Is LPR in decline?

[RobertH3]

It is modeling in general I think more than LPR / rocketry.
If you go to a hobby shop now it's mostly older people.
As a kid in summer I was in the hobby shop every week looking at the candy.
When we fly at the Academy at Muncie, there are almost zero kids in the RC aircraft groups.
We have more kids (usually grandkids) than the RC crowd does. That is probably cost.
Also, you can fly a drone in your backyard.

The only "high-res" modeling I see an increasing trend in is Lego. They are making $$$ on Star Wars.
No paint or glue required, it is complicated enough to be entertaining just following the directions.
Basically a 3d puzzle. No crooked fins.

The only high-res painting I see an increasing trend in is painting miniatures for gaming.
This appears to have caught on with Millenials and Z's.
They appear to be looking for group activities, which may save them from the PC.
We can hope that this will bleed into other build and paint hobbies.

Cheers / Robert

 

[b.wieting]

I think, here in SoCal, the barrier is complete lack of fields close to home. Forbidden by Fire Departments. Yes, wildfires are a major threat so caution is completely understandable. Yet I think launches could be safe and successful--maybe limited to A or B motors--at school athletic fields. It's a hard sell.

A couple years ago my scouts seemed to really enjoy building kits, even if flying them took a small expedition, a troop weekend "rocketry campout" at FAR.

 

[Bluegrass Rocket]

I think it was Bill Stine that said Estes was making 3 to 4 million engines a year, down from a peak of 14 million.

 

[Paul Howard]

Few people are willing to use these words, but I will, Human Overpopulation. It's killing rocketry especially LPR, anything in the air like Free Flight, RC Powered and RC Glider aircraft, wildlife and the habitat wildlife depend on. Everything mentioned is figuratively losing ground due to literally losing ground to human development sprawl.

Also, a lot of parents don't have time (and often don't have money) to spend with their kids on it. I was lucky growing up in that we had 10 acres outside city limits in Wyoming.

Also, where I now live in Corvallis, Oregon is like a lot of places in that it LOVES ordinances and caters to complainers who don't like all sorts of things.

That's my 2 Centavos - Paul

 

[ljwilley]

Wow, this thread is old! Well, low power is still not gone, I still like to fly low power rockets, so if they were worried about it 20 years ago, and it's still here, I'm not worried about it going away any time soon.

 

[SolarYellow]

I think, here in SoCal, the barrier is complete lack of fields close to home. Forbidden by Fire Departments. Yes, wildfires are a major threat so caution is completely understandable. Yet I think launches could be safe and successful--maybe limited to A or B motors--at school athletic fields. It's a hard sell.

A couple years ago my scouts seemed to really enjoy building kits, even if flying them took a small expedition, a troop weekend "rocketry campout" at FAR.

Ironically, SoCal also has dry lakes. Last year, when I was out there a week a month, I was about a half hour from Lucerne. Not all our launches out there were with ROC and, yes, I did jump through the proper hoops.

Here in Freedomland, it's a heck of a lot harder to get to a place and time where we can launch.

 

[lr64]

Before the original message written, the trees around the field where I fly model airplanes were festooned with rockets. Ever since then, those trees have also been festooned with rockets. I would prefer it if they were all in the traditional mode, cardboard and balsa, so as to improve the soil when they fall to the ground and decompose.

 

[b.wieting]

Ironically, SoCal also has dry lakes. Last year, when I was out there a week a month, I was about a half hour from Lucerne. Not all our launches out there were with ROC and, yes, I did jump through the proper hoops.

Here in Freedomland, it's a heck of a lot harder to get to a place and time where we can launch.

Quite true, lots of federal (BLM) land so it's easy to avoid private property. Yet for me in Ventura County, it's still a 2+ hour drive.

 

[cwbullet]

Difficult to answer. He had a decline in all rocketry in the dark years prior to Judge Walton's decision. We had another decline during COVID-19. Today, we might be increasing, but there is an impact on our economy.

 

[rcktnut]

Around here we are permitted to fly on any school ground or park as long as NAR/NFPA 1122 codes are followed. That being said, I live adjacent to a high school field. Did many launches with my sons and neighbor kids years ago. There used to be other dads/ moms with the kids launching also. The last time I saw someone launching in the field was 2 years ago, and that was the first I seen in about 4 years. I think the kids just don't care about rocketry like they used to. Too many video games to play.
We have a variety store about 4 miles from here that carries every Estes and Quest kits ever made, motors, everything needed for the hobby, so no excuses as for availability.

 

[Pabsst]

Few people are willing to use these words, but I will, Human Overpopulation. It's killing rocketry especially LPR, anything in the air like Free Flight, RC Powered and RC Glider aircraft, wildlife and the habitat wildlife depend on. Everything mentioned is figuratively losing ground due to literally losing ground to human development sprawl.

Also, a lot of parents don't have time (and often don't have money) to spend with their kids on it. I was lucky growing up in that we had 10 acres outside city limits in Wyoming.

Also, where I now live in Corvallis, Oregon is like a lot of places in that it LOVES ordinances and caters to complainers who don't like all sorts of things.

That's my 2 Centavos - Paul

OSU looks like they have a club. Where do they launch? Philomath must be fairly unregulated.

 

[icyclops]

Few people are willing to use these words, but I will, Human Overpopulation. It's killing rocketry especially LPR, anything in the air like Free Flight, RC Powered and RC Glider aircraft, wildlife and the habitat wildlife depend on. Everything mentioned is figuratively losing ground due to literally losing ground to human development sprawl.

Also, a lot of parents don't have time (and often don't have money) to spend with their kids on it. I was lucky growing up in that we had 10 acres outside city limits in Wyoming.

Also, where I now live in Corvallis, Oregon is like a lot of places in that it LOVES ordinances and caters to complainers who don't like all sorts of things.

That's my 2 Centavos - Paul

If you think Oregon (Corvallis) is bad with ordinances and public bureaucracy , just try living in the Bay Area in California. LPR is dying because no one can find an approved launch field. Clubs have lost their launch fields and are having a hard time finding good replacements. You either have to travel hours to get to one (if any) or the height restrictions make it very limiting on what you can do…yes LPR has been slowly dying (popularity) in CA for years and continues. I think the sport of Drone flying has also contributed to its demise. Much easier to get your flying thrills with RC and Drones, and it seems fields are opening up for that but still not rocketry.

 

[jqavins]

Every few months, a new thread (or one raised from the dead) comes along about how our hobby is dying. And yet, every month's NAR electronic newsletter reports an increase in membership.

"More Power" is an issue, and always has been, as kids of all ages look at the Estes catalog seeking the bigger rockets that fly on C engines rather than being limited to As and Bs, then find that there are D motors in there (WOW!)

I keep hearing about HPR flyers looking down on LPR flyers, so I guess it must be a thing somewhere, but I've flown with at least four clubs and I haven't seen it; my current club has eight to twelve LPR pads set up, and six to eight HPR pads for typical launch days.

If there are fewer competitions, that's a change in what people are interested in doing, but I think it's only a "decline" when the days with more competitions are viewed nostalgically. The "kids today" not being interested because they don't know what their missing is one theory, but clubs would not have stopped running them if the kids of yesteryear had remained interested. Things change.

I've seen Scout groups, school groups, a college group*, and a summer camp group show up at our launches, as well as kids and their parents without groups, and be wholeheartedly welcomed and supported by us regulars. We have members' kids flying LPR. We have a "Fly it take it" box, and it get's a decent number of takers now and then.**

The diminishing number of places to fly is an issue. It's a major inconvenience, and an impediment to some. And yet membership grows.

* OK, the college kids were all their to get their L1 certs. There were about a dozen of them, every one succeeded, and all but one or two on their first tries.

** We went to some extra effort to advertise one particular launch day, and waived the membership requirement for visitors. (Kids always fly free anyway.) One little girl (about seven or eight, I would guess) was given a ½A motor for her very small rocket (from our fly it take it box) on a windy day. (I tried to tell the more experienced flyer from our club that a ¼A would be better.) It was lost in a harvested corn field. She, her mom, the other flyer, and I spent a good 20 minutes searching for it. About 15 minutes into the search, I asked her "If we don't find it, did you have a good time anyway?" Her face positively lit up as she said "Yes!", and I got another "Yes" when I asked if she'd like to come back another day. Her mother thanked me for asking, and seemed supportive of another visit. We ended up giving her another little rocket from the box.

 

[Paul Howard]

OSU looks like they have a club. Where do they launch? Philomath must be fairly unregulated.

OSU rocketry seems to go in and out. There is a small field on campus near the Foresty Dept that is suitable for lower flying rockets - people do all sorts of flying things in that field and I and noone I've seen has been told to leave as long as they're not being stupid. I've launched there a few times, there's a better "permission" field at Crescent Valley High School on weekends (but right now it's a muddy wet bog), again, it's not huge so you have to be somewhat strategic with the wind and your altitude and the group that invited me to fly there has a requested altitude limit that I don't know what that is, but I doubt anything I have will top it. The best (most open space and safe as long as you're not stupid) Non-Permission place is the HUGE collection of soccer fields at a city park that used to be open for rocketry and RC planes but that has ended due to the "complainer appeasement culture" of Corvallis - yet, plenty of dog-related injuries happen there all year, I know, I'm an X-Ray Tech who has done exams on many a dog-bite and dog-related fall injury and many of those come from that park of soccer fields, but the city doesn't do anything or care about those real injuries (and I'm NOT pushing for banning dogs by the way).

Without saying too much, I'm 61 and still skateboarding since 1974. Skateboarding in the 70's, 80's, 90's and early 2000's was always a bust everywhere, but rocketry and RC were viewed as OK and I was never told to leave doing those activities. So, did all of us skateboarders quit skateboarding because of ordinances and whatnot? Absolutely not, we just figured how to go unnoticed and go do it anyway - it's inherently part of skateboarding still in many places from continuation of that culture, but at my age, and in the present time and place I can pretty much go skateboarding and no one cares. Rocketry and RC Gliders for me have become "the new skateboarding" in some respects - they've traded places.

 

[Paul Howard]

OSU looks like they have a club. Where do they launch? Philomath must be fairly unregulated.

I'm still looking into flying at the Philomath High School fields, I think it's OK if it's a weekend/federal-holiday and not being used otherwise, I've heard of people using it and the school used to have a science class where rockets were built and flown but I think that's in the past. Once I have time, I would like to get involved with possibly getting rocketry going there if it's not already.

 

[Paul Howard]

If you think Oregon (Corvallis) is bad with ordinances and public bureaucracy , just try living in the Bay Area in California. LPR is dying because no one can find an approved launch field. Clubs have lost their launch fields and are having a hard time finding good replacements. You either have to travel hours to get to one (if any) or the height restrictions make it very limiting on what you can do…yes LPR has been slowly dying (popularity) in CA for years and continues. I think the sport of Drone flying has also contributed to its demise. Much easier to get your flying thrills with RC and Drones, and it seems fields are opening up for that but still not rocketry.

Yes, I agree 100% about "drones" of the rotary wing tri, quad, hex etc 'copter type, especially with First Person View. That has annoyed and spooked the non-flying public to the point of complaining to legislators who then report to the FAA who has come down on all of us. Also, the whole aspect of "buy it and fly it" with no building is another problem of making it too easy to be stupid with them If you have the money to go buy more.