propellant :lol:) so unfortunately I don't have much time or mental motivation to get it done, but I'll try to get it done by then end of the week.

I will tell you that on my iphone the slow-mo of Redshift on the H669 is still faster than all the other flights of that day played at regular speed :y:
 
awwwwwww mannnnnnnnnnn....
I missed the launch,,,,,
and there were some seriously cool flights.........
Dag nabit........
I was hoping you guy's had a wonderful day of it.........
Good for you man..........

Teddy
 
Really great flights, and thanks again for pushing the slide version of the guides with a high-thrust motor. I can't wait to see what you unleash the button version on! I'm looking forward to meeting you at LDRS and seeing this awesome rocket in person!
 
Really great flights, and thanks again for pushing the slide version of the guides with a high-thrust motor. I can't wait to see what you unleash the button version on! I'm looking forward to meeting you at LDRS and seeing this awesome rocket in person!

hahahahahahahah
Bill,,
I never noticed your signature before.........
Tanks,,, I needed a good laugh...........

Teddy
 
Looks great Nate! Looking forward to seeing it fly at LDRS.. Can you say J!! ;)
 
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