The Electric Hummer

[Pete.D]

I'm surprised there aren't more SUV/minivan options in the electric/plug-in hybrid market. I think the only one there is the Chrysler Pacifica plug-in, which gets 30-50 miles on a charge and then there's a gas-powered generator that kicks in (a la Chevy Volt). I would like one, but my wife really likes the minivan we have now.

If you can swing one car plus rentals, that seems like a good option too.

Need a truck/big SUV/RV for towing to and camping at the big rocket launches out West. Battery-electric cars (and trucks) are fine for local hops, but once they become affordable and everyone uses them we'll need a much-improved huge electrical generation and distribution system. Too bad solar electric doesn't work at night and wind is unreliable, when everyone will be charging those vehicles at home. Fusion is the future, and hydrogen is the medium for getting it to our vehicles!

 

[afadeev]

Can't wait to see how people will complain about this one. I won't spend 80k on a truck, but if I had 80k to spend on a truck, I'd look into it.

Well, it's a little too boxy and fugly looking.
But who am I to judge. I had put the deposit down on this monstrosity: https://www.tesla.com/cybertruck

$112,995 for 2021 1000 hp 0-60 in 3.0 seconds price doesn’t get down to $80k till 2024 with 2 not 3 electric motors and 650 hp also range cut from 350 to 250.

Tri-motor Cybertruck is "only" $69.9K also for 2021 (cheap version is $39.9K for 2022).
7,500+ lbs towing capacity.
0-60 in <2.9 seconds.
500+ mile range.

Good times to be shopping for a truck!

 

[Tobor]

Few things frighten me more than an idiot in stealth mode.

Oh my gawd, that is so friggin hysterically funny

......and scary!

 

[Not Quite Nominal]

To be useful to me, a truck has to be able to pull a 7000 Lb trailer 700 miles in 14 hours, including refuel/recharge time.

...

Current electric vehicles are mere toys, and anyone who believes personal vehicular transportation can become entirely emission-free by 2035 is delusional. New technology is required; "Mr. Fusion" could do it but that's science fiction. Water/steam/air rockets could be an emission-free replacement for vehicular travel, but routine takeoffs and landings would be impractical. A realistic non-polluting fuel could be hydrogen, with a modified conventional internal-combustion engine, a external-combustion engine, or a fuel cell powered electric.

I wouldn't say they are mere toys: Plenty of people use electric cars as their daily commuter, and plenty more use ebikes.

They're not that great as your only car, but if you have two cars, having one electric can save five bucks a day or so in gas. That's not enough to justify a new new electric, but a used Leaf will pay for itself pretty quickly.

There's an excellent use case for the electric truck actually. Most fleet use is short range, day-only driving, which is why Amazon is putting so much money into Rivian trucks. Load the truck, drive it around (electric vehicles are incredibly efficient at low speed start/stop style driving) the 50 or so miles it needs to go for that day's package deliveries, plug it in overnight at the warehouse while it's being charged.

If I owned a lawn/light construction/telephone company type business, a fleet of electrics would be exactly what I want.

Similarly, if my main heavy duty use for my truck was towing a boat to a nearby lake and the occasional run to Home Depot, an electric truck and a gas car would be a great combo.

 

[Pete.D]

They're not that great as your only car, but if you have two cars, having one electric can save five bucks a day or so in gas. That's not enough to justify a new new electric, but a used Leaf will pay for itself pretty quickly.

That doesn't seem to compute???
Comparing the Leaf to my Mini Cooper: driving about 20 miles a day at 35MPG, that's about a dollar a day for gas, say $365 a year if I drove every day. A Leaf costs around $30K (about the same as a Mini), so you'd have to drive it 82 years to pay for the gas savings even if electricity was free. I've never been able to get more than 20 years use out of a car without major maintenance, and the Leaf's battery is expensive with questionable longevity. I don't know what it costs to charge a Leaf but at a 1000 Watt charge rate and $0.15 per kilowatt hour for 8 hours it will cost at least a buck to charge the Leaf every night.

 

[afadeev]

I wouldn't say they are mere toys: Plenty of people use electric cars as their daily commuter, and plenty more use ebikes.
They're not that great as your only car, but if you have two cars, having one electric can save five bucks a day or so in gas. That's not enough to justify a new new electric, but a used Leaf will pay for itself pretty quickly.

True 'dat.
I'm on my third EV as of now, and each purchase has been primarily a financially driven decision.
But I wouldn't recommend it as a one-and-only family car.

Globally, EV sales are in the 2-5% range of overall car sales.
https://www.ev-volumes.com/
In the luxury segment, which is how EVs are priced right now, they are destroying the competition, and now own 50+% of the luxury car segment:
https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2020-us-midsize-luxury-car-sales-figures/https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2020-us-large-luxury-car-sales-figures/

A gas or diesel-powered truck, large SUV or RV can do this easily, but battery-powered electric is not a practical solution yet (at any price) because of the outrageous full-recharge time requirement. Even the (not so) "hi-rate" charging stations often have waiting lines and long charge times for a full charge

I sort-of share your phobia, and still take my gas vehicles for major road trips.
Over the past two years, I had put 24K miles on my EV, and 23K miles on all my gas cars, cumulatively.
I'm yet to wait in a line to recharge the Tesla at a super-charger, although I had grabbed the last, or the second-to-last, charging bays on a number of occasions.

Current electric vehicles are mere toys, and anyone who believes personal vehicular transportation can become entirely emission-free by 2035 is delusional.

EV market went from 0% to 50+% EV adoption over the past 5-7 years.
I can visualize similar adoption curves in the commercial and econobox markets over the next 5-10 years.

I don't think we will ever go 100% EV adoption in any given market segment, but 50+% in 10-15 years is entirely doable.

 

[Pete.D]

EV market went from 0% to 50+% EV adoption over the past 5-7 years.
I can visualize similar adoption curves in the commercial and econobox markets over the next 5-10 years.

Great on the econobox market; I'd love to try one (like I wanted to try an Elio; alas, my $100 deposit is likely gone). I love small cars, and when my Mini dies I'll likely consider an electric replacement for local driving. I don't anticipate giving up my gas truck though; it's essential for trips and will remain so for the forseeable future. I certainly agree that electric trucks are the future of the commercial local-use market, but the Hummer is just another rich man's toy.

 

[Pete.D]

Well, it's a little too boxy and fugly looking.
But who am I to judge. I had put the deposit down on this monstrosity: https://www.tesla.com/cybertruck



Tri-motor Cybertruck is "only" $69.9K also for 2021 (cheap version is $39.9K for 2022).
7,500+ lbs towing capacity.
0-60 in <2.9 seconds.
500+ mile range.

Good times to be shopping for a truck!

I looked at that and saw only "250+ mile range". I wonder what the range is towing 7500 lbs at 65 MPH, and how much time for a full charge?

 

[Not Quite Nominal]

That doesn't seem to compute???
Comparing the Leaf to my Mini Cooper: driving about 20 miles a day at 35MPG, that's about a dollar a day for gas, say $365 a year if I drove every day. A Leaf costs around $30K (about the same as a Mini), so you'd have to drive it 82 years to pay for the gas savings even if electricity was free. I've never been able to get more than 20 years use out of a car without major maintenance, and the Leaf's battery is expensive with questionable longevity. I don't know what it costs to charge a Leaf but at a 1000 Watt charge rate and $0.15 per kilowatt hour for 8 hours it will cost at least a buck to charge the Leaf every night.

Directly in the quote above I used the words "used Leaf". Available for ~$5k, all day long. If you're buying a new Leaf, or a new car in general, you're just setting money on fire.

Replacing a fifteen year old Altima (same brand, equivalent passenger volume) with a ten year old Leaf will save you a gallon or two a day. You're right that there is the cost of charging, so let's round down to one gallon, or three dollars.

Do that for ~240 commute days, a few weekend errands, and a couple saved oil changes and you are looking at saving a little under $1k/yr. Buy the car for ~5k, drive for five years, sell for 2-3k (due to battery degredation)

I wouldn't do it myself since I don't do the daily commute and I enjoy internal combustion, but the economics are there for a second car.

 

[Alan R]

I just bought a new Tesla Model 3 in August. It is competitively priced for what you get. I'm in it for about 45k after my rebate with the 300 mile range option.
It's warranted for 8 years/120k miles.
All this discussion about gas savings miss the point. Yes, you save a little bit plugging it in, but I realized the real savings is for the next 10 years:
*no oil changes
*no timing belts
*no alternators
*no transmissions
*no radiator repairs
*no jumper cables
and never have to stop for gas on the way to work

--- yes... it will need brakes eventually, but mine will last 3x longer because i rarely use them.

You have to start dealing with those problems after 4-5 years in a regular car.

As for the long range driving, I take a trip over 300 miles maybe 2-3x a year. I can deal with that.

And it's quick. Instant torque throws you back in your seat when you floor it. 0-60 in 4sec. It's quicker than my son's 8-cyl Mustang GT. He's jealous. HAHAHAH

I think the real boom for the electric car companies will be fleet sales for short haul delivery vehicles. Like beer trucks or the amazon vans. Imagine the gas savings there.

As for that Hummer and others - towing stuff puts a strain on the batteries and kills the range pretty quick. That would be the spec to look at.

Finally.. I love it.

 

[cerving]

To be useful to me, a truck has to be able to pull a 7000 Lb trailer 700 miles in 14 hours, including refuel/recharge time.

A gas or diesel-powered truck, large SUV or RV can do this easily, but battery-powered electric is not a practical solution yet (at any price) because of the outrageous full-recharge time requirement. Even the (not so) "hi-rate" charging stations often have waiting lines and long charge times for a full charge, so it effectively takes well over 20 hours to go that distance, requiring a sleep stop to make such a trip: effective trip time becomes at least double what the gas/diesel truck/SUV/RV can do it in, not even counting the time to recharge the battery at the destination. Note, I don't consider swap-able batteries to be a practical solution; they're a logistical nightmare.

Current electric vehicles are mere toys, and anyone who believes personal vehicular transportation can become entirely emission-free by 2035 is delusional. New technology is required; "Mr. Fusion" could do it but that's science fiction. Water/steam/air rockets could be an emission-free replacement for vehicular travel, but routine takeoffs and landings would be impractical. A realistic non-polluting fuel could be hydrogen, with a modified conventional internal-combustion engine, a external-combustion engine, or a fuel cell powered electric.

I'd bet that by 2035 going 700 miles on a charge would not be so far-fetched. Electric cars 10 years ago, like the original Nissan Leaf, were good for maybe 100 miles. Now 300 miles, the equivalent of a tank of gas in most cars, is the norm. 15 years worth of incremental improvements in battery, motor, and electronics technology should be able to achieve a 2x increase in range without requiring some "breakthrough" to occur.

 

[Winston]

All The Details Of GMC's All-Electric Supertruck - Engineering Explained channel



GMC Hummer EV revealed with 1,000 hp, 0-60 in 3 sec for $112,595
Hummer's electric pickup launches as a fully loaded Edition 1 trim with removable roof panels, 350-mile range, three-second zero-to-60 time, wheel steering with CrabWalk mode and standard Super Cruise.

[That's a lot cheaper than I thought it would be from watching the above video! However, if demand exceeds supply, we'll see massive dealer price gouging. - W]

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/2022-gmc-hummer-ev-electric-truck-horsepower-price/