Suggestions for building an Estes Executioner Wanted

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grog

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I have an Estes Executioner waiting to be built. However, I already have similar 3FNC mid-power rockets. I'd like to do something different with this kit. I've thought of doing a 3-engine cluster or adding a second stage or attaching 3 parasite gliders to it. Anyone have any good kit-bashing suggestions for this kit? TIA.
 

cjl

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I've seen one fly on a 29mm - great flight to about 1900 feet. That worked well. Another possibility would be twin or even triple 24mm mounts. That would also work well.
 

Elapid

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to fit BT-80 based rockets.
i can select from a single 24mm, to a 14 motor 13mm cluster, or anywhere in between, as well as single 29mm or 38mm.

it uses a thrust ring and a single screw secures the mount.

 

ronhill

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Originally posted by Elapid
to fit BT-80 based rockets.
i can select from a single 24mm, to a 14 motor 13mm cluster, or anywhere in between, as well as single 29mm or 38mm.

it uses a thrust ring and a single screw secures the mount.

I like your series of motor mounts. When you say that it uses a single screw, does that mean a single screw goes horizontally through the main body tube into the motor mount to secure it?

It eliminates through the tube fin mounting, but I like the options your design provides.
 

ronhill

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Originally posted by grog
I have an Estes Executioner waiting to be built. However, I already have similar 3FNC mid-power rockets. I'd like to do something different with this kit. I've thought of doing a 3-engine cluster or adding a second stage or attaching 3 parasite gliders to it. Anyone have any good kit-bashing suggestions for this kit? TIA.
I've flown a three 24mm mount 8 times with the Executioner with either D12-7s or E9-8s. I did add 3 oz of clay to tip of the inside of the nose cone. I've heard others say you don't really need the nose weight, but the margin looked too close to me on RocSim.

I also made the upper body tube a payload bay instead of a single long joined tube.

It's always a beauty in flight. I'm consistently surprised at the high altitude this combination gets. I've only had one engine fail to ignite in the 8 flights. It was a low arcing flight (particularly since it carrying the extended igniter wires along with the unlit engine). But it popped the chute just fine.

Attached is a pic. You can only see two flames in this frame, but all 3 on this flight ignited.
 

Elapid

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the screw goes through the wall of the body tube and into a short section of hardwood dowel that i epoxied into the MMTs.
the fins can still go through the wall, but only *just* through the wall and no farther.

it's great to be able to select a single or dual motor MMT on windy days and load up the BIG ones for those perfect flying days without a breath of wind. The MMT swaps out in about 30 seconds.

I now have 3 models that use this MMT; Super Big Bertha, Fat Boy^2 sustainer section, and the Phoenix. my next Mosquito Upscale (BT-80) will also use this mount. once the modules are assembled, all that is necessary to install in the rockets is a thrust ring and a small hole at the aft end of the BT.
 

ronhill

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Elapid

Good information. Thank you. The screw is an easy solution. A single screw ought to be fine because (with the thrust ring at the forward end), the screw only needs to keep the motor mount from going aft during ejection.

I guess you have to be careful with the "just through the wall" technique. Never tried it. You can't get any adhesive on the inside of the body tube or the modular motor mount won't slide through.

The best part of your technique is that all of your modular mounts work with all of your BT-80 rockets.
 

Elapid

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then trimmed away the inside parts of the fins with a section of hacksaw blade. a bit of sandpaper smoothed it out plenty. no need to worry too much about excess glue, just make sure the MMT slides in and out fairly easily.

another nice thing is that if you use too much tape for retention, you can remove the mount and push the motor(s) out from the forward end.
 

Skye

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I have built a Executioner that uses 4 24 mm motors it is a new motor mount kit from Fliskits works great.

Thanks Fliskits Jim works great!!!!!!
 

ronhill

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Originally posted by Skye
I have built a Executioner that uses 4 24 mm motors it is a new motor mount kit from Fliskits works great.

Thanks Jim
Jim,

Just curious. Have you flown the 4-engine cluster yet? If so, did you have to put nose weight in yours? If you didn't have to put in nose weight, I'm going to pull the 3 oz. of clay out of mine.

BTW: Sharp looking rocket.

Ron
 

ronhill

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Originally posted by Skye
Rock Sim said to add 4 oz to the nose!!
Then the 3 oz. in the nose of my 3-engine cluster is about right. It still gets up pretty high. I'm sure yours will do great with both D12s and E9s.
 

I'd suggest going with a 29MM mount. I have an Executioner in 29MM, and I just love it! The mods to the stock Estes kit for 29MM were few. I took 3 sets of stock Estes centering rings, and glued them in pairs to each side of a 1/8" sheet of balsa, and cut them out. This created a strong, but really light "composite" centering ring.

I used 3 rings in all, installing the rear ring after adding some internal epoxy fillets to the stock fins, with wood-glue fillets on the outside. The only other mods were a longer 3/8" elastic shock cord with a LOC-type mount, and a 24" nylon 'chute. (I did not add any noseweight) The result is a rocket that is barely heavier than the stock Estes rocket. I have flown it on several reloads in the 29/40-120 case, including the G-64. (~2000ft on that one) I have also flown it on E-30's and G-80's....great flights everytime.
 

ronhill

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Joe,

I guess that puts to bed the comments that the body tube of the Executioner is too weak. You've put it through some stressful flights, and it did well. Encourages me to build the next one with a 29 mm mount.

BTW: Superb looking rocket.

Ron
 

Stymye

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it the landing stress that will eventually crimp it above the fins
I have seen a number of them crimp that way at launches.. but it can go far on a bigger chute because it's so light so
I plan to beef up my next one with some simple internal spars
 

grog

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I appreciate all the suggestions. Lots of good ideas out there and some neat modifications folks have made to Executioners. I have decided to add a second stage to mine. I've also decided to build an Estes Shadow I have with a 4 engine cluster. I thought I would try reinforcing the balsa fins by laminating them with some card stock. Has anyone done something like that before with balsa fins? Thanks.
 

powderburner

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grog,

I don't want this to sound abrupt or rude or anything, but just want to tip you that a WHOLE lot of advice has already been posted on laminating fins.

Go to the top of the TRF page and click on the 'Search' button. Use some keywords like laminating, balsa, paper (you get the idea) and you will have enough reading material for a month.

My favorite way to laminate is to sand the fin first (and we ALL sand the leading edge round, don't we?), fold a piece of paper to fit around the fin leading edge, wipe both sides of the fin with watered-down Elmers, and slip the paper onto both sides (I leave the paper cut oversize so it extends beyond the tip, root, and trailing edge). Sandwich it in some waxed paper and place under a pile of phone books or magazines for a day. Then pull it out, trim the excess paper with an X-acto, scuff sand the paper (so the primer will stick) and proceed with assembly.
 

r1dermon

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38mm executioner sounds NIIIIIICE hmmmm I357 anyone?
 

grog

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Thanks for the suggestion. You are right--lots of info already there about laminating fins. I didn't even think about trying a search before. There are probably more features of this forum I need to learn.
 

Bowhunter

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Originally posted by r1dermon
38mm executioner sounds NIIIIIICE hmmmm I357 anyone?
Glass it and an I357? I like the sound of that, HP estes I love it
 

Originally posted by grog
I appreciate all the suggestions. Lots of good ideas out there and some neat modifications folks have made to Executioners. I have decided to add a second stage to mine. I've also decided to build an Estes Shadow I have with a 4 engine cluster. I thought I would try reinforcing the balsa fins by laminating them with some card stock. Has anyone done something like that before with balsa fins? Thanks.
I've lam'ed fins with cardstock before. It gives you a nice, strong fin without much weight penalty. For what you're planning, I'd suggest 1/8" ply fins with TTW mounting.

I have an unbuilt Estes Shadow as well. I'm planning on building a clone of it with HPR materials, 38MM and dual-deploy. It ought to make a nice lightweight rocket that can fly on a wide varitey of motors. That's the goal anyhow.

P.S. I have scans of the Estes Shadow kit if anyone wants to build a clone.
:D
 

grog

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I finally completed my Estes Executioner as a 2-stage rocket. I thought that the Executioner had an appearance similar to the upper stage of the old Estes Farside. So, I made the first stage like that of the Farside and painted the rocket like that in the 1971 Estes catalog. I've attached a photo. Haven't had a chance to launch it yet.
 

grog

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Wow!. That's a nice job on your Executioner. I like the cluster/staging scheme.

I finally had a chance to launch my 2-stage Executioner yesterday. I used a D12-0/E9-4 combo. Had a great flight. I've attached a launch photo taken by Dave Virga.
 

melvyn

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Originally posted by Bowhunter
Glass it and an I357? I like the sound of that, HP estes I love it
Ahem... I'm building my Executioner to take a 29-180 motor casing... :D

Might just fly it with an H165R for my level 1 cert attempt. :cool:
 
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