# So I built a motor that works perfectly - except for one tiny thing......

### Help Support The Rocketry Forum:

##### I don't do spirals
TRF Supporter
I90 - Full "I" motor. Works perfectly, except it gets too hot to put in a rocket. Guess I should have thought of that.

Any suggestions? Or did I just waste a ton of brain power & money on some pretty fireworks?

#### eggplant

##### L3 | NAR 93664, TRA 17791
Wait, how did you get the thrust curve here? I don't see how the test stand is instrumented. I'm interested to hear about the grain geometry and propellant formula, so you should make a post on the research section where this discussion is allowed. I'm sure others are curious too and you could get better advice there.

#### 3stoogesrocketry

##### Well-Known Member
Wait, how did you get the thrust curve here? I don't see how the test stand is instrumented. I'm interested to hear about the grain geometry and propellant formula, so you should make a post on the research section where this discussion is allowed. I'm sure others are curious too and you could get better advice there.

I for one would like to see / hear more of this . A fuel with a 5ips burn rate ..... Wow I'm hooked.

Last edited:

Phenolic liner

#### timbucktoo

##### Well-Known Member
Staff member
TRF Supporter
Global Mod
You’ll get more responses if you post this in research forum. I sent you a PM with instructions for access.

#### Michael Wilson

##### Well-Known Member
OP, where did this go? fix thermal problems? Maybe any videos? This seems like a fairly cool motor.

##### I don't do spirals
TRF Supporter
I have it all fixed, I want to get it certified - will post vids asap

#### G_T

##### Well-Known Member
Getting it certified will be a challange. If you are not a manufacturer, or don't intend to go into manufacturing, I don't think the motor will be considered for certification.

If you are going to become a manufacturer (as in, you have already started your company, have all the paperwork for working with the chems and doing this sort of work in your county etc) then you can submit it for certification.

When you say too hot, NFPA 1127 I think has some requirements on max casing temperature. This includes the after-burn heat soak. It's been a few years since I've read it. Anyway, the Research forum is where you want to be posting.

Gerald

##### I don't do spirals
TRF Supporter
Getting it certified will be a challange. If you are not a manufacturer, or don't intend to go into manufacturing, I don't think the motor will be considered for certification.

If you are going to become a manufacturer (as in, you have already started your company, have all the paperwork for working with the chems and doing this sort of work in your county etc) then you can submit it for certification.

When you say too hot, NFPA 1127 I think has some requirements on max casing temperature. This includes the after-burn heat soak. It's been a few years since I've read it. Anyway, the Research forum is where you want to be posting.

Gerald
Thank you, Sir.

#### icyclops

##### Well-Known Member
Anyone know about how much it costs to certify a motor? Just curious if anyone here has gone through that process and the cost.

#### AeroTech

Anyone know about how much it costs to certify a motor? Just curious if anyone here has gone through that process and the cost.
The cost from the certifying organization is a very minor expense...like $50 per motor type from the NAR, and I’m not sure what TRA charges, possibly a deposit to cover the cost of replacement of a load cell if a motor damages it. Then there is the cost of the motor samples themselves, which depends on the type of motor being certified, and whether they have pyrotechnic time delays. The major cost in motor certification is obtaining the DOT shipping approval, which can be in excess of$25,000 depending on which DOT-approved testing lab you use.

There are other costs in producing commercial motors of course, like the costs associated with compliance with DHS regulations, products liability insurance and compliance with local and state fire codes, but those are not part of certification expense.

Last edited:

#### icyclops

##### Well-Known Member
I see, thank you for the answer.

#### AeroTech

Also, if you are planning to sell motors in California, they require around $2,000 in annual manufacturer/importer licenses (about$1,500 for high-power and $500 for model rocket) and$50 per motor type for classification and approval.

##### I don't do spirals
TRF Supporter
There is a facility requirement for the manufacturing license as well, isn't there? That is what shut me off to the idea. You can't build in your garage these days.

I already build these in a dedicated facility

If I started building motors as well, the neighbors will start to worry....

Last edited:

#### Steve Shannon

##### Well-Known Member
TRF Supporter
There is a facility requirement for the manufacturing license as well, isn't there? That is what shut me off to the idea. You can't build in your garage these days.

I already build these in a dedicated facility
View attachment 453409

If I started building motors as well, the neighbors will start to worry....
There’s this from NFPA 1125:
4.1.2 The manufacture of any rocket motor shall be prohibited in any residence or dwelling, or in any inhabited building in an area zoned as residential by the local building authority and building codes in effect.
4.1.3 The manufacturer of any rocket motor shall be in compliance with 29 CFR 1910.119.
4.2 Permit Requirements.
4.2.1 Any person engaged in the manufacture of rocket motors, motor-reloading kits, or pyrotechnic modules shall possess a federal license or permit, as required by 18 USC Chapter 40 Title XI, Regulation of Explosives, of the Crime Control Act of 1970 and shall comply with all applicable state and local laws and regulations.

There are other related requirements in section 4 as well, but these are the most specific.

#### Blast it Tom!

##### Well-Known Member
TRF Supporter
There is a facility requirement for the manufacturing license as well, isn't there? That is what shut me off to the idea. You can't build in your garage these days.

I already build these in a dedicated facility
View attachment 453409

If I started building motors as well, the neighbors will start to worry....
Whoa, whoa, hold on a minute! You build that Jeepy-looking thing? Ok, "T" the thread, motor discussion to research and let's talk about that truck for a sec!

##### I don't do spirals
TRF Supporter
Whoa, whoa, hold on a minute! You build that Jeepy-looking thing? Ok, "T" the thread, motor discussion to research and let's talk about that truck for a sec!

2006 Toyota XCD-10, 4 wheel steering, on-board air inflate/deflate of tires, Turbo-diesel intercooled, ex-Japanese self-defense forces vehicle.

Toyota Megacruiser. No joke. (see Wiki)

My "real" job is importing Japanese vehicles, the stranger, the better.

Last edited:

#### Blast it Tom!

##### Well-Known Member
TRF Supporter
I have six acres of land, and most of it is pretty steep hillside. My son keeps saying that I should get a side-by-side to get the firewood wood down off the hill. I'd bet I'd never be able to afford something like that, but I'd also bet I wouldn't get stuck if I played it smart! Holy sa-mokes! (as my wife would say!)

#### CPUTommy

##### Thrust cures All
If you need someone to test your motors I have no problem reimbursing you for the "cost"

A few more flyers with that .otor won't hurt ?

Tom