Getting permission to use a field

[Skier Dude]

Hi. I'm a new member to the forum. If this isn't the ideal location for this post, please let me know.

In the past I simply walked onto a field and launched a rocket. These launch sessions were usually short (2-3 launches); in fact, they were sometimes during a lunch break (I used to call them "lunch launch").

Anyway, I want to be more planful this time around. Below is an example letter I want to send to the owner of fields that are used to grow corn for cattle feed.

Thoughts?

To whom this may concern:

I don’t know if you are the same owner of the fields at --- XYZ Roads--- as in 2008. Back then, I had used the fields to launch hobby model rockets with my son. In fact, you (if you are the same owner) came by and watched a few launches with my son and nephew and said it was ok as long as the field wasn’t being used.

I am writing because I’m interested in starting this hobby again and want to know if it would be okay to be on your fields when they aren’t in use. I assure you that I will follow the practice of “leave only footprints”. I’m in my 50s, am safe and responsible, and would be appreciative of this opportunity. Model rocketry is a hobby that is known internationally and has a “safety code”, which I assure you I will follow.

To be clear, I am not referring to large model rockets that go several thousand feet in the air and require a team of people to manage. My models would be smaller than those, but will (hopefully) be bigger and fly higher than the ones seen in elementary school projects. I’m generally a private person and wouldn’t have more than a few people with me (my son, or a couple friends).

There are model rocket clubs around; however, they are far away, and meet monthly or less (depending on the pandemic and weather). Using your fields would be more convenient and allow me some spontaneity when the weather is ideal.

If you are curious to what I am referring, a Google search for “low power model rockets” will help. Alternatively, you can come watch a launch.

The best ways to reach me are:

Email:

Cell:

I appreciate your time and consideration.

Sincerely,

 

[Bat-mite]

Not bad. An NAR membership and proof of insurance goes a long way. Including a copy of the Safety Code is also a good idea.

You might want to add in an invitation to the landowner and his/her family to come out and watch or join in when you are there.

 

[Skier Dude]

I had thought the NAR insurance was only for club/group launches and not individual launches. I'll review the info again. Thanks

 

[David Schwantz]

Get rid of the "to whom it may concern". There are many aps out there that will tell you the owner of the land and show property lines. I think it will much more forth coming if you address the owner by name instead of "Hey you".
Also from your statement, it sounds as if you were trespassing the first time. I would also remove that from the letter. Don't trespass.
Good luck.

 

[tsmith1315]

I had thought the NAR insurance was only for club/group launches and not individual launches. I'll review the info again. Thanks

Follow all rules and you're covered as an individual. See #17:

https://www.nar.org/safety-information/insurance-questions/

 

[Skier Dude]

Follow all rules and you're covered as an individual. See #17:

https://www.nar.org/safety-information/insurance-questions/

Perfect, thanks!

 

[MidOH]

Don't trespass.

And check for local clubs. They'll have the best fields. And you won't need to spend big money on a railed launch pad.

 

[Back_at_it]

If there is a field you have had your eye on, I recommend that you try to find a number for the homeowner or place your letter in the mailbox of the house. I don't recommend walking up to the house anymore. Many years ago we use to just go up and knock on a door. That'll get you killed today.

I have done this maybe 7 or 8 times and only twice did the land owner say no. I had a real nice place about 30 mins from my house that was perfect for anything up to about 2000-2500 ft. The owners had kids that they would bring out and watch us fly. It worked out great for years. I got out of the hobby for a while then tried to go back up there a few years later and the house had a for sale sign. There was no one around to talk to so I never went back.

Most times there will be restrictions on when you can use some land. If it's some type of farm they won't want you out there during growing season.

 

[afadeev]

In the past I simply walked onto a field and launched a rocket. These launch sessions were usually short (2-3 launches); in fact, they were sometimes during a lunch break (I used to call them "lunch launch").

I'm not sure where you are, but the above approach still works on public or town-owned properties in many parts of the US.
For example, I regularly launch (on my own, or with Scouts) from local high school soccer/baseball fields and parks. None require any permits or approvals.

There are model rocket clubs around; however, they are far away, and meet monthly or less (depending on the pandemic and weather). Using your fields would be more convenient and allow me some spontaneity when the weather is ideal.

Local rocket clubs may not be close to you, but take a closer look at where they launch. Their launch sites may be closer that you think, and even better, they may be on public land.
In which case, that should be a lead for you as to where you could go and launch on your own.

Alternatively, the private property pitch is in order. The more personalized, the better.

Good luck,
a

 

[Buckeye]

www.acrevalue.com is one site to get the land boundaries and names of the owners.

Bear in mind the lonely house on the road next to the open field is often not the home of the farmer nor landowner. It was carved out as a little homestead for a relative or renter. The landowner may live far away and leases the land to a farmer who also lives somewhere else.

If you have a middleman who can make the introduction for you, that helps. The local barber, feed store owner, or a distant cousin can help get your foot in the door. Even still, farm folk (at least in the Midwest) are friendly and helpful and may grant your request with just a cold call.

I am going through the same process as you, and I totally understand. I am weary of driving 3+ hours for HPR on club schedules. Low key, DIY launches are nice to have sometimes.

Edit: Yes, I have a city park nearby for LPR and MPR when the winds are right, but during COVID, it now gets a lot more traffic from dog walkers, joggers, and people milling around. I get worried about the safety.

 

[teepot]

I feel bad for everyone who has trouble finding a place to fly. Where I am there are thousands of acres to fly from and no trees. Just knee and waist high sage brush. And dry lake beds. So you are all invited to my place to fly. Or you can come to Las Vegas on a third Saturday of each month, except July & August, and fly with Tripoli Las Vegas. Springfest will be the third weekend of March. Fri, Sat, Sun. But really if anybody wants to visit when your in the area let me know your coming. Lots to do here besides fly rockets.

 

[g.pitts]

...or place your letter in the mailbox of the house.

Noooooo... don't do that. Mail the letter to the person instead. Believe it or not, doing what you recommend is a violation of Federal law.

 

[Skier Dude]

The "acrevalue" site required a log in and fee. If you google the town and something like property owners, or property lines, you can get info. The maps are GIS maps or something.

This is a huge plot of fields near Northampton, MA. Each outline is a separate parcel.
It would be a lot of people to reach out to...

I suspect it's what was described above: over the years it was parceled out to different people. Who knows, maybe in place of payment toward a horse or something.

 

[Bat-mite]

The "acrevalue" site required a log in and fee. If you google the town and something like property owners, or property lines, you can get info. The maps are GIS maps or something.

This is a huge plot of fields near Northampton, MA. Each outline is a separate parcel.
It would be a lot of people to reach out to...

I suspect it's what was described above: over the years it was parceled out to different people. Who knows, maybe in place of payment toward a horse or something.

Wow! That's a launch site waiting to happen...

 

[Rob Caswell]

This is a huge plot of fields near Northampton, MA. Each outline is a separate parcel.
It would be a lot of people to reach out to...

The other consideration is that a lit of that field is on the airport approach, so you need to coordinate and clear it with the airport as well. They're really great fields.... but complicated. We flew there in the 90's, though it was my partner in NAR crime who handled the land owner contact. We could only fly there before planting and after harvest. We were centered on a group of potato fields, which made us name the site "Cape Spud".

We also did a rocket day event at/with the airport, further supported by CMASS (who have the best group launch equipment) and A2Z Science andNature store in Northampton.

So it's not impossible to get access to those fields.... but these days I'm guessing it'll be a little harder than it was back in the mid-90's. There's also some smaller (but still quite large) planting fields on the opposite side ofI-91. We never looked into those.... and I think they have powerlines close by.

 

[Buckeye]

The "acrevalue" site required a log in and fee.

No fee, but a login required to see the names of the owners.

 

[boomtube-mk2]

My town had a bigopenparkthingy so I asked the local law enforcement if I could use it. I then asked the town's fire department if I could use it and after getting affirmative answers from both . . . I used it.

Then the city built a new High School* and a new Elementary School* then an emergency response training center* and now a new recreational center* on and around my bigopenparkthingy.

*You know, all those silly things people don't want or need.

 

[Skier Dude]

No fee, but a login required to see the names of the owners.

Some of the GIS maps I've seen give addresses of the owners, which is helpful.

 

[Marc_G]

I agree with most of the sentiments above. One comment I've got though is that in places that don't have a significant fire risk, for use of public parks, it's generally better to ask forgiveness than permission. Read the park rules, posted at site or on the town website. Usually they are very specific about what isn't allowed. If it doesn't explicitly forbid model rocketry (meaning, don't be deterred by prohibitions against fireworks, missiles [legal definition for certain types of weapons], etc), then model rocketry can be assumed to be permitted unless there is a fire code / permission required in your area.

Too many bureaucrats will reflexively say NO to anything they find risky, no matter the actual risk of the activity or the laws in force. They just don't want to be the guy who gave permission for something, only to have it come back to bite them.

 

[tsmith1315]

then model rocketry can be assumed to be permitted unless there is a fire code / permission required in your area.

For public areas, it might be a good idea to make a little sign stating that your launch is following the safety code set by NAR/TRA. Add a QR code that onlookers can scan that will take them to the national club website while they're watching. Even give your launch a name to make it sound organized and print a copies of the safety code in case someone walks up to ask.

It may prevent assumptions and thwart a phone call to authorities by a "concerned" citizen that would otherwise be too intimidated to ask the crazy pyromaniac what he's doing setting off rockets in the park.

 

[PatD]

Some of the GIS maps I've seen give addresses of the owners, which is helpful.

There may be online access to your state cadastral information. Here the state library allows access to that information. Really handy for finding the actual owner and contact information. Just search for (your state) cadastral.

 

[Buckeye]

For public areas, it might be a good idea to make a little sign stating that your launch is following the safety code set by NAR/TRA. Add a QR code that onlookers can scan that will take them to the national club website while they're watching. Even give your launch a name to make it sound organized and print a copies of the safety code in case someone walks up to ask.

It may prevent assumptions and thwart a phone call to authorities by a "concerned" citizen that would otherwise be too intimidated to ask the crazy pyromaniac what he's doing setting off rockets in the park.

Interesting approach. Signage may attract more attention than you want, however. People will wander over if they think they are "missing out" on something "free." If that social aspect appeals to you, then go for it. Personally, I like to get in, do my own thing, and get out of the park fairly quickly.

 

[Back_at_it]

Noooooo... don't do that. Mail the letter to the person instead. Believe it or not, doing what you recommend is a violation of Federal law.

That is very interesting. Someone needs to tell that to all of the advertisers that have putting junk in my mailboxes for the past 35 yrs.

 

[Marc_G]

I have complained to Amazon about Amazon delivery guys who drive up and put packages in my mailbox rather than walk them to the door. They mark them as " delivered to mailroom" which is BS. Not talking about packages actually in the US mail, just random delivery guys in their own cars.

 

[Buckeye]

I have complained to Amazon about Amazon delivery guys who drive up and put packages in my mailbox rather than walk them to the door. They mark them as " delivered to mailroom" which is BS. Not talking about packages actually in the US mail, just random delivery guys in their own cars.

What's to complain about? The mailbox is dry and small packages inside of it are out of sight of porch pirates.

 

[Marc_G]

What's to complain about? The mailbox is dry and small packages inside of it are out of sight of porch pirates.

And it is a federal crime for anyone but me and the letter carrier to open it. It's not ok to normalize others opening mailboxes. Mail theft is becoming a thing in my town over the past year or two. The Amazon guy should walk my package up to the house (about a five second jaunt) and put it on my doorstep (out of the rain); plenty of places here to hide a small package behind the flower pots.

The guy was lazy, violated protocol, and falsified his report. Three strikes.

Edit: while I vent my wrath on two specific Amazon delivery guys who violated the law, knowingly for sure, every year I get many many deliveries by Amazon and others who all follow protocol properly. I'm not shy about giving a thumbs up delivery report when they take extra care, or deliver late at night at the end of a long route rather than just going home.

 

[Marc_G]

Oh, one more thing:

If Amazon guy puts a package in the mailbox, and subsequently USPS letter carrier delivers mail to the box, the package will be confiscated for lack of postage. This happens with some frequency; people complain about it on nextdoor.

 

[Back_at_it]

Oh, one more thing:

If Amazon guy puts a package in the mailbox, and subsequently USPS letter carrier delivers mail to the box, the package will be confiscated for lack of postage. This happens with some frequency; people complain about it on nextdoor.

You guys must have some real sticklers for letter carriers. I've had advertisements for local restaurants, business and just people passing out ad papers, Amazon, FedEx, UPS and just about every other carrier I can think of stick crap in my mail box for 35+ yrs. and no one has said a word about it and I've never had someone confiscate a package because of lack of postage.

I can tell you that there would be hell to pay if that did happen. Especially when they are obviously labeled with another carriers label. Social media would have a field day with that one.

 

[Marc_G]

You guys must have some real sticklers for letter carriers. I've had advertisements for local restaurants, business and just people passing out ad papers, Amazon, FedEx, UPS and just about every other carrier I can think of stick crap in my mail box for 35+ yrs. and no one has said a word about it and I've never had someone confiscate a package because of lack of postage.

I can tell you that there would be hell to pay if that did happen. Especially when they are obviously labeled with another carriers label. Social media would have a field day with that one.

That's a perspective that's new to me.

Home mailboxes, though supplied and maintained by the homeowner, are Federal Property and are owned by the government. No other carrier should ever tamper with them or use them for deliveries.

 

[g.pitts]

That's a perspective that's new to me.

Home mailboxes, though supplied and maintained by the homeowner, are Federal Property and are owned by the government. No other carrier should ever tamper with them or use them for deliveries.

They used to be marked accordingly on the mailbox itself. Not sure if that's still a thing.