# Suggestions for STM-012?

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#### Screaminhelo

I recently got the Estes bundle 3 and my son decided that I would be building the STM-012 first. As I am building it I am beginning to think that this thing could be a low end MPR rocket and a way to get my feet wet with DD. I am planning on getting a Quark or a Quantum in the near future and figured that I would reach out to the forum for some collective wisdom. Here are my questions:

1. Is this even a good idea? I plan on keeping it as a 24mm rocket, only modifying the mount to butt the aft CR against the aft edge of the fin tabs and possibly adding a screw on retainer. I figure that most of the launches would be BP but the occasional composite E would be a fun adventure with the odd F when we are feeling froggy.

2. My initial plan is to put bulkheads on the coupler and blow the drogue from the bottom half and turn the top half into an avbay (possibly the nose cone). The sled would be removable so that it could be installed for the higher flights and removed for flying a smaller on BP motors.

Those are the only questions that I can think of right now, feel free to add any issues or ideas that I have overlooked.

#### sl98

##### Well-Known Member
I fly a lot of BT-60 size Estes rockets dual deploy using a Quark and 24mm reloads. The Quark is the way to go for this application because of the weight savings for both the altimeter and battery. This is a great way to fly DD.

#### swatkat

##### Down these mean skies, a kat must fly!
You can also turn it into a two stage BP, with very little modding.

#### Screaminhelo

sl98- Would you do this one with an avbay in the upper tube on in the nose cone? Putting the bay in the nose could be beneficial for larger motors but a slide in bay in the upper tube would have less of an adverse effect when flying on BP motors. I'll soon have basic construction finished so that I can do a static balance and a swing test to help me decide.

swatkat- That reminds me of the Rocketarium Maxtormind. I wish I had gotten one before they discontinued it but a similar mod to yours would capture the look quite well.

#### sl98

##### Well-Known Member
sl98- Would you do this one with an avbay in the upper tube on in the nose cone? Putting the bay in the nose could be beneficial for larger motors but a slide in bay in the upper tube would have less of an adverse effect when flying on BP motors. I'll soon have basic construction finished so that I can do a static balance and a swing test to help me decide.
I'm currently helping someone make an AV bay for a STM-012. We are using 4" of coupler and a 2" band. It will look like this one when it it done (this is a BT-60 AV bay I use on several different rockets with a Quark and 1S LiPo)

The bay will go between the upper and lower tubes and will use 3 small push rivets between the upper fin set to hold the AV bay. Simply remove the sled/electronics and put the bulkheads back on to fly motor deploy.

If the band is centered on the coupler then you have 1" of exposed coupler plus the thickness of your bulkhead. The only thing not decided is whether to shift the band up so there is less coupler exposed on the upper section or to trim down the fin tabs.

I operate on the keep it simple, keep it light method for 24mm DD. I used 1/8 light-ply for the outer bulkheads and 3/32 basswood for the inner bulkhead, 4/40 threaded rod, nylon wing nuts that are ground down (to fit in tube) and very light weight eye screws. I drilled a hole and glued a piece of 1/4 dowel for the eye screw. Sled is 3/32 basswood. Avoid the urge to use #8 rod and 1/4-20 eyebolts.

#### cerving

TRF Supporter
I got 3 of them during the recent Estes sale for like $7 each, planning on making a 29mm/24mm 2-stager out of 2 of them (the BT60 tubes with the slots). You could make a MPR out of it if you paper the fins or replace them with light ply, and would recommend getting some coupler stock from BMS and reinforcing everything ahead of the front centering ring with it. Otherwise, it's not going to last very long. While you're at it, get light ply centering rings, too. #### sl98 ##### Well-Known Member I got 3 of them during the recent Estes sale for like$7 each, planning on making a 29mm/24mm 2-stager out of 2 of them (the BT60 tubes with the slots).
Air start 2 stage or BP?

#### Forever_Metal

##### JustAnotherBAR
to be stock or dd?

both sound cool!

fm

#### Screaminhelo

to be stock or dd?

both sound cool!

fm
I agree! The breakdown of the kit is calling me to use it to get my DD feet wet though. There are some rockets out there that I would love to fly but the limitations of my regular field rule them out without going DD. If winds are co-operating, I can do 1k but that is only on one axis. Even doing DD I will have to pay close attention to winds and, will likely, send up a weather bird to verify ground observations.

#### smoon

I got 3 of them during the recent Estes sale for like $7 each, planning on making a 29mm/24mm 2-stager out of 2 of them (the BT60 tubes with the slots). You could make a MPR out of it if you paper the fins or replace them with light ply, and would recommend getting some coupler stock from BMS and reinforcing everything ahead of the front centering ring with it. Otherwise, it's not going to last very long. While you're at it, get light ply centering rings, too. For$7 each, I also bought three of them. My goal is to make a three stage utilizing gap staging for both booster sections. For the $14 for the kit and a half it will take to construct it, if it doesn't work out, I still have the parts to make another, once I analyze what happened. I will be papering the fins and using plywood centering rings on the extended motor mounts for the gap staging. No dual deploy for me. I will be using one of my chute releases instead. Steve #### Screaminhelo ##### Shade Tree Rocket Surgeon For$7 each, I also bought three of them. My goal is to make a three stage utilizing gap staging for both booster sections. For the $14 for the kit and a half it will take to construct it, if it doesn't work out, I still have the parts to make another, once I analyze what happened. I will be papering the fins and using plywood centering rings on the extended motor mounts for the gap staging. No dual deploy for me. I will be using one of my chute releases instead. Steve Good luck! It will.be a bit of a stretch (pun intended) but somebody had to give it a try! Methinks that there will be a few folks here on the boards that will be interested to see if you can get it to work. #### smoon ##### Well-Known Member Good luck! It will.be a bit of a stretch (pun intended) but somebody had to give it a try! Methinks that there will be a few folks here on the boards that will be interested to see if you can get it to work. I will be testing it out in stages (pun also intended ). The sustainer, being about half an STM 012 will likely fly on an 18mm motor for its maiden flight. Then, I will add stages and see if I can make it to three without lawn darting, shredding it, or having it fly away. D12-0 to D12-0 to C6-5 sims to more than 1300 feet. That's pretty high for this poor little guy. Of course, my initial flights will be C11s to a B6, so under 1000 feet, if all goes well. Steve #### swatkat ##### Down these mean skies, a kat must fly! I will be testing it out in stages (pun also intended ). The sustainer, being about half an STM 012 will likely fly on an 18mm motor for its maiden flight. Then, I will add stages and see if I can make it to three without lawn darting, shredding it, or having it fly away. D12-0 to D12-0 to C6-5 sims to more than 1300 feet. That's pretty high for this poor little guy. Of course, my initial flights will be C11s to a B6, so under 1000 feet, if all goes well. Steve I'll be flying a D12-0 to D12-7 on the model pictured above in the thread this weekend. It has the capability to do 24x95's in each stage. I'll put the JL3 in it to get an attitude reading for you. I'm simming it at ~1300 feet. Rocket weight is 6.8 Oz dry. #### Forever_Metal ##### JustAnotherBAR For$7 each, I also bought three of them. My goal is to make a three stage utilizing gap staging for both booster sections. For the \$14 for the kit and a half it will take to construct it, if it doesn't work out, I still have the parts to make another, once I analyze what happened.

I will be papering the fins and using plywood centering rings on the extended motor mounts for the gap staging.

No dual deploy for me. I will be using one of my chute releases instead.

Steve
kinda sorta dual-deploy... Love the JLCR!

fm

#### swatkat

##### Down these mean skies, a kat must fly!
I'll be flying a D12-0 to D12-7 on the model pictured above in the thread this weekend. It has the capability to do 24x95's in each stage. I'll put the JL3 in it to get an attitude reading for you. I'm simming it at ~1300 feet. Rocket weight is 6.8 Oz dry.
It flew just fine, with the wind, it did weathercock quite a bit and my son and I ended up going for a 1/4 mile walk.