54mm TRA K altitude attempt rocket for NSL west launch 2023

[StreuB1]

I wonder what @Conway Stevens on the pad weight is and what his sims calls out for optimal weight? It might not be a weight issue. It might be a CD issue.

Back in 2011 I was given a Kestrel rocket kit. I did some basic modifications and flew it in the Altitude event at XPRS. I came in 2nd place with a flight to 29,456; Some guy named Curt von Delius.

Most of Curt's record flights have taken many attempts to get 'clean' flights, good altitudes and a recovered rockets.

Tony

Good point, Tony!! I didn't look at the weight aspect as my thoughts immediately figured he was near optimal weight and maybe pulling a little more out and keeping the surface clean might assist.

I, like many here, know Conway is on the right path and its exciting to see people reinvigorating attacks on records. Especially when this group of attacks is very close and well within the capability of taking the record over.

Either way, its awesome to see altitude attempts and 2-stage attempts expanding and going for records. This is how we move the ball forward regarding development. I point to your videos and posts on your deployment bag and cable cutter scheme that works so well. I know someone in particular that is working on a version for his own project right now. He might be typing as we speak.

 

[tfish]

@tfish. Tony, my rocket weight before motor was 25oz. Pad weight with motor 104 oz(6lbs 8 oz) burn out weight 40oz. The RasAero sims were around 32k. I have some changes already made. Lots learned from the flight. Working towards another attempt. I have had several flights practice leading up to this flight. It's been a fun process. More fun to come with a few different motor levels.

Have you run "optimal mass simulations" using your simulation program? At times I need to add weight to my rockets to squeeze the last little bit of altitude out of them..

edited..or add weight by building some things stronger then I think they need to be..

Tony

 

[JimJarvis50]

@JimJarvis50 Jim that's interesting. I had no idea. Everything there was for information lead me to fully believe Curt was the record holder and had the 31,672 ft. That's what's listed and what I took at face value. What is the current record? I will have to look to see if I kept it all. After coming up short I discarded the paper forms my witness and RSO filled out for all the records submissions I'm pretty sure the data has been overwritten by another flight on that GPS unit. Will do some looking to see what I have. After feeling I came up short I felt my data wasn't important anymore and put my mind towards my next attempt.

Makes me rather sad now.

It would be a shame if you're unable to produce the gps data. If others saw it, that might be sufficient? The K record is perhaps the most difficult record to achieve because you are flying slowly through the jet stream. Conditions have to be perfect or you just get sawed off.

So far as I know, the record is my flight at 29,266. I tried to correct this a few years back, but just got crickets, so I have long stopped caring about Tripoli records.

Jim

 

[Conway Stevens]

Have you run "optimal mass simulations" using your simulation program? At times I need to add weight to my rockets to squeeze the last little bit of altitude out of them..

edited..or add weight by building some things stronger then I think they need to be..

Tony

I'm right close to optimal mass. There are some variables like motor. I've seen several K250 that have much different propellant weights I went through several and used the one with the heaviest weight I found. Right now weight wasn't so much the concern as aerodynamic drag was. I think with different fins, less points of drag I can get better numbers

 

[tfish]

I'm right close to optimal mass. There are some variables like motor. I've seen several K250 that have much different propellant weights I went through several and used the one with the heaviest weight I found. Right now weight wasn't so much the concern as aerodynamic drag was. I think with different fins, less points of drag I can get better numbers

Copy..
Not busting your chops..
Trying to be helpful..

Tony

 

[Conway Stevens]

It would be a shame if you're unable to produce the gps data. If others saw it, that might be sufficient? The K record is perhaps the most difficult record to achieve because you are flying slowly through the jet stream. Conditions have to be perfect or you just get sawed off.

So far as I know, the record is my flight at 29,266. I tried to correct this a few years back, but just got crickets, so I have long stopped caring about Tripoli records.

Jim

Jim, yes it was witnessed. but honestly I'm not that upset by it. It gives me some fire to do better. Now that I know about the records. I won't be to quick to discard as a failure to exceed what's posted. But the key thing for me is I'm having a good time. Gaining experiences and knowledge. Pushing myself to be better and go after bigger limits. Its personally more about my goals, reproducing cleanly recovered flights again and again within waiver. That's my 7th flight of the year and already we'll over 200k ft accumulated. All recovered inside waiver and 100% good. I have multiple other rockets I'm working with for fun attempts at the TRA records. Win or lose its all about funs and gaining knowledge and experience.

I do pay attention to winds aloft on every flight. That day so far was probably the most calm, docile winds aloft with winds ranging 35mph to 50mph couldnt have asked for better. On other flights of mine they have ranged 60 to 100mph. If I can get those nice winds again and a warmer day by 20 degrees that would be even nicer.

 

[Conway Stevens]

Copy..
Not busting your chops..
Trying to be helpful..

Tony

@tfish Tony my apologies if I came off as you were busting my chops. Not at all one bit have high regard for you and Jim Jarvis and your inputs. I take any and all your comments and criticism with open mind and completely know your experience. Thank you for all the advice you given always. Your help is always welcome.

 

[tfish]

@tfish Tony my apologies if I came off as you were busting my chops. Not at all one bit have high regard for you and Jim Jarvis and your inputs. I take any and all your comments and criticism with open mind and completely know your experience. Thank you for all the advice you given always. Your help is always welcome.

Conway Not at all!
I normally don't ask prying questions..
Thanks for the kind words..

Yes, Jim is pretty good.... : )

we will now, return to your normal broadcast.

Tony

 

[Buckeye]

Either way, its awesome to see altitude attempts and 2-stage attempts expanding and going for records.

That's my 7th flight of the year and already we'll over 200k ft accumulated. All recovered inside waiver and 100% good.

I like Conway's flights because they are successful and recovered intact, even if the record is not achieved. Many record attempts discussed on the forum end in catastrophic failure - blow up, core sample, or lost for good - due to bad design, bad luck, or dumb mistakes.

 

[Conway Stevens]

Either way, its awesome to see altitude attempts and 2-stage attempts expanding and going for records.

I have current projects in the works for K L and M motor ranges as well as a 4 inch M to M capable 2 stage. I also plan to do these on my own motors as well. But the biggest part is I'm having fun regardless.

 

[Conway Stevens]

I like Conway's flights because they are successful and recovered intact, even if the record is not achieved. Many record attempts discussed on the forum end in catastrophic failure - blow up, core sample, or lost for good - due to bad design, bad luck, or dumb mistakes.

Going up is easy. It's sticking the landing that's important. It's where I focus the biggest parts of things and my attention to detail of the flight. I'm very very strict on my own flights with this. I can not consider any flight up a successful flight unless my recovery works as designed and recovers 100% clean, inside the waiver cylinder, in 100 % flyable condition outside of cosmetic issues. There is no exception for myself with this.