Ignitor Clip Alternative

[sr205347d]

Has anyone tried a Wago type inline connector? I got a box of 50 on Amazon for $19, or $0.40 each. No soldering, no crimping. Just flip the lever up to release and down to clamp. It says these are good for 28-12 AWG. The contacts should be protected somewhat from the corrosive exhaust.



Estes ignitor shown. Would work on any other ignitor, I would imagine.

 

[Rob Campbell]

They should work just fine. At that price in bulk, these may be an attractive alternative for clubs with a large number of pads.

 

[sr205347d]

Has anyone tried a Wago type inline connector? I got a box of 50 on Amazon for $19, or $0.40 each. No soldering, no crimping. Just flip the lever up to release and down to clamp. It says these are good for 28-12 AWG. The contacts should be protected somewhat from the corrosive exhaust.

View attachment 572609

Estes ignitor shown. Would work on any other ignitor, I would imagin

To keep these from getting separated from your launch system, just wrap some electrical tape over the lever on that side.

 

[sr205347d]

Should be easier for young hands and old eyes.

 

[RokitFlyr]

I'd be concerned about the weight pulling the igniter out.....

 

[sr205347d]

I'd be concerned about the weight pulling the igniter out.....

Won't fall out. Won't short out.

 

[RokitFlyr]

Well.....Alrighty then! Looks good!

 

[sr205347d]

With the paper left on the igniter, the leads are barely long enough. I would remove the paper after putting the plug in the nozzle and just before attaching the clips.

I left the paper on for the photos to show that it can be done that way.

 

[bibbster]

Interesting! I'd be curious to see photos after several launches to see how they hold up to exhaust...low, mid and high power.

Crusty clips are a pain!

 

[kuririn]

At 40 cents each if the contacts get dirty I would just unclamp the old one and clamp on a new one.

 

[BEC]

Interesting idea. Interesting indeed.

I had a bluetooth launch controller once that used small test clips for the igniter leads. That didn't work out so well after a few flights.

 

[cwbullet]

Please post in a few months about the longevity,

 

[Voyager1]

Being plastic I imagine that they would be easily damaged by the exhaust blast, particularly when using the low power igniters with very short leads. With mid and high power igniters, you have much longer leads, so not really an issue. They are much bulkier than standard clips too.

 

[RocketRev]

To the original question, apparently nobody has used them before. Or at least nobody has admited to it so far.

Therefore I'm with the "let's wait, test, and see" folks. It might depend on what kind of plastic they are made from that will determine if/how quickly they melt and/or get corroded.

Has anybody taken one appart to see what kind of spring mechanism is beign used to hold onto the wire of the igniter?

There are lots of things that you might use instead of an igniter clip, but that does not mean that they will either do a better job or last longer.

And of course I also have to ask if they are designed for stranded wire or for solid wire guages or both? Some wire connectors are designed for one or the other and NOT for both. This one I don't know about. Anybody know what the spec sheet actually says?

So, do the long term testing and then get back to us.

Being one of those people who has replaced literally hundreds of igniter clips over the decades, I would love to find a better alternative. I just haven't seen one yet. Frankly, with a plastic housing, I have my doubts. Just look at the the back end of any rocket with a plastic motor retainer. This WAGO inline connector looks to be sitting directly in the path of every Estes motor exhaust.

I will admit that I like the one pick with the WAGO hanging from the igniter in an Estes motor with an Anderson Power Pole PP15 on the other end. These are great. One of the best investments that I've made with Wilson F/X was getting into using APP connectors was getting the tooling and bulk parts. The APP pp15/30/45 housing is the most versitile housing of its type I've ever seen or used. Fits with connectors that will fit wire form AWG #10 down to #18 easily.

And I've attached a pic of what can happed at the pads from burning propellant. Of course I was told that this was from a large chunk of burning propellant that was no longer in the motor, but they said that it was very exciting! LOL!

Brad

 

[cwbullet]

To the original question, apparently nobody has used them before. Or at least nobody has admited to it so far.

Therefore I'm with the "let's wait, test, and see" folks. It might depend on what kind of plastic they are made from that will determine if/how quickly they melt and/or get corroded.

Has anybody taken one appart to see what kind of spring mechanism is beign used to hold onto the wire of the igniter?

There are lots of things that you might use instead of an igniter clip, but that does not mean that they will either do a better job or last longer.

And of course I also have to ask if they are designed for stranded wire or for solid wire guages or both? Some wire connectors are designed for one or the other and NOT for both. This one I don't know about. Anybody know what the spec sheet actually says?

So, do the long term testing and then get back to us.

Being one of those people who has replaced literally hundreds of igniter clips over the decades, I would love to find a better alternative. I just haven't seen one yet. Frankly, with a plastic housing, I have my doubts. Just look at the the back end of any rocket with a plastic motor retainer. This WAGO inline connector looks to be sitting directly in the path of every Estes motor exhaust.

I will admit that I like the one pick with the WAGO hanging from the igniter in an Estes motor with an Anderson Power Pole PP15 on the other end. These are great. One of the best investments that I've made with Wilson F/X was getting into using APP connectors was getting the tooling and bulk parts. The APP pp15/30/45 housing is the most versitile housing of its type I've ever seen or used. Fits with connectors that will fit wire form AWG #10 down to #18 easily.

And I've attached a pic of what can happed at the pads from burning propellant. Of course I was told that this was from a large chunk of burning propellant that was no longer in the motor, but they said that it was very exciting! LOL!

Brad

I used one in the garage for another project and will detruct it and post photos in the next 24 hours if someone else does not do it.

 

[sr205347d]

And of course I also have to ask if they are designed for stranded wire or for solid wire guages or both?

Both.

 

[cwbullet]

Both.

Yes. They tighten to create a forceful connection on multiple sides.

Thanks for sharing this idea. I want to try it.

 

[Tractionengines]

We use these all the time at work.... just never crossed my mind to use it for rocket starters. I am thinking that the will need to be replaced on a simi-regular basis if used on Estes starters... but they are inexpensive and easy to swap. Used on composite motor starter or MjG Firewire BP starters, they should last a while...

I know I have data sheets and cross-section images at work. Will post here when I have a minute to find them.

Edit: I know OP said "Wago type inline connector"... but for the record those are NOT Wago made items.

 

[sr205347d]

but for the record those are NOT Wago made items.

Right, the brand name is on the box in the picture, Gkeemars. On Amazon, there is also Glutoad, which look like the Gkeemars.

The heat/fire resistance could vary from brand to brand. Also the minimum wire size, and rated current. The Wago says 20-12 AWG, so may not grab a small ignitor wire.

To test for heat/fire resistance, I held one in a candle flame for a full 10 seconds:



So, maybe not so good for use with Estes ignitors, but anything with longer wires should be OK.

 

[bibbster]

Maybe wrap it with a bit of aluminum foil?

 

[sr205347d]

Maybe wrap it with a bit of aluminum foil?

Might be easier to extend your ignitor leads. I have lots of leftover wire from a garage door opener installation.

 

[lakeroadster]

Right, the brand name is on the box in the picture, Gkeemars. On Amazon, there is also Glutoad, which look like the Gkeemars.

The heat/fire resistance could vary from brand to brand. Also the minimum wire size, and rated current. The Wago says 20-12 AWG, so may not grab a small ignitor wire.

To test for heat/fire resistance, I held one in a candle flame for a full 10 seconds:

View attachment 572811View attachment 572812

So, maybe not so good for use with Estes ignitors, but anything with longer wires should be OK.

That's surprising that an electrical device is that flammable.

 

[sr205347d]

Has anybody taken one appart to see what kind of spring mechanism is beign used to hold onto the wire of the igniter?

See this:

 

[sr205347d]

That's surprising that an electrical device is that flammable.

It melted, but did not continue to burn when removed from the flame. That connector is still functional.

 

[sr205347d]

I looked further on Amazon. There are several more brands. Here is one that says it is flame resistant. A bit more expensive, though. Maybe the polycarbonate housing is better than the nylon.

 

[sr205347d]

The polycarbonate has somewhat less melting after 10 seconds in the candle flame than the nylon one does. Both remain functional. With the clear polycarbonate, you can see the spring contacts.

So, the PC may be the better choice if using short Estes ignitors.

 

[cwbullet]

We use these all the time at work.... just never crossed my mind to use it for rocket starters. I am thinking that the will need to be replaced on a simi-regular basis if used on Estes starters... but they are inexpensive and easy to swap. Used on composite motor starter or MjG Firewire BP starters, they should last a while...

I know I have data sheets and cross-section images at work. Will post here when I have a minute to find them.

You are probably right. I used to use copper or stainless alligator clips. I found that people step on them or wrap wires around them, and they break as quickly as the Non-stainless rust. I get an average of 3-6 months out of standard Chinese alligator clips and replace them at the same rate as stainless. I will try these and see if they last longer Or are similar.

I received some today. They seem pretty solid.

 

[Handeman]

You are probably right. I used to use copper or stainless alligator clips. I found that people step on them or wrap wires around them, and they break as quickly as the Non-stainless rust. I get an average of 3-6 months out of standard Chinese alligator clips and replace them at the same rate as stainless. I will try these and see if they last longer Or are similar.

I received some today. They seem pretty solid.

Besides how well they last vs. traditional clips, I would be very interested in how well the general users adapt to them. How much additional time and effort is required for pad management to get everyone trained up on how to use of the new clips. Also how much additional training is needed for new people at every launch.

 

[Tractionengines]

Also how much additional training is needed for new people at every launch.

Only note I will say. The springs are fairly strong. Watch "snapping" them shut. They can "bite". But this is a lesson very quickly learned... sitting fidgeting with it for a few minutes you'll learn.

 

[Handeman]

Only note I will say. The springs are fairly strong. Watch "snapping" them shut. They can "bite". But this is a lesson very quickly learned... sitting fidgeting with it for a few minutes you'll learn.

You would think so, but I've learned early on, the common denominator is pretty low. There will be quite a few will need to "show me".