Ventris

[caheaton]

Well, my Estes Ventris (ordered two, so maybe Ventri ?) arrived and I must say I'm a little disappointed with Estes. As others have reported in the FB group, the kits arrived with no facecard and combined into a single plastic bag. Rather cheap for what they're changing and pretty much kills any collector appeal.

(And no decals as well....). Looking forward to flying it, but not happy with the way Estes seems to be taking advantage of the BAR rocketeers. I know they need to turn a profit, but this leaves a bad taste....

 

[Scott_650]

Well, my Estes Ventris (ordered two, so maybe Ventri ?) arrived and I must say I'm a little disappointed with Estes. As others have reported in the FB group, the kits arrived with no facecard and combined into a single plastic bag. Rather cheap for what they're changing and pretty much kills any collector appeal.

(And no decals as well....). Looking forward to flying it, but not happy with the way Estes seems to be taking advantage of the BAR rocketeers. I know they need to turn a profit, but this leaves a bad taste....

The original didn’t include the roll pattern decal - I was hoping the reissue would, so that’s a bit disappointing.

It appears that these reissued kits are being assembled in Penrose CO rather than offshore like the originals, maybe a decent tradeoff for no facecard? I’m not a collector as much as I am an accumulator (hah!) so I’m an agnostic on the facecard thing - mine usually get used as raw material, epoxy mixing pallets or tossed. But for those that like having or expected to get one I can understand the annoyance.

As far as the cost goes it’s within a few bucks of the adjusted for inflation original issue MSRP and in line with what the clone kits were selling for awhile ago, but OTH Estes isn’t moving these through a distributor or retailer - their margin must be pretty solid at $90 a piece. Way more than the discounted price you could buy the original for in the mid-2000s and let’s not discuss the fire sale prices Hobbico sold them for before and during their bankruptcy!

Frankly I never thought they’d ever reissue any of these mid-2000s PSII builder kits and even though the Ventris is a good looking 4FNC basic rocket there are better values in MPR/low-end HPR kits out there - the Balsa Machining 3” School Rocket for example - but evidently Estes saw enough potential demand to gin up a new run of kits with hints that there’s more to come.

 

[Initiator001]

The amount of whining on various Estes 'Fanboy' websites concerning the Ventris re-issue makes me lol.

I bought one of the Ventris models when it was first released direct from Estes and paid full SRP ($64.99).
There is a thread here on TRF about my thoughts about the kit along with building and flying comments.

With the exception of no facecard this re-issue is the same model. Note: I bought one of the re-issue Ventris.
For direct sales a facecard is not needed.
People forget that kit facecards only happened around the time Damon bought Estes. Before then Estes kits had no facecards. Usually one of the pages of the instruction sheet was printed to act as a 'facecard'. I had several Estes kits I bought at the time that did not have facecards.

There is a pretty good chance that this was a test case to see if the 'hard-core/old-time' Estes rocketeers would put their money where their mouth was.
As of my posting this message Estes still has Ventris kits available on their website.
If this was viewed as a test case by Estes management I suspect that it only proved so-called old-time Estes rocketeers are all talk.
Don't expect many future re-issues from Estes based on the response to this trial balloon.

 

[Scott_650]

Some good insight from Initiator001 here and at YORF on the Ventris, Estes and the hobby rocketry business in general.

And I think you could be right about future PSII reissues - the nostalgia-tinted negative reaction to the Ventris probably means the future of PSII reissues doesn’t look particularly bright. But that’s ok, my opinion hasn’t changed, I think the current PSII concept is sound, even if the execution may need some tweaking - I’m looking at you and your plastic chute DBRM! - Estes as a company is all about model rockets and I’d rather see them focused on creating interesting designs that fly great on their black powder motors rather than more just good enough MPR rockets. The current PSII kits fit their strengths better - literally larger or more complex model rockets. Frankly, I’m surprised the recent Saturn kits weren’t branded as PSIIs. Including some of the most challenging 24mm powered kits under the PSII umbrella would’ve sent a clear signal about what the current PSII rockets are all about.

The So Long - a kit I rather like and will buy eventually (unless it goes OOP before I do, then it’ll become the bestest kit ever and Estes is doing me dirty by not reissuing it ) - is brilliant, a relatively inexpensive, good looking and straightforward to build rocket that is specifically designed to use the biggest motors Estes makes and completely functional on adapted smaller motors. And again, my only criticism of the SL is the recovery gear - I love streamer recovery but I think Estes could do better than the streamers provided. Not sure they’ll fit but I’ll be trying some thin mil fabric streamers in mine.

Lastly, Estes is learning the hard way what the Japanese motorcycle companies learned about what “fan boys” say they want (and what will sell) and what the market actually wants - see the history of “retro” designs sold by anyone other than H-D, Triumph, Moto Guzzi and Royal Enfield here in the US.

 

[gldknght]

Well, my Estes Ventris (ordered two, so maybe Ventri ?) arrived and I must say I'm a little disappointed with Estes. As others have reported in the FB group, the kits arrived with no facecard and combined into a single plastic bag. Rather cheap for what they're changing and pretty much kills any collector appeal.

(And no decals as well....). Looking forward to flying it, but not happy with the way Estes seems to be taking advantage of the BAR rocketeers. I know they need to turn a profit, but this leaves a bad taste....

Me too on this, but then again, most everything estes does these days leaves a bad taste, from cheaply made low quality kits, to bad decals, bad parachutes, p!$$ poor customer service and stupid high prices.

I'm pretty sure I'm done buying anything estes for a while. I may not even get the Great Goblin when it comes out. I can probably scratch build one for half of what estes will most likely be charging for theirs if they ever make it available.