hesitation before buying 54mm hardware

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watermelonman

watermelonman

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At 29mm I was set in my Aerotech ways. With 38mm the lack of need for closures swayed me to the other side. However with 54mm that benefit goes away. It sounds like Cesaroni updated the 75mm hardware in this regard recently, is it as simple as the 38mm hardware now? I would love to see that hit the 54mm line, also hate to buy 54mm hardware right before it was updated.

Any reason to believe that changes are in store, or any other reason to go back to Aerotech for 54mm?
 
The CTI 54mm hardware is not going anywhere. It is set up similar to the CTI 38mm hardware except the nozzle is not built into the closure. The 54mm hardware has only 2 pieces: the case and the closure. All hardware moving forward into larger sizes have more "pieces". The recent change to CTI's 75mm hardware line should have no effect on anyone's decision to pick up hardware. CTI will stand behind their product no matter what version you have. And as far as the question about a built in closure for the 54's. I have asked CTI about that also and was quickly told "no way" They said each reload would need to be re-certified as it would be a reload design change and not just a case re-design.
 
Pro54 is super easy to use. Adjust the delay as needed then put the delay module back on the main reload, slide the whole thing into the case and screw on the rear closure...
 
Just curious, why were you set in AT for 29? CTI has a ton more options in 29.

The reason to fly 38 Aerotech is mostly cheap reloads, although 38 CTI is great for the range of motors. For 54, CTI and AT are almost exactly the same price for the reloads, so you can really go with either, I'm planning to go CTI for 54 eventually because of the much wider impulse and thrust options, as well as the ease of building.
 
More changes are in store for Aerotech; I expect they will migrate all their reloads to RMS-EZ eventually and you won't need a forward closure any more.
 
SCrocketfan said:
Just curious, why were you set in AT for 29? CTI has a ton more options in 29.
Click to expand...

For me? Zero hazmat. Lower cost. Personally, I'm not a fan of the Pro38 design. Went AT for 38 as well. The variety of CTI loads is impressive, but wasn't enough to sway.
 
mikec said:
More changes are in store for Aerotech; I expect they will migrate all their reloads to RMS-EZ eventually and you won't need a forward closure any more.
Click to expand...


Ummmm....yes you do. Just a different one designed for the EZ loads...but still a forward closure
 
You could look at Loki motors great stuff and easy to assemble, link is below in my signature.


TA
 
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CTI has more variety in 54mm , and the hardware is reasonable . It is my #1 recommendation for a cert special..free case and buy the closure. Even without special is cheap to piece together a set ..start with a 3g case and a closure..grab spacers as needed.

Aerotech is easy for 54mm. There is a 54 / 1250 motor on the AT price sheet under $100.. cheap way to get new closures and a motor case . What you want to acquire is a 54/1706 case..that is where the loads are .. Dark Matter Metalstorm Propellant X are only found in this size. If you keep your eyes open there is AT hardware for sale used fairly often.

AT has all but killed there 54mm sales by limiting their newer propellants to just one case size and keeping the specialty (longest & fastest burns) loads at a HIGHER price point and REQUIRING special closures. Those loads also shipped all plugged REQUIRING electronics, and AT priced the DMS K535W lower than the equivalent reloads.. so that will not encourage HW acquistion either.

To date I have not flown any Warp9 loads and no AT long burns in 54mm due to the additional expense of the closures. I see some come up used every so often..but I will only buy them tapped .

Kenny
 
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blackjack2564 said:
I stand corrected....mistakenly calling the retaining ring a forward closure.
Click to expand...
Hey, these details matter, Jim. :rolleyes:

At any rate, I think the OP has his answer: no changes are expected for CTI Pro54 hardware, and some changes are expected, eventually, for AT (though those changes will make AT motor hardware cheaper.)

In general there are more places selling discounted AT reloads than CTI, so reloads tend to be cheaper. Also, AT is introducing pretty cost-effective SU motors, so maybe you don't want to invest in hardware at all.
 
SCrocketfan said:
Just curious, why were you set in AT for 29? CTI has a ton more options in 29.
Click to expand...

I grew up with Aerotech as the only vendor saving me from Estes/NAR limitations. Mad Cow existed, but no one I knew had any real experience there. The 29/40-120 was the coolest thing on the market when it came out but none of our parents would buy them! Naturally now that I have my own income it was one of the first purchases I made.

Nostalgia and romanticism, I suppose.

thobin said:
You could look at Loki motors great stuff and easy to assemble, link is below in my signature.

TA
Click to expand...

Having read what I have they would be my top choice! Except, California.

GRIFFON said:
The CTI 54mm hardware is not going anywhere. It is set up similar to the CTI 38mm hardware except the nozzle is not built into the closure. The 54mm hardware has only 2 pieces: the case and the closure. All hardware moving forward into larger sizes have more "pieces". The recent change to CTI's 75mm hardware line should have no effect on anyone's decision to pick up hardware. CTI will stand behind their product no matter what version you have. And as far as the question about a built in closure for the 54's. I have asked CTI about that also and was quickly told "no way" They said each reload would need to be re-certified as it would be a reload design change and not just a case re-design.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the fast response, full of great detail!

KenRico said:
Aerotech is easy for 54mm. There is a 54 / 1250 motor on the AT price sheet under $100.. cheap way to get new closures and a motor case . What you want to acquire is a 54/1706 case..that is where the loads are .. Dark Matter Metalstorm Propellant X are only found in this size. If you keep your eyes open there is AT hardware for sale used fairly often.

AT has all but killed there 54mm sales by limiting their newer propellants to just one case size and keeping the specialty (longest & fastest burns) loads at a HIGHER price point and REQUIRING special closures. Those loads also shipped all plugged REQUIRING electronics, and AT priced the DMS K535W lower than the equivalent reloads.. so that will not encourage HW acquistion either.
Click to expand...

This sounds extremely frustrating. Between this hassle and the other details from Griffon I am about sold on Cesaroni for my pending foray into 54mm power. Thanks!
 
KenRico said:
CTI has more variety in 54mm , and the hardware is reasonable . It is my #1 recommendation for a cert special..free case and buy the closure. Even without special is cheap to piece together a set ..start with a 3g case and a closure..grab spacers as needed.

Aerotech is easy for 54mm. There is a 54 / 1250 motor on the AT price sheet under $100.. cheap way to get new closures and a motor case . What you want to acquire is a 54/1706 case..that is where the loads are .. Dark Matter Metalstorm Propellant X are only found in this size. If you keep your eyes open there is AT hardware for sale used fairly often.

AT has all but killed there 54mm sales by limiting their newer propellants to just one case size and keeping the specialty (longest & fastest burns) loads at a HIGHER price point and REQUIRING special closures. Those loads also shipped all plugged REQUIRING electronics, and AT priced the DMS K535W lower than the equivalent reloads.. so that will not encourage HW acquistion either.

To date I have not flown any Warp9 loads and no AT long burns in 54mm due to the additional expense of the closures. I see some come up used every so often..but I will only buy them tapped .

Kenny
Click to expand...

For any diameter, buy a 3G and a 6G and two spacers. With those two cases, you can fly every reload CTI makes, except the 6XL.
 
+1 to Bat-mite's comment.

I flew back in 97-01 and then got out. CTI had just come on the scene at that time. I was fully invested in AT 38mm hardware and could not see any reason to switch.

I got back in this year and like you I bought 24 and 29mm AT hobby line cases. There is no better deal in that size range. I also wanted to try different types of reloads so I bought a 29mm CTI starter set mainly for the long burn and Skid Mark motors.

When I decided to jump back in to L2 I decided to skip over 38mm entirely and go with CTI 54mm HW. There are so many more choices (50+) and the prices (reloads + cases) are close enough to call it even. In the long run AT is cheaper, but for me it would be a LONG run.

With the 29mm 3 grain and 54mm 3/6 grain cases I can fly anything from an F to a full K.

Bat-mite said:
For any diameter, buy a 3G and a 6G and two spacers. With those two cases, you can fly every reload CTI makes, except the 6XL.
Click to expand...
 
For me.... the AT 54/1706 covers a really good bit of what I want to do. K185W, K513FJ, K550W, K695R, K805G, K1100T, K1103X, K540M, K456DM. You could fly that for years and not get bored.

I don't really see needing closures as a deal breaker. When you're blowing $100+ a load..... whats a closure?
 
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watermelonman said:
At 29mm I was set in my Aerotech ways. With 38mm the lack of need for closures swayed me to the other side. However with 54mm that benefit goes away. It sounds like Cesaroni updated the 75mm hardware in this regard recently, is it as simple as the 38mm hardware now? I would love to see that hit the 54mm line, also hate to buy 54mm hardware right before it was updated.

Any reason to believe that changes are in store, or any other reason to go back to Aerotech for 54mm?
Click to expand...


CTI is easy to use. If you want to fly 54 mm L motors in California, you need CTI. Hardware is pretty cheap. My overall recommendation is to buy both CTI and AT. Buy the CTI 54 mm starter set, add one extra 6XL case, and you can fly all of the CTI 54 mm loads. Then get yourself an AT 70 motor and buy cheap J350 White Lightnings and J420 Redline motors (these are 38 mm, but adapt down). You can never really have enough motor hardware. You might pick one or the other to start up, but it is not a lifelong commitment type of decision. Neither CTI or AT is going to leave you high and dry on an investment in hardware. I do fly a lot of CTI 54 mm. I will say that you can load, fly, clean, and reload, real fast. Good luck with your decisions.
 
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I bought all my 29mm and 38mm AT hardware before CTI was really available. With the AT loads in 29 and 38 being so much cheaper, I've never found a need to get the CTI cases. In 54mm, that's a different story. I was able to get the 54/1280 AT motor on special for $75. Couldn't pass that up. Then a 1706 case became available and I grabbed that too. I got the CTI Pro54 6GXL case and between that and the AT hardware, I figure I'm set at 54mm. Now the question is, what to get in 75mm and 98mm? I'm leaning toward the snap ring cases so research loads are easier.
 
Definitely snap ring for 75. With the hubcap adapter you can fly the entire Pro75 line in your snap ring cases. And still do research.
 

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