Lakeroadster's Cygnus Probe Ship

[Daddyisabar]

@Daddyisabar ... those outriggers would be great for hanging some rear streamers.....

Hanging stuff off the back of your rocket is TIGHT!

Bulletproofing your rocket ROCKS!

Dangling streamers off outriggers will stabilize it like a kite. Too much drag? Just put in a bigger motor!

No matter what the RSO might say, I think I am still a good influence.

 

[jqavins]

The outriggers were not nearly as durable as they needed to be. I looked at some of the movie stills from The Black Hole movie. The ship had diagonal braces, it looks like cables. So I decided to add some 1/8" dia. braces.

For a change, I didn't want to be a nudge, but I did think that unsupported, long, skinny sticky-out things looked like breakage waiting to happen. Much better now.

Dangling streamers off outriggers will stabilize it like a kite. Too much drag? Just put in a bigger motor!

And shred the streamers?

 

[Daddyisabar]

For a change, I didn't want to be a nudge, but I did think that unsupported, long, skinny sticky-out things looked like breakage waiting to happen. Much better now.

And shred the streamers?

Easily replaced and little bits of streamer ripping off your rocket in flight is TIGHT! Bulletproof with nomex or kelvar cloth streamers, that would be soooo cool! See how much you could fray the end of the cloth using massive thrust. Not quite as cool as burning the paint off your rocket with high speed atmospheric friction, but the best you can do with a streamer laiden oddroc.

 

[jqavins]

There's something wrong with you.

 

[lakeroadster]

There's something wrong with you.

He's The Godfather of the "Oddroc Scum" Clan... mere mortals have difficulties interpreting his depth of wisdom.
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As to shredding streamers... MSM: Material Selection Matters. If the streamers are rip stop nylon, I'd really be surprised if they shred..

 

[Daddyisabar]

He's The Godfather of the "Oddroc Scum" Clan... mere mortals have difficulties interpreting his depth of wisdom.
<------

As to shredding streamers... MSM: Material Selection Matters. If the streamers are rip stop nylon, I'd really be surprised if they shred..

Our atmosphere is a cruel mistress. Like a flag after a hurricane.

Rocket motor exhaust cuts like a torch, a hot knife through butter.

Cheap orange caution tape has little chance. After flying the squid rocket I picked up all the easily seen orange bits, got out the Scotch tape and matched up all the shreds. Those squids just regrow the tentacles, ready to fly again in no time.

The last cardstock paper segment on the end of the tape worm rocket's tail shredded on the power of just three E9 kiddie motors. Never underestimate the power of flutter!

 

[Daddyisabar]

Yes, hanging streamers on outriggers might chastise the tender sensitivities of the 3-4FNC hi po boys, but from what I've seen they sure like to watch!

 

[dhbarr]

Yes, hanging streamers on outriggers might chastise the tender sensitivities of the 3-4FNC hi po boys, but from what I've seen they sure like to watch!

Man, a high-power flutter would sound amaaaaaaazing.

 

[Daddyisabar]

Man, a high-power flutter would sound amaaaaaaazing.

Only if you could hear it over the roar of the motor. The high power shreds back in the day from the Cesseroni N5400 "three seconds of hell challenge" were the best! Composite delamination and airframe collapse was the height of entertainment. Yes Gladiator, we are entertained! Seeing this Cygnus Probe fly will be entertaining as well.

 

[dhbarr]

Only if you could hear it over the roar of the motor. The high power shreds back in the day from the Cesseroni N5400 "three seconds of hell challenge" were the best! Composite delamination and airframe collapse was the height of entertainment. Yes Gladiator, we are entertained! Seeing this Cygnus Probe fly will be entertaining as well.

I was imagining like an i1299 for instant-off with 1in kevlar tape along the trailing edges. THE BOOMFLAP

 

[lakeroadster]

I finally bought a Jr. Slinky.. once I can break this ship out of paint jail it'll be time to kick the tires and light the fires.

 

[mikeyd]

I wonder if one of the plastic slinkys would be lighter, and easier to attach and paint. Looks Great, a well thought out project!
Amazon.com: The Original Slinky Brand Plastic Slinky Jr Kids Spring Toy : Toys & Games

 

[jqavins]

It might be harder to attach. Epoxy will do the trick for a metal one, but I, for one, have no idea what the plastic ones are made of and what will bond them.

As for paint, what kind of paint will flex enough to stay on a slinky, whether metal or plastic? Latex paint? I would bet that the lacquers and enamels we mostly use would flake right off. Am I wong? I've been wrong before.

 

[lakeroadster]

I wonder if one of the plastic slinkys would be lighter, and easier to attach and paint. Looks Great, a well thought out project!
Amazon.com: The Original Slinky Brand Plastic Slinky Jr Kids Spring Toy : Toys & Games

I considered that.. but the coils are much thicker.. to bulky for this rocket IMO.

It might be harder to attach. Epoxy will do the trick for a metal one, but I, for one, have no idea what the plastic ones are made of and what will bond them.

As for paint, what kind of paint will flex enough to stay on a slinky, whether metal or plastic? Latex paint? I would bet that the lacquers and enamels we mostly use would flake right off. Am I wong? I've been wrong before.

I attached the slinky to the wooden rings, using wood glue. Basically a full glue fillet such that the first coil is encapsulated at the top and bottom.

If the paint flakes off.. no worries. The slinky doesn't move much, and a little wear and tear on a space probe is to be expected.

 

[lakeroadster]

Blue sky day here and temps. warm enough to apply some spar urethane...

The original plan was to paint the entire rocket gold... but I'm really diggin' the wooden look. I can always paint over the urethane later if I don't like the look of the finished product.

The plan is to paint the cardboard transitions a copper color?

 

[lakeroadster]

Updated Drawing Set

 

[lakeroadster]

Nose Ballast

Machined the ballast parts and glued them into the nose cone.

I just need to install the kevlar shock cord and then this bird is ready for launch.

 

[lakeroadster]

Launch Report

We launched the Cygnus Probe Ship today on a 29mm F52-5C single use composite motor. These motors have almost no smoke, so tracking it is a bit tough.

Flight was stable off the pad up to about 200 feet, then went unstable but maintained altitude.

When the ejection charge fired it severed the Kevlar shock chord just outside the body tube. The nose cone came down with the chute, and the rocket tumble recovered to ground hit, 193 ft south of the launch pad.

The nose cone and the fuselage were recovered.

One of the outriggers on the fuselage was broken clean off the fuselage and could not be located. The motor clip and motor were missing. I'll be able to add another outrigger, no worries.

I was able to get a launch video, but after ejection turned off the video to ensure I could locate the fuselage. It's the perfect color... to get lost in the weeds.

What I learned:

1. When using composite motors, you need a much stronger Motor Clip Arrangement than is used in LPR.
2. I should have used an elastic shock chord.

 

[Daddyisabar]

It ripped off the pad! The school of hard knocks quickly teaches lessons of the power of composite motors. Very cool.

A little tape job will go a long way on holding the motor clip to the motor.

 

[lakeroadster]

A little tape job will go a long way on holding the motor clip to the motor.

On this one it ripped the clip all the way out of the rocket... another offering to the Gods Of Recovery

 

[Daddyisabar]

On this one it ripped the clip all the way out of the rocket... another offering to the Gods Of Recovery

Wow, ripped the clip and broke the kevlar! Sounds like a tight pack or wadding plug or heavy nose cone in a speedy rocket caused some serious back pressure. Reinforced clip installation or Kaplow clips or fancy areopac aluminum screw on motor retention could be in the future.

 

[lakeroadster]

Wow, ripped the clip and broke the kevlar! Sounds like a tight pack or wadding plug or heavy nose cone in a speedy rocket caused some serious back pressure. Reinforced clip installation or Kaplow clips or fancy areopac aluminum screw on motor retention could be in the future.

The chute popped out and came down with the nose cone... which yes, is heavy, about 2.5 ounces.

My future designs will for sure use something stouter for composite motors.

 

[Daddyisabar]

The chute popped out and came down with the nose cone... which yes, is heavy, about 2.5 ounces.

My future designs will for sure use something stouter for composite motors.

He will be back, better, faster, stronger.

 

[lakeroadster]

He will be back, better, faster, stronger.

Biggest issue was I had the nose cone attached to the Kevlar to close to the fuselage and didn't have an elastic shock chord.

Once I added enough ballast to the nose cone, there just simply isn't enough room in the rocket for more recovery bits and pieces. Pretty sure this rocket will be a shelf queen from here on out.

I need to pack the appropriate size chute into a body tube, during the design phase of my oddroc's. Then adjust the design accordingly.

It's a journey... not a destination, right?

 

[Daddyisabar]

Yes, or after the launch it could be a destination of the brew pub listening to Journey. Don't stop believing!

 

[lakeroadster]

I finished up building the new mast. "It's like it never even happened"

Now I'm trying to determine the best way to secure the composite motor since the motor hook was yanked out by the previous motor.

 

[jqavins]

Suggestion for your consideration: glue an annular nut plate into the channel on the bottom. Make a second ring plate that can be screwed to said nut plate and has a smaller ID, sized to holt the motor.

 

[Daddyisabar]

Home made Kaplow clips, or fancy aluminum machine treaded motor retention, or lots of masking tape. Depends on how awesomely cool or Po Boy you want to look walking out to the pad.

 

[lakeroadster]

Suggestion for your consideration: glue an annular nut plate into the channel on the bottom. Make a second ring plate that can be screwed to said nut plate and has a smaller ID, sized to holt the motor.
View attachment 527877

Thanks Joe. There's just not enough room to pull that off and end up with a good robust result. I've also got the Kevlar harness conduit to loop the Kevlar around the body tube in that area.

I'm still thinking this over. One option is to use a couple 4-40 threaded rods that I already have. These are used as pushrods for RC planes. I could drill (2) 1/8" holes in the bottom plate and (2) more through the barrel upper head. Insert the rods from the top and then use a removable ring that the rods slide through, with nuts to secure them.

The beauty of this is it secures the motor via the thick pine upper barrel section.

 

[Daddyisabar]

Friction fitting with tape is an Old School Art, not a science. An oddroc with all the motors friction fit, flying off a 1/2 rod with a balsa cone finished with dope, brings tears to the Old Fart's eyes.