Spray can finnishes

[slackdaddy]

Does any one know of compatibility issues with Spray can finnishes?

Heres what i have on hand, and want to use:

Primers,
Deft lacquer sanding sealer
Kilz spray primer

Color coats:
Spray can enamals (dupli Kolar, America's finist, Rustoluem)

Top coat;
Dupli color crystal clear enamal

I guess My 2 main questions are:

1) Is Lacquer and enamal spray paint compatible ?

2) What is a good clear coat that is compatible with enamal
spray paint, that is decal safe ?

Thanks,

Nick

 

[Stymye]

this may help some , from EMRR

https://www.rocketreviews.com/tool_compatibility_box.shtml

 

[Micromeister]

Slack:
Ken's compatablity chart will give you an overview of what can and can't be mixed.
If you'd like to go into the subject deeper, might I suggest a visit to narhams.org check out the Tech-Tips area in the Library section. Tips (actually articles) 002,003,004 & 005 will take you from bare tube or wood to finished model.
hope this helps a little.

 

[DynaSoar]

Originally posted by slackdaddy
I guess My 2 main questions are:

1) Is Lacquer and enamal spray paint compatible ?

2) What is a good clear coat that is compatible with enamal
spray paint, that is decal safe ?

As Micromeister said eslewhere, enamel over lacquer, OK
Lacquer over enamel, not OK.

For clear coat, I suggest acrylic. Two ways, similar base material, different carriers/additions:

Future floor polish: cheap, easy to wipe on, doesn't stink so you can do it inside. However, it can yellow with age, and it's a little waxy, meaning it can collect scratches. It can be removed with ammonia, and recoated.

Minwax Polycrylic. Expensive in a spray can. Costs a lot on a larger, wipe-on can, but far more economical. Stinky, especially in spray. Tougher than Future -- the surface is harder and resists scratches better. This stuff dulls the surface of metal paints the least of anything I've found. The result is a harder plastic than Future. If it ever needs recoating, no need to remove the previous. The spray has far more stinky stuff than the can. A pump sprayer might be able to be used; I haven't tried that yet.

 

[Stymye]

From what I've gathered,there is no solid evidence that future yellows.

I had a yellowed nike smoke that was coated with future ,when I removed the future I found the the white undercoat had yellowed rather than the future.
It may be that the future accelerates the yellowing of the undercolors, I'm not sure

 

[slackdaddy]

Dyna,
I have found Clear in enamal (RustOleum, Dupla color)

Since all My Color coats are Enamal, I will try Enamal Clear coat ?

Slack

 

[Micromeister]

Originally posted by stymye
From what I've gathered,there is no solid evidence that future yellows.

I had a yellowed nike smoke that was coated with future ,when I removed the future I found the the white undercoat had yellowed rather than the future.
It may be that the future accelerates the yellowing of the undercolors, I'm not sure

Guys:
Man it's hard to get folks to remember things... Yes Future acrylic floor finish, which says it doesn't yellow in fact does. OVER about 2 years of age...However it will stay clear longer than any other Clear spray product on the market. I'm not pushing Future, nor am I recommending anyone use one Clear Coat over another....THEY ALL YELLOW OVER TIME.
As you mentioned all white spray paints also yellow (its actually the titanium powder oxidizing) within about 5 years. unless you overcoat with a High UV additive clear all your White models will yellow...the more you expose it to the sun the quicker it will yellow. I haven't clear coated anything in years. Future and Nu-Finish auto polish are all I use to protect my models from UV and the certain yellowing that will someday befall every White rocket. There is no clear coat on the 4xA cluster alt. model below just Krylon white and NU-Finish. Slick as snake snot and gleams like a gem. I simply do not understand the need for clearcoating?
Hope this helps

 

[BobH48]

Originally posted by Micromeister
I simply do not understand the need for clearcoating?

The only thing I use clear coat for is Inkjet Decals before applying and Cardstock paper models to protect the ink from running.

I use Future over decals after they are on the models. I haven't tried the Nu-Finish auto polish mainly because I don't happen to have any and I have a whole bottle of Future.

 

[Micromeister]

I'm with ya there Bob; guess ya have to qualify statments like that. I really ment clear coating the completed model as if the clear will protect it.
I use matte clear to seal edges of multi-color maskings, seal Alps and inkjet decals before cutting and applying. and sometimes as a sanding barrier between multi-color coats on scale models. As Bob mentioned I too use Matte clear and Krylon workable Fixatif #1306 on all paper and cardstock models. Only once in a blue moon do I use Testors gloss clear or any type or manufacturer's spray on gloss clear. Heres a good example of Krylon Gloss clear on a paper model, this Point looked exactly like its full size counterpart until I gloss clear coated it... Had I used matte clear or dull coat it would not have the semi-transparent look it now has.
Every once in awhile you'll need to make your decals gloss, this can be done better with Microscale decal clear brush on. If you absolutely have to they can be overcoated with gloss clear if applied in very very thin coats never wetting the decal surface. Regardless of manufacturer, brand, or vehicle/thinners/pigment formula, every time one applies spary on clear we are jeopardizing all the hard work done on the models painted finish. The only exception I've seen anywhere is automotive 3 part polyurtheane topcoat/clearcoat systems, which are not available in areosol spray cans. All this to say....
CLEAR COAT AT YOUR OWN RISK! I'd be willing to bet every single one of us as ruined several model finishes applying clear at one point or another....Is it really worth the risk?

OBTW if you think clear is protecting your decals..think again. Clear coats become very brittle in short order with exposure to UV indoor and outdoor, a bump, hard landing or just rubbing against another model in the trunk will takeoff the clear and your decals with it pronto.
Hope this helps.

 

[Stymye]

Micro I see your point ,,but how do you achieve a scale model flat finish with nu-finish or future?

 

[RicardoD]

Micromeister,

What's the decision process on using Future or Nu-Finish?

 

[Micromeister]

Originally posted by stymye
Micro I see your point ,,but how do you achieve a scale model flat finish with nu-finish or future?

I don't stymye:
Matte and dead flat paints help, then there is matte workable fixatif #1306, I've mentioned it before but I'll plug it again here... Krylon workable Fixatif #1306 is a clear coating intended for applicaton over pastels, charcoals and chalks. Works great over most other media also. Testors dull coat is great on Scale models that require a matte finish. Nearly all Matte or satin finish Clears can work over DRY enamel brushed or sprayed paints as long as we observe the cautions posted perviously. Never allow clear overcoats to wet the surface of the model.
Flattening agents from talc to silica sand convert most gloss finishes onto semi-gloss to dead flat depending on the amount of agent added. All these additives help to break up the surface overlapping platlets that form the dryed film. all these micro holes in that drying film allow the solvents, thinners and other nasties to evaporate (flash) out of the film much quicker than gloss products, thereby eliminating much of the solvent contact time with your fresh color coats.

Another way I "matte" the finish on Scale models is wet sanding with fine Scotchbright (grey) pads and water. This method alone will take a completely gloss finish to satin in short order without hurting a properly finished model.
Painting and finishing are the most time consuming parts of modeling. All the intricate detail in the world won't hide or make up for a crudy paint job and/or finial finishing. Scotchbright wet sanding completed the finishing on my Mercury-Atlas scratch build after its first less then stellar entry in an ECRM regional loosing many points for the shinny white "frost" that should have been matte without ruining the Silver below. It fared much better several years later at a Naram after matting the "frost"
OBTW silvers should always be applied last.
Hope this helps.

 

[Micromeister]

Originally posted by RicardoD
Micromeister,

What's the decision process on using Future or Nu-Finish?

Honestly; it's which ever I'm closest to at the time Future seems to leave the surface tacky for several days. Nu-finish wiill remove the paint if it hasn't been allowed to dry completely. 3M Finessit-II will remove the worst orange-peel from any model with enough time and elbow-grease. but will also remove a lot of paint in the process.
Finishing takes time and can't be rushed. Good finishing takes planning, thought and practice, practice, and more practice. Getting a babies butt smooth finish, exactly the color combinations we're looking for, or complex combinations of matte, gloss and textured finishes on the same model can run into 10's or as much as 100 hours. Some folks don't think these kinds of finishes are worth the time. It's all in what your trying to do. But if you spend all that time finishing a model..for goodness sake FlY it! otherwise it's just a dust collector!