### Help Support The Rocketry Forum:

#### edwardw

##### Well-Known Member
Hey All,

After reading the "Home Come No Certified Sugar Motors" it has inspired me and one of my rocketry buds to look into it more seriously.

We currently are thinking about two options:

Manufacture our own casings and sell reloads for them

OR

Use existing Aerotech Hardware and make reloads.

For the first option:

We would create a line of casings and reloads ranging from G-I to start with. They would start out in the EX class and if we had enough response we might try and get them certified.

If we used Aerotech hardware we would also have them in the EX class of reloads. We also know that this would invalidate warranties from Aerotech, but most expire after a year.

I just wanted opinions and what people thought about the idea.

Edward

#### MarkABrown

##### Well-Known Member
Well, if they were EX class motors, only you would be able to fly them at TRA sanctioned launches. Only the manufacturer of the propellant is allowed to fly EX motors. You may have problems getting your venture off the ground if you have to depend on non-affiliated launches.

#### n3tjm

##### Papa Elf
First things first... You need to get all permits, insurances, and equipment required to manufacture the rocket motors. Then you would need to get DOT EX numbers for each formulation of propellant, and then get them certified. I seriously doubt Sugar Motors would pass the DOT testing, so the $50K to$100K you spend gettig a legal company going may not be worth it to manufacture motors that are prone to so many problems.

#### rstaff3

##### Oddroc-eteer
I don't see why a sugar motor reload wouldn't be able to get an EX number. I may be incorrect, but I thought DOT tests ony catagorized the material as to its composition and hazardous properties, and they assigned the proper shipping status. I wouldn't think that the properties that make the sugar motors less desireable for us would affect the DOT process.

Like I said this is just the impression I have formed. I may be ignerint, but I kan lern.

PS Even if I'm correct, the other points brought up by Mark and N3TJM are still valid.

#### n3tjm

##### Papa Elf
They would not survive the shock test... and they will show a sensitivity to moisture. Now we know that won't cause it to auto-ignite or anything... but they have to test that to prove it... more $out of your pocket because each test costs$1000's of dollars.

#### rstaff3

##### Oddroc-eteer
I would think the shock test is intended to see if the material explodes, burns, etc. Would they really care if the grain cracked? They are testing for shipping safety. I would also doubt that it would matter if the material absorbs moisture unless it made its properties worse.

Good Luck!

#### MarkABrown

##### Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Johnnierkt
So I'm on this Atkins diet see, cause I'm a chunk, and I get to looking at the ingrediants to a low carb Chocolat bar I ate last night, and I notice the one of the ingrediants: Mannitol...
LOL

#### wyldbill

##### Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Johnnierkt
So I'm on this Atkins diet see, cause I'm a chunk, and I get to looking at the ingrediants to a low carb Chocolat bar I ate last night, and I notice the one of the ingrediants: Mannitol...
... a member of the Sorbitol family of polyol substitute sweeteners...SWEET!!
Another interesting fact about the sugar alcohols is that they're laxatives, Be careful how many you eat or the skidmark won't just be in your motormount...

#### Johnnie

##### Well-Known Member
Lurking cynic...dude thats wrong...bacon strips (skid marks) or not, my alcohol sugar motors move cleanly...

seriously though...non-hygroscopic!, and if it were as powerful as Sorbitol, half the battle might be over as far as keeping dry. Too expensive right now.

#### AZ_Ron

##### Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Johnnierkt
The propellant is ladden with Titanium flakes for sparks (Ti)
Hey Guys...just chiming in with a minor correction... the Titanium Norman Egolf and Kevin Patterson are using are lathe turnings, not flakes, although Norm grinds his up quite a bit before adding them to the propellant. Kevin uses them pretty much straight from the bag, although they have to be degreased to get all of the machining oil off of them.
Here's a pic of a rocket that I flew on one of Norms Sparky motors at the February XRAA launch...Here's the rocket...Me on the left, Norm on the right...

Ron

#### AZ_Ron

##### Well-Known Member
Here's the liftoff shot... a little slow, but you get the gist...

BTW, Norm sells titanium... there's an ad for it on the "For Sale" page of the AHPRA website... www.ahpra.org