Software as a Service

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While I largely agree with many of the SaaS concerns posted here, I'd like to offer an alternative perspective that may apply to some situations.

I'm actually onboard with Office365 these days. Note, I use it as installed on my PC and not solely through the webapp. While I've long preferred the full license, lasts forever approach, the SaaS implementation works well for my family. I've got 4 people that need to use the software across at last count 7 machines. Individual licenses for each of those PCs would be expensive and frankly I'd have to maintain all that and deal with the need to move from one PC to the next every now and then. As I've got it now, my single $99/year subscription covers I think up to 5 people on as many PCs as they need to use. And we all have it installed, so we aren't dependent on connectivity and we are immune to the web outages like were reported earlier in this thread. None of us really use the paired OneDrive; we just save files locally. Works well, is easy to maintain, and is cost effective.

Similarly I have some paid Android apps that I use a fair amount that are subscription services. I've had plenty of apps where the designer makes it a one time fee, then a year realizes their business model doesn't work and the app goes away. A reasonably priced subscription-based app that does something I want, and lasts since it has a functional business model, is better than a pay-once app that then dies when the developer stops working on it.

So, my point being, SaaS isn't ALL bad.
Yeah, but between a that and everybody wanting a subscription fee (or continue putting up with ads) it feels like death by 1000 small cuts. You keep trying to minimize the impact, and no, I don't want everything for free, but it all just seems too much for me. Everybody and their uncle Pete either billing you or (worse) hooked in to you bank account and debiting it when they get ready.
 
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Do you mean every call -can- be recorded in an IP phone system? Because they certainly aren't all recorded in general.
Yes every call on every major ip hosted system IS recorded. If you belive them when they say they are not, I will assume you also trust Google, Meta, Microsoft, ....
 
Yes every call on every major ip hosted system IS recorded. If you belive them when they say they are not, I will assume you also trust Google, Meta, Microsoft, ....
Did you also know that Ring records your device even if you arnt paying the monthly fee.. They have shared that info with police when an investigation warrants it.. Thats not necessarily a bad thing. But creepy and open to abuse.
 
Records the call, or records the metadata from the call?
Both. The Metadata in the telecom world would be call records (this could be simple SMDR detailing when off hook, how long, incoming or outgoing, number dialed, etc), trace logs (mostly used for trouble shooting but also can be used to spy on a user or company) and wire shark (mostly used for troubleshooting network issues). That data combined with recordings can tell me a whole lot most company's wouldn't want out there.
 
Are you referring to central providers?

Because the office phone systems used in small to medium sized businesses, college campuses, etc absolutely do not universally record calls. Again, I'm not suggesting that they're incapable of doing so. But of the systems I've interacted with over the last twenty years, none of them had call recording configured.
 
Are you referring to central providers?

Because the office phone systems used in small to medium sized businesses, college campuses, etc absolutely do not universally record calls. Again, I'm not suggesting that they're incapable of doing so. But of the systems I've interacted with over the last twenty years, none of them had call recording configured.
If they have an on site VOIP appliance or IPBX they have that control. They also have that control on hosted VOIP. However, on hosted VOIP all the control is with the provider. Sure they will tell you its not being stored, saved or looked at. Unfortunately money talks. If they can make a dime off selling information they can and will. Also the problem of unscrupulous employees making a side hustle.
 
If they have an on site VOIP appliance or IPBX they have that control. They also have that control on hosted VOIP. However, on hosted VOIP all the control is with the provider. Sure they will tell you its not being stored, saved or looked at. Unfortunately money talks. If they can make a dime off selling information they can and will. Also the problem of unscrupulous employees making a side hustle.
Okay, thanks for the clarification. So that circles us back to the original statement you made that ALL voip calls were being recorded.

At -every single place I've done work in the last twenty years- this was not happening. We didn't configure it to happen. Didn't have the storage to do so. The manpower to administer such a system, or the infrastructure in place to in any way handle doing so.

Yes, VOIP calls can certainly be recorded. But implying that all calls going across such a system are recorded is simply false.
 
Getting back to the titular subject, I just bought a license key for Ham Radio Deluxe and it has possibly the most sensible licensing structure I’ve ever seen, something that encourages development on their part but is completely under my control.
The price I paid (retail ≈ $100 - I paid $75) gets me a perpetual license, including customer service, for all the features at the time of purchase or introduced within the next year.
I can pay $49/year for upgrades if I want (-40% if I sign up for auto renew) but I don’t have to. I can leave the maintenance program for years or decades and rejoin at any time by paying $49 which gets me back on maintenance for the next year.
 
Getting back to the titular subject, I just bought a license key for Ham Radio Deluxe and it has possibly the most sensible licensing structure I’ve ever seen, something that encourages development on their part but is completely under my control.
The price I paid (retail ≈ $100 - I paid $75) gets me a perpetual license, including customer service, for all the features at the time of purchase or introduced within the next year.
I can pay $49/year for upgrades if I want (-40% if I sign up for auto renew) but I don’t have to. I can leave the maintenance program for years or decades and rejoin at any time by paying $49 which gets me back on maintenance for the next year.

I've been an HRD guy since before the current owner took the software over. The new owner is SHARP, and it has taken him a while to get the ship righted and headed in the direction he wants it to go, but he's got it humming now.

HRD is the hub software of my shack and holds my logbook in its entirety (backed up of course). It integrates with my K3s rig control software and pretty much everything else.

I cannot say enough things about it... I haven't keyed a mic in 2 years or so, but I send the $49 each year like clockwork.... I support HRD fully!
 
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Okay, thanks for the clarification. So that circles us back to the original statement you made that ALL voip calls were being recorded.

At -every single place I've done work in the last twenty years- this was not happening. We didn't configure it to happen. Didn't have the storage to do so. The manpower to administer such a system, or the infrastructure in place to in any way handle doing so.

Yes, VOIP calls can certainly be recorded. But implying that all calls going across such a system are recorded is simply false.
I think what I said was “If you have an IP hosted phone system every call you make is recorded.” I did not say VOIP itself is automatically recorded. And if your equipment is “onsite” not cloud based you have total control over security. I know I sound like an old white guy. That’s because I am an old white guy.

You aint paranoid if they are really after you. 😊
 
I've been an HRD guy since before the current owner took the software over. The new owner is SHARP, and it has taken him a while to get the ship righted and headed in the direction he wants it to go, but he's got it humming now.

HRD is the hub software of my shack and holds my logbook in its entirety (backed up of course). It integrates with my K3s rig control software and pretty much everything else.

I cannot say enough things about it... I haven't keyed a mic in 2 years or so, but I send the $49 each year like clockwork.... I support HRD fully!
I also like to support software companies that are not trying to suck more money out of me. I could have upgraded my Rocksim for free per Apogee's rules. I did that long time ago from an earlier version. The office staff. I forget her name. Actually contacted me and refunded my upgrade. This last time. Again I could have upgraded to 10 for free. But I chose to purchase full copy of Rocksim 10 and received another license key. Love Rocksim. I hope they dont try to refund me again. :)
 
I've been an HRD guy since before the current owner took the software over. The new owner is SHARP, and it has taken him a while to get the ship righted and headed in the direction he wants it to go, but he's got it humming now.

HRD is the hub software of my shack and holds my logbook in its entirety (backed up of course). It integrates with my K3s rig control software and pretty much everything else.

I cannot say enough things about it... I haven't keyed a mic in 2 years or so, but I send the $49 each year like clockwork.... I support HRD fully!
Dr. Mike mentioned on a video chat a few months ago that if you sign up for automatic renewal, you get a 40% discount on that $49 annual charge, if that works for you.
 
THAT right there..... Crap like that has been happening since at least Win7.... Makes me angry when Microsoft INFLICTS their "help" on me without asking.

I am perfectly capable and willing to do ALL of my own security and data storage/security...
And if I want Microsoft's help, I'll ask for it.

I'm actually onboard with Office365 these days. Note, I use it as installed on my PC and not solely through the webapp. While I've long preferred the full license, lasts forever approach, the SaaS implementation works well for my family. I've got 4 people that need to use the software across at last count 7 machines. Individual licenses for each of those PCs would be expensive and frankly I'd have to maintain all that and deal with the need to move from one PC to the next every now and then. As I've got it now, my single $99/year subscription covers I think up to 5 people on as many PCs as they need to use. And we all have it installed, so we aren't dependent on connectivity and we are immune to the web outages like were reported earlier in this thread. None of us really use the paired OneDrive; we just save files locally. Works well, is easy to maintain, and is cost effective.

Similarly I have some paid Android apps that I use a fair amount that are subscription services. I've had plenty of apps where the designer makes it a one time fee, then a year realizes their business model doesn't work and the app goes away. A reasonably priced subscription-based app that does something I want, and lasts since it has a functional business model, is better than a pay-once app that then dies when the developer stops working on it.
That's a nice segue into why I've come back to this thread. A new thought just came to me.

The industry has sold us a lie. There is no subscription software that I'm aware of. You're $99/year for Office isn't a subscription, it's a rental. The rental includes a subscription to maintenance and feature upgrades, but there is still a key difference from a subscription: if you stop paying, you lose it.

When I subscribe to a magazine and then stop my subscription, I can keep reading all the issues I've received thus far, because I've bought those issues. Not so with so-called subscription software, where if you don't keep paying they take it away. That's renting, not subscribing.

My knee-jerk reaction is that I will never willingly submit to rental software. Your post quoted above has made me rethink, there could be reasons for it which are compelling and sufficient to get me to go that route, but those would be few and far between.
 
And if I want Microsoft's help, I'll ask for it.

My knee-jerk reaction is that I will never willingly submit to rental software. Your post quoted above has made me rethink, there could be reasons for it which are compelling and sufficient to get me to go that route, but those would be few and far between.
Generally, my opinion.

I have been able to function as a business owner with ZERO MSOffice products at my facility (5 PC's, 3 persons putting out quotes, one financial terminal) since 2010. We will occasionally find some word file with nested attachments (for what purpose, other than making compression hell, I don't know), and we may have to download a viewer, but, owning MSOffice is not a requirement to view MSOffice files, despite how often MS dicks with configurations that seem to have the sole purpose of making cross-usage of a word-processed file difficult.

The only reasons I still have Windows on my PC are because of AutoCAD, and a structural design package (Enercalc), but those reasons are fading, rapidly.

I need a work PC to do work stuff. I don't need all the App BS where MS is trying to make PC's more phone/tablet-like (not that this is related, just a rant).
 
something I noticed the other day:

My work PC M$ office outlook now has a 'webstore' icon. Why? This is my work PC. I am at work. I cannot access this, and any potential "wants" has to go thru IT & my supervisor.. so why have this enabled?!?

Oh, and my home PC 'doesn't meet the criteria for 'Window 11'
SO, another fully functioning PC will soon head to the trash heap due to "forced upgrades"
 
something I noticed the other day:

My work PC M$ office outlook now has a 'webstore' icon. Why? This is my work PC. I am at work. I cannot access this, and any potential "wants" has to go thru IT & my supervisor.. so why have this enabled?!?

Oh, and my home PC 'doesn't meet the criteria for 'Window 11'
SO, another fully functioning PC will soon head to the trash heap due to "forced upgrades"
As far as the home PC and Windows 11 - if you actually want to get 11 on it, there are workarounds to do so. Definitely doesn't need to be tossed just to get the newer OS.
 
something I noticed the other day:

My work PC M$ office outlook now has a 'webstore' icon. Why? This is my work PC. I am at work. I cannot access this, and any potential "wants" has to go thru IT & my supervisor.. so why have this enabled?!?

Oh, and my home PC 'doesn't meet the criteria for 'Window 11'
SO, another fully functioning PC will soon head to the trash heap due to "forced upgrades"

https://linuxmint.com/
You're welcome.
 
something I noticed the other day:

My work PC M$ office outlook now has a 'webstore' icon. Why? This is my work PC. I am at work. I cannot access this, and any potential "wants" has to go thru IT & my supervisor.. so why have this enabled?!?

Oh, and my home PC 'doesn't meet the criteria for 'Window 11'
SO, another fully functioning PC will soon head to the trash heap due to "forced upgrades"

Preach on.
 
As far as the home PC and Windows 11 - if you actually want to get 11 on it, there are workarounds to do so. Definitely doesn't need to be tossed just to get the newer OS.
Best to be sure that you actually want Windows 11. My new PC came with Win11 and every day I wish I could go back to Win10. The new machine has a (supposed) faster processor, twice the RAM, twice the SSD space of my 3-year-old Win10 machine. The Win10 machine is still faster at routine tasks. Not to mention some of the 'features' of Win11 and of the newer version of Office.

Lots of little annoyances. I like having the menu-bar (or ribbon or whatever it's called) at the right side of the screen. Win11 omitted that option. Then there's the implicit assumption that you'll want to use The Cloud for everything---I don't want to use The Cloud for ANYthing. But that's just me.

Okay, rant over.
 
Then there's the implicit assumption that you'll want to use The Cloud for everything---I don't want to use The Cloud for ANYthing. But that's just me.
Not just you. I have no interest in storing my personal digital files on Someone Else's computer. If I need to transfer files from machine to machine, I have some thumb drives that are perfectly adequate to the task.
 
Then there's the implicit assumption that you'll want to use The Cloud for everything---I don't want to use The Cloud for ANYthing. But that's just me.

Not just you. I have no interest in storing my personal digital files on Someone Else's computer. If I need to transfer files from machine to machine, I have some thumb drives that are perfectly adequate to the task.

Agreed!

To be fair, I do use Google Drive to sync some things between computers/phones that I use, but the cloud is never my primary location for any file I care about.

Some time ago, it seems MS has made "autosave" of edits while using Word or whatnot only applicable to autosaving to the MS OneDrive cloud. This was a d#ck move if I ever saw one. My wife lost some work because she thought it was autosaving, one time. Nowadays, software designers (for MS at least) seem to want you to think you are doing something wrong if you are saving anything anywhere except for OneDrive, while paying them for the privilege.
 
Agreed!

To be fair, I do use Google Drive to sync some things between computers/phones that I use, but the cloud is never my primary location for any file I care about.

Some time ago, it seems MS has made "autosave" of edits while using Word or whatnot only applicable to autosaving to the MS OneDrive cloud. This was a d#ck move if I ever saw one. My wife lost some work because she thought it was autosaving, one time. Nowadays, software designers (for MS at least) seem to want you to think you are doing something wrong if you are saving anything anywhere except for OneDrive, while paying them for the privilege.
That's what ticks me off, the constant pushing of this "free" storage in "the cloud". As noted above, the "Cloud" is merely someone else's computer. Very irritating. I'm considering an Network Attached Storage device for here at home so we can have access to pictures, etc, across the few devices that we have. But I'm not super-good at building machines; I have this box that's badly due for an upgrade. @prfesser, thanks for the warning on "Windoze" 11.
 
But I'm not super-good at building machines; I have this box that's badly due for an upgrade.
I built my VR gaming rig in 2019 with the help of this website. It will tell you what's compatible with what and even provide links to where you can buy each part.

https://pcpartpicker.com/
 
I built my VR gaming rig in 2019 with the help of this website. It will tell you what's compatible with what and even provide links to where you can buy each part.

https://pcpartpicker.com/
Much thanks! 👌🤓👍

Microsoft used to ask "Where do you want to go today?" Today it's more "This is where we want you to go today."
Exactly! :mad: I knew the end was on the way when I saw the Registry debut in Windows 95...
 
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