Winston
Lorenzo von Matterhorn
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2009
- Messages
- 9,560
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Heat is the only way they recommend. It greatly lowers viscosity, doesn't reduce strength like solvents, but lowers working time.Pretty clear West Systems doesn't think Thinnng is a good idea. I heartly agree. use epoxy (whoevers brand) at the viscosity provided. As stated in the research deep penetration into glass is not required.
I thin epoxies a lot...over mach 2+ and 30K no issues. I don't use West Systems. I don't care for it and would probably think twice about thinning it.
Tony
Tony,,
Which epoxy do you thin ??
And how do you thin it ??
Is there a way to thin epoxy without adversely affecting
it's strength / bond properties or shortening it's pot life ???
Teddy
Ted, Not sure I'll be able to the answer some of your questions. I use de-natured alcohol to thin my epoxies as needed. The epoxies that I've thinned are System Three T-88, Raka 900 Medium/631 Fast, an unknown "Chevron High Temperature" stuff ( 5 gallon can off ebay) and some Proline 4100 after if began to thicken after a couple of months.
The amount of thinning veries depending on the epoxy and what I'm using it for. The system Three is very thick compared to the Proline 4100. I like it a tad thinner when I'm laying up body tubes compared to doing tip to tip layups. I did a build thread in 2011 to prove hand layed FG and cheap boat epoxy could be used for some extreme flights https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?19534-My-next-project&highlight=tuff (i'll agree 4 years later, that there are more extreme flights these days. But for 95% of fliers will never go above mach 2) That rocket went to 37K @ mach 2.2
To thin I just add a very small amount...I'm guessing 1ml in 6 oz of epoxy..again a guess, I never actually measured the amount of alcohol. When you first start mixing it's sort of like milky them in mixes in nicely. you can always add more. I've noticed no difference in working time with thinned epoxy. It does take a couple days for the alcohol smell to go away.
Tony
Here comes the nuts part...
I wanted to find a broken microwave being thrown out,, bad carousel or something...
I'd take the microwave emitter out of the unit,, sit it on my bench so that I could
point it at the airframe where I was injecting,, run a switch outside of my garage,,
do the injection,, step outside and turn it on for 2 or 3 seconds.........
OK,, go ahead,,,
Are you nut's,,, lol....
Teddy
Tackyness is from not hardening correctly. ..
I have a 4 ft roll of 1/8" lead...
It's from when they were building the x ray rooms in Lenox Hill hospital. ...
I could make a great shield out of that,, and plywood. ...
This isn't nessasary for me now though. ..
When I get around to it my next build will need a tip to tip lamination. ..
Teddy
You guy's r probably going to say this is nuts...
I used to try to thin epoxy...
I used Aeropoxy 6209 structural,,
was injecting internal fillets,,
was using a flashlight behind the glass so I could see where the injection was flowing to and how it was flowing...
For sure it wasn't flowing freely enough so I tried adding a little alcohol and really whipping it in to get it to mix...
It worked,, I didn't feel good about this though, as I thought I must be making it harden differently / not correctly / there must be a loss of strength...
My next foray into thinning 6209 was better...
I'd mix up a batch and put it in the microwave for an extremely short time,, 2 or 3 seconds...
This worked better,, but the more time, the thinner, and the more time the warmer,, and the warmer the faster it would set up...
I like long work times because in my minds eye the longer it is fluid and the thinner the better it is absorbed and the better the bond will be...
That's as far as I got,, this worked though...
Here comes the nuts part...
I wanted to find a broken microwave being thrown out,, bad carousel or something...
I'd take the microwave emitter out of the unit,, sit it on my bench so that I could
point it at the airframe where I was injecting,, run a switch outside of my garage,,
do the injection,, step outside and turn it on for 2 or 3 seconds.........
OK,, go ahead,,,
Are you nut's,,, lol....
Teddy
This explains a lot, Teddy... ... ...
I'm not asking if you're nuts, I know you are.
This explains a lot, Teddy... ... ...
I'm not asking if you're nuts, I know you are.
Tackyness is from not hardening correctly. ..
I have a 4 ft roll of 1/8" lead...
It's from when they were building the x ray rooms in Lenox Hill hospital. ...
I could make a great shield out of that,, and plywood. ...
This isn't nessasary for me now though. ..
When I get around to it my next build will need a tip to tip lamination. ..
Teddy
You guy's r probably going to say this is nuts...
I used to try to thin epoxy...
I used Aeropoxy 6209 structural,,
was injecting internal fillets,,
was using a flashlight behind the glass so I could see where the injection was flowing to and how it was flowing...
For sure it wasn't flowing freely enough so I tried adding a little alcohol and really whipping it in to get it to mix...
It worked,, I didn't feel good about this though, as I thought I must be making it harden differently / not correctly / there must be a loss of strength...
My next foray into thinning 6209 was better...
I'd mix up a batch and put it in the microwave for an extremely short time,, 2 or 3 seconds...
This worked better,, but the more time, the thinner, and the more time the warmer,, and the warmer the faster it would set up...
I like long work times because in my minds eye the longer it is fluid and the thinner the better it is absorbed and the better the bond will be...
That's as far as I got,, this worked though...
Here comes the nuts part...
I wanted to find a broken microwave being thrown out,, bad carousel or something...
I'd take the microwave emitter out of the unit,, sit it on my bench so that I could
point it at the airframe where I was injecting,, run a switch outside of my garage,,
do the injection,, step outside and turn it on for 2 or 3 seconds.........
OK,, go ahead,,,
Are you nut's,,, lol....
Teddy
Teddy, I am not liking the idea of the microwave very much. Have you thought about building a composite oven. Heck, even a space heater in the vicinity of the rocket should warm things up adequately.
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